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Age 65 Rule Dec 13, 2007: Age 60 is now 65

 

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Old 03-03-2007, 12:23 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Life Span vs. Retirement Age

Life Span vs. Age at Retirement

The pension funds in many large corporations (e.g., Boeing, Lockheed Martin, AT&T, Lucent Technologies, etc.) have been "Over Funded" because many "late retirees" who keep-on working into their old age and retire late after the age of 65 tend to die within two years after their retirements. In other words, many of these late retirees do not live long enough to collect all their fair shares of pension money such that they leave a lot of extra-unused money in the pension funds resulting in the over-funded pension funds. Dr. Ephrem (Siao Chung) Cheng provided the important results in the following Table 1 and the associated chart from an actuarial study of life span vs. age at retirement. The study was based on the number of pension checks sent to retirees of Boeing Aerospace.

Table 1 - Actuarial Study of life span vs. age at retirement.

Age at Retirement Average Age at death

49.9 86

51.2 85.3

52.5 84.6

53.8 83.9

55.1 83.2

56.4 82.5

57.2 81.4

58.3 80

59.2 78.5

60.1 76.8

61.0 74.5

62.1 71.8

63.1 69.3

64.1 67.9

65.2 66.8



Table 1 and the chart indicate that for people retired at the age of 50, their average life span is 86; whereas for people retired at the age of 65, their average life span is only 66.8. An important conclusion from nds. Dr. Ephrem (Siao Chung) Cheng provided the important results in the this study is that for every year one works beyond age 55, one loses 2 years of life span on average.

The Boeing experience is that employees retiring at age of 65 receive pension checks for only 18 months, on average, prior to death. Similarly, the Lockheed experience is that employees retiring at age of

65 receive pension checks for only 17 months, on average, prior to death. Dr. David T. Chai indicated that the Bell Labs experience is similar to those of Boeing and Lockheed based on the casual observation from the Newsletters of Bell Lab retirees. A retiree from Ford Motor told Dr. Paul Tien-Lin Ho that the experience from Ford Motor is also similar to those in Boeing and Lockheed.

The statistics shown in the Pre-Retirement Seminar in Telcordia(Bellcore) indicates that the average age that Telcordia (Bellcore) employees start retirement is 57. Therefore, people who retire at the age of 65 or older are minority as compared to the number of early retirees.

The hard-working late retirees probably put too much stress on their aging body-and-mind such that they are so stressed out to develop various serious health problems that forced them to quit and retire. With such long-term stress-induced serious health problems, they die within two years after they quit and retire.

On the other hand, people who take early retirements at the age of 55 tend to live long and well into their 80s and beyond. These earlier retirees probably are either wealthier or more able to plan and manage their various aspects of their life, health and career well such that they can afford to retire early and comfortably.

These early retirees are not really idling after their early retirements to get old. They still continue doing some work. But they do the work on the part-time basis at a more leisure pace so that they do not get too stressed out. Furthermore, they have the luxury to pick and chose the types of part-time work of real interest to them so that they can enjoy and love doing that "fun" work at a more leisure pace.

The late retirees are small in number, tend to die quickly after retirement and disappear from the population of old people beyond the age of 70. Late retirees, therefore, have very little weight on the statistical average life expectancy of the population of "old people" dominated by the early retirees.
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Old 03-03-2007, 01:54 PM   #2 (permalink)
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My father retired at 67 died at 86. A lot of b.s.
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Old 03-03-2007, 03:04 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Cheng provided the important results in the this study is that for every year one works beyond age 55, one loses 2 years of life span on average.
There are other reasons for this.

For example, someone who retires at 50 vs. 65 was probably more successful in life and probably has more money. Better health care. But I certainly agree that retiring at a later age can have an affect on your overall lifespan.


I think it is very interesting that companies like Lockheed and Boeing have overfunded pensions because their workers are working longer and not collecting their benefits. Could this be the reason why airlines want age 60 changed? So fewer people can work at their company over a period of time to collect retirement benefits. And the one's that do will have less money to collect.

I personally do not want to be flying for an airline at age 60.

We should all be trying to retire as EARLY as possible, not as late as possible!!!
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Old 03-03-2007, 04:19 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fogey View Post
My father retired at 67 died at 86. A lot of b.s.
Fogey

Of course, because one data point disproves averages...

people on this forum have been called morons for much less.
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Old 03-03-2007, 04:30 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default early retirement

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Originally Posted by ryane946 View Post

We should all be trying to retire as EARLY as possible, not as late as possible!!!
That is something we all dream of from the start, but few ever achieve. Changing companies every three or four years puts a crimp in those retirement plans.
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Old 03-03-2007, 07:37 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Statistics have a way of being massaged and manipulated to get almost any desired result. I've seen stats that make some incredible claims. In a court of law, testimony and evidence from statisticians quite often reveal two "truths" and sometimes they are diametrically opposed to each other!

My father was going to retire at 71, but he passed away before he could do so.
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Old 03-05-2007, 10:03 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryane946 View Post
There are other reasons for this.

For example, someone who retires at 50 vs. 65 was probably more successful in life and probably has more money. Better health care. But I certainly agree that retiring at a later age can have an affect on your overall lifespan.


I think it is very interesting that companies like Lockheed and Boeing have overfunded pensions because their workers are working longer and not collecting their benefits. Could this be the reason why airlines want age 60 changed? So fewer people can work at their company over a period of time to collect retirement benefits. And the one's that do will have less money to collect.

I personally do not want to be flying for an airline at age 60.

We should all be trying to retire as EARLY as possible, not as late as possible!!!
how old are you? like 21? maybe you should work a little before you think of hanging up the skates
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Old 03-05-2007, 12:32 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Talking Just a guess !!!!

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Originally Posted by HotMamaPilot View Post
how old are you? like 21? maybe you should work a little before you think of hanging up the skates
Hmmm. I'd be willing to bet my next paycheck we'll never find out for sure, but with his rhetoric I'd hazard a guess he's about three and a half, still playing in the sand box.

Last edited by ATlineholder; 03-05-2007 at 04:31 PM.
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Old 03-07-2007, 09:28 PM   #9 (permalink)
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This depends on the job. A pilot isn't exactly working all day standing up in a mine shaft.
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Old 03-07-2007, 10:16 PM   #10 (permalink)
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What a coincidence that you mention working in a mine shaft. Tonight, I returned from the Seattle Repertory Theater's production of "Fire on the Mountain," a musical very much like "It Ain't Nothin' But the Blues." Throughout the entire 90 minutes, I thought of how similar a coal miner is to a pilot in today's world of aviation.

"Fire on the Mountain" is composed of ballads covering romance, history, humor, work, pay, tragedy, religion, and even unions, strikes and scabs. The message and stories contained in these ballads make reference to the same things being discussed so heatedly and passionately on these forums. The set was absolutely beautiful, and dominated by a large sign that once appeared at the entrance of a real mine in Eastern Kentucky. It said "Be careful today, Be alive tomorrow."

Another memorable line came from Charles Bevel who sang about how the miners were "white, Negroes, Slavs," but it did not matter "because at the end of the day, we all look the same anyway." I have said more than once here - It does not matter what uniform you wear or whether the tail of your employer's plane is a purple color or has an Eskimo on it. At the end of the day, you are all pilots, with the same dreams and aspirations, and you ought to work together for a greater good. The final ballad of the night was titled "They'll Never Keep Us Down."

Sorry for the thread drift.
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