eaglefly

The "four party agreement" really isn't controlling the present batch of AE flows (AKA the "824" pilots). Yes, they were awarded flow-thru opportunities via an arbitration award pursuant to that agreement, but they are a byproduct of it, not something the APA is truly involved in. They come over just like any other street pilot except for vacation accrual and have their own flow rate mechanism not stipulated in the former Supplement W.

I think the majority felt this way, but a minority did not. Those not flowing wanted as much flying from wherever as Eagle (now Envoy) could get and a small percentage of senior F/O's were miffed they got stiffed out of their upgrade (or so they believed).

Agreed on a lot of this. One one hand, AE flows are vetted by AA more then any street hire as they have extensive info on their training performance, attitude, attendance and personality acquired over years or even decades vs. a street hire they have to judge with limited PRIA, FAA and a couple of hours of interaction. On the other hand, even if a specific flow is marginal in some or all those areas, they still get to swing the bat at AA and if their training is as least satisfactory, they make it to the line. Some flows simply wouldn't be selected street hire style though and that is the reality, but like you said, some pilots are good at playing the interview game and end up being less then desirable people to share a cockpit wiith, especially over time as the years roll by. The airline pilot business has always had a strong component of luck which can be good or not so good depending upon the person or more accurately, the personality.

QuagmireGiggity

Yeah, I remember that minority all too well.
Embarrassing. It only took a handful of vocal idiots to make us all look bad.
Either way I understand the non -pro -flow -through groups sentiment. Some people would still get hired on their own and some shouldn't be hired for sure.

dash8

this is also now true for the pdt flows (and the psa "pref interviews")

and to a previous post about why some people wouldn't just try ots instead of waiting for the flow (and in support of your point) , some people just don't interview well and are more than perfectly capable crewmembers. where some people could be very good schmoozers in an interview situation, but bad sticks and don't play well with others.

eaglefly

Yes, that is the reality. In a previous life, I was the interviewer for a market research firm and not unlike dating websites, people put on a "face" in certain situations to present that which they want to convey to achieve a goal (in this case, a job offer), when in reality it is not the real person within. Some people can do this quite effectively. At both Eagle and AA, I've flown with people who normally would have made me scratch my head about how they made it through the interview process, but then again, I understand its flaws. None of us are perfect of course and so far at AA. I've not yet felt compelled to figure out how to put someone on my "do not pair" request, so it hasn't been bad at all, but then again, it takes A LOT to push my buttons to that point. I know of a couple of my flow counterparts who have had run-in's with captains I was able to fly with.

Let's face it..........this profession is filled to the brim with alpha males with minimal tact and a tendancy to shoot from the hip and that has nothing to do with physically flying an aircraft. Being an effective pilot (especially a captain) is as much about personality as about airmanship.

TOGAANG

Does anyone know how AA decides who to call first for training in a new hire class? My group has 17 of us and I know we won't all get called for the same class so I'm just wondering how they decide who to call first.
Thanks.

C5Quest

What group are you in?

TOGAANG

Second interview group in Jan.

C5Quest

17? That's a big group. We had ten in the first Jan group

TOGAANG

Yes but I know two for sure that have moved on to DAL and UAL. I'm sure there are a couple more too.

Hopefully this month the rest of the Octobet guys get emails for September classes. With a little luck maybe they will even get to your group.

C5Quest

I hope so. Has anyone from Oct got called yet?