SO - Where's the SLI?
08-29-2016, 10:42 AM
#1781
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 139
Originally Posted by Vendetta
I will refrain from writing anything of substance or reason since I know you will reject the truth in any form. I'll make it into a negative tone that you guys respond to better. The facts are is you have better expectations than you ever could have flying for Mesa, Wien, Ansett, America west ect ... You are part of a major airline for the first time in your life be very thankful to be here. In a few short years you can bid other aircraft and bases. I promise you the nic is gone and no I won't prove it to you, but I will be sure to remind you the day the list comes out.
08-29-2016, 11:05 AM
#1782
Weekend workaholic
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 CA
Posts: 669
Originally Posted by BlaineFaban
In short, the West gets a windfall no matter the outcome of the SLI. Just by being included in ANY merger, they win. Bringing PHX to the table in SWA domain is like bringing 1 solo cup to an all frat campus keg party.
08-29-2016, 11:20 AM
#1784
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Position: A330
Posts: 173
Originally Posted by flyinawa
Thank you, Blaine. You clearly bring a tremendous wealth of useful insight to this discussion.
08-29-2016, 12:53 PM
#1785
Weekend workaholic
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 CA
Posts: 669
Originally Posted by BlaineFaban
Bluntness is important. It isn't personal. Everything I typed is correct. the truth sometimes stings a bit, but it is still the truth.
Originally Posted by Vendetta
Atleast he's honest, america west was an airline you went too after flying the Cessna 402 on canyon tours. You will still have all the attrition and hubs you brought to the merger( hint only Phoenix).
08-29-2016, 01:08 PM
#1786
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2012
Posts: 370
Originally Posted by BlaineFaban
In short, the West gets a windfall no matter the outcome of the SLI. Just by being included in ANY merger, they win. Bringing PHX to the table in SWA domain is like bringing 1 solo cup to an all frat campus keg party.
08-29-2016, 01:15 PM
#1787
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,967
Originally Posted by beancounter
Pleeeaase dude, put down the crack pipe. When I was hired by AWA in 04' they were one of about 3 hiring and I was thankful to get on, it was competitive. American, US Airways, Delta, Alaska, etc. hired ZERO in 04'. Nobody would have wanted to go to US even if they were hiring. Now American.... that would be a different story.
"..hired by AWA in '04.."
Really, truth is funnier than fiction. You can't make this stuff up.
08-29-2016, 01:34 PM
#1788
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,967
Adios to Kirby... UAL is getting a very talented President.
For old time sake... the one dressed in costume at the executive Halloween party, purple tights, a skirt (tutu), bra, school girl heels, and purple hair.
If you click the link, you cannot un-see it. You just can't.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qi3XZRepfeU
For old time sake... the one dressed in costume at the executive Halloween party, purple tights, a skirt (tutu), bra, school girl heels, and purple hair.
If you click the link, you cannot un-see it. You just can't.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qi3XZRepfeU
Last edited by PurpleTurtle; 08-29-2016 at 01:44 PM.
08-29-2016, 01:51 PM
#1789
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2015
Posts: 431
Originally Posted by beancounter
Pleeeaase dude, put down the crack pipe. When I was hired by AWA in 04' they were one of about 3 hiring and I was thankful to get on, it was competitive. American, US Airways, Delta, Alaska, etc. hired ZERO in 04'. Nobody would have wanted to go to US even if they were hiring. Now American.... that would be a different story.
Not to bring you into this debate and not meaning this post to be directed directly at you, no one would do any different than you did in 04. And for that matter it's no different for any other pilot who got hired at any other time at AWA.
The point is not AWA and its pilots were (are) any better or any worse than any other airline or pilot group. Pilots are pilots.
What is different and what WD won't acknowledge is that these mergers are bringing about opportunities that didn't exist when you or they were hired. That's the entire point he can't admit to.
All three groups get new opportunities but none of the other two get as many as the West.
His complaint about stagnation applies to every pilot group that ever lived. Your example illustrates while every other airline was stagnated in 04 AWA was growing. Stagnation happens to everyone employed at an airline at some point.
He mentions how the East pilots have caused PHX to be stagnated after the announced merger. First off. Pilots don't determine the size of our pilot bases, management does.
This is the same management team stagnating PHX that stagnated (closed) PIT, BOS, LGA. How stagnated do you think the East pilots based at those bases feel compared to shrinking PHX?
WD needs to look at the height of East pilots on their seniority list and compare that with what they have today. Do the same with West and see which group has the largest percentage decrease. That's stagnation isn't it?
What about the largest percentage of pilots being furloughed? That tells a story of stagnation.
What's the longest time to Captain upgrade West has had? Compare that to 26 years at US and 23 at AA. That's stagnation isn't it?
Even Vendetta said that 95% of the pilots at PHX are good guys. It's not about that. It's about this constant sulking coming from PHX about their horrible mistreatment and stagnation.
They have not seen anywhere near the stagnation East and LAA pilots experienced.
Everyone of these three groups has seen shrinkage and stagnation over the past 15 years.
WD and others (JohnS) need to quit this constant portrayal of the battered syndrome child. It's making your group look like a bunch of spoiled kids.
Everyone has faced stagnation, but it eventually ends and soon it will end in PHX.
WD, JohnS and others need to quit the whining and just admit it's not just about stagnation (which we all have endured) it's about not having the ability to reap the rewards of these integrations. The rewards that never existed for West pilots and the rewards WD and others won't publicly acknowledge.
It's not about the NIC list it's about access to aircraft, positions and routes they would otherwise never have been able to acquire.
If you don't think that is true then answer this. If George Nicolau had awarded the exact same seniority integrated list but with the stipulation no PHX based pilot could bid outside of PHX and no CLT, DCA or PHL pilot from the East could bid PHX would the West pilots be as concerned about implementing the NIC list?
Once again, not directed at you but at what seems to be a lack of ability of many like WD to admit good things will come out of this merger. NIC or no NIC.
08-29-2016, 02:21 PM
#1790
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Position: A330
Posts: 173
Originally Posted by Upsddown
Beancounter,
Not to bring you into this debate and not meaning this post to be directed directly at you, no one would do any different than you did in 04. And for that matter it's no different for any other pilot who got hired at any other time at AWA.
The point is not AWA and its pilots were (are) any better or any worse than any other airline or pilot group. Pilots are pilots.
What is different and what WD won't acknowledge is that these mergers are bringing about opportunities that didn't exist when you or they were hired. That's the entire point he can't admit to.
All three groups get new opportunities but none of the other two get as many as the West.
His complaint about stagnation applies to every pilot group that ever lived. Your example illustrates while every other airline was stagnated in 04 AWA was growing. Stagnation happens to everyone employed at an airline at some point.
He mentions how the East pilots have caused PHX to be stagnated after the announced merger. First off. Pilots don't determine the size of our pilot bases, management does.
This is the same management team stagnating PHX that stagnated (closed) PIT, BOS, LGA. How stagnated do you think the East pilots based at those bases feel compared to shrinking PHX?
WD needs to look at the height of East pilots on their seniority list and compare that with what they have today. Do the same with West and see which group has the largest percentage decrease. That's stagnation isn't it?
What about the largest percentage of pilots being furloughed? That tells a story of stagnation.
What's the longest time to Captain upgrade West has had? Compare that to 26 years at US and 23 at AA. That's stagnation isn't it?
Even Vendetta said that 95% of the pilots at PHX are good guys. It's not about that. It's about this constant sulking coming from PHX about their horrible mistreatment and stagnation.
They have not seen anywhere near the stagnation East and LAA pilots experienced.
Everyone of these three groups has seen shrinkage and stagnation over the past 15 years.
WD and others (JohnS) need to quit this constant portrayal of the battered syndrome child. It's making your group look like a bunch of spoiled kids.
Everyone has faced stagnation, but it eventually ends and soon it will end in PHX.
WD, JohnS and others need to quit the whining and just admit it's not just about stagnation (which we all have endured) it's about not having the ability to reap the rewards of these integrations. The rewards that never existed for West pilots and the rewards WD and others won't publicly acknowledge.
It's not about the NIC list it's about access to aircraft, positions and routes they would otherwise never have been able to acquire.
If you don't think that is true then answer this. If George Nicolau had awarded the exact same seniority integrated list but with the stipulation no PHX based pilot could bid outside of PHX and no CLT, DCA or PHL pilot from the East could bid PHX would the West pilots be as concerned about implementing the NIC list?
Once again, not directed at you but at what seems to be a lack of ability of many like WD to admit good things will come out of this merger. NIC or no NIC.
Not to bring you into this debate and not meaning this post to be directed directly at you, no one would do any different than you did in 04. And for that matter it's no different for any other pilot who got hired at any other time at AWA.
The point is not AWA and its pilots were (are) any better or any worse than any other airline or pilot group. Pilots are pilots.
What is different and what WD won't acknowledge is that these mergers are bringing about opportunities that didn't exist when you or they were hired. That's the entire point he can't admit to.
All three groups get new opportunities but none of the other two get as many as the West.
His complaint about stagnation applies to every pilot group that ever lived. Your example illustrates while every other airline was stagnated in 04 AWA was growing. Stagnation happens to everyone employed at an airline at some point.
He mentions how the East pilots have caused PHX to be stagnated after the announced merger. First off. Pilots don't determine the size of our pilot bases, management does.
This is the same management team stagnating PHX that stagnated (closed) PIT, BOS, LGA. How stagnated do you think the East pilots based at those bases feel compared to shrinking PHX?
WD needs to look at the height of East pilots on their seniority list and compare that with what they have today. Do the same with West and see which group has the largest percentage decrease. That's stagnation isn't it?
What about the largest percentage of pilots being furloughed? That tells a story of stagnation.
What's the longest time to Captain upgrade West has had? Compare that to 26 years at US and 23 at AA. That's stagnation isn't it?
Even Vendetta said that 95% of the pilots at PHX are good guys. It's not about that. It's about this constant sulking coming from PHX about their horrible mistreatment and stagnation.
They have not seen anywhere near the stagnation East and LAA pilots experienced.
Everyone of these three groups has seen shrinkage and stagnation over the past 15 years.
WD and others (JohnS) need to quit this constant portrayal of the battered syndrome child. It's making your group look like a bunch of spoiled kids.
Everyone has faced stagnation, but it eventually ends and soon it will end in PHX.
WD, JohnS and others need to quit the whining and just admit it's not just about stagnation (which we all have endured) it's about not having the ability to reap the rewards of these integrations. The rewards that never existed for West pilots and the rewards WD and others won't publicly acknowledge.
It's not about the NIC list it's about access to aircraft, positions and routes they would otherwise never have been able to acquire.
If you don't think that is true then answer this. If George Nicolau had awarded the exact same seniority integrated list but with the stipulation no PHX based pilot could bid outside of PHX and no CLT, DCA or PHL pilot from the East could bid PHX would the West pilots be as concerned about implementing the NIC list?
Once again, not directed at you but at what seems to be a lack of ability of many like WD to admit good things will come out of this merger. NIC or no NIC.
If anything We should be upset it took longer for us to upgrade since they had to take our flying. Not even a Thank You.
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