Airline Pilot Forums

Hey guys....heard through the gravpevine that the US Military King Air 200's have a MTOW of over 15000 Lbs. And that they restricted it to 12500 for civilian use to keep it from needing a type rating (cheaper operating costs)

Any truth to this?

The military C-12's had the larger engine and 4-bladed props before the civilian B200's did. In CONUS, they operated up to 12,500. Outside of CONUS (not limited by FAA type certificate limitations) they operated over 12,500, but not over 15,000. At least that's how it was until the mid-90's when we gave them away to the Army. Don't know what the Army did with them.

The military C-12's had the larger engine and 4-bladed props before the civilian B200's did. In CONUS, they operated up to 12,500. Outside of CONUS (not limited by FAA type certificate limitations) they operated over 12,500, but not over 15,000. At least that's how it was until the mid-90's when we gave them away to the Army. Don't know what the Army did with them.

The Army C-12's were operated at various weights, all over 12,500 lbs. We used the NATOPS performance charts from the Navy until we included the weight increase in our operating manuals. Depending on the series, Army C-12's were limited by landing weight, flight above 10,000 feet, duration of flight and a few other limitations all designed to increase useful load. The newer C-12's were bought with provisions for flight over 12,500 lbs. as part of the acquision.

The former USAF C-12F's were operated at 14,500 by the Army as soon as we got them (95-96). The RC-12's are a different story, they are a hybrid aircraft designed for the mission, and some of those will go well over 16,000.

Anyway, that's the way it was up until a few years ago.

I'm currently flying UC-12/M's out of GTMO. Our operational weight is limited to 13.5K.

In the Army it depends on what model your flying. The max takeoff weight for any C-12 is 14000.

I only flew C12s during the fixed wing course as I was a C23 guy. We all tried to get the type rating but the FAA had already cracked down on it. You will hear of guys who got typed straight away back in the day.

The Army does not care about any of that anyway. They fly the single pilot plane with two pilots as a standard mostly, at least for normal pax missions.

I'm heading to the MSP FSDO soon with my Army flight records and a copy of the Airworthiness Release stating the Army can fly C-12s up to 14000 lbs. I just want the type rating for the heck of it.

Off subject but for any Blackhawk pilots out there the FAA is now issuing a type rating, S-70, for all models of UH-60s. Alas my last flight was in 2007. You must have 10 hours in type within 12 months to get any type rating for military pilots.

I'm currently flying UC-12/M's out of GTMO. Our operational weight is limited to 13.5K.

Both the UC-12s/TC-12s I have flown CONUS max out at 13.5K.

FlyBoyd

Can't send IM yets, I'm taking it your at VT-35....

I flew Air Force C-12Fs at Osan, Korea in 95-96, just before they got rid of them and got C-12Js (Beech 1900 commuters). They had four-bladed props and 850 HP engines, and were certified to 14,000 lbs. Because we did have the over 12,500 lb weight I heard about guys getting their ATP in the SIM when we got trained at Flight Safety in Wichita. I believe they were actually awarded King Air 350 type ratings since, as you mentioned, the civilian King Air 200 is limited to 12,500 lb and therefore is not a type-rated aircraft. I really enjoyed flying the C-12F...it was a great little plane. We flew all over Korea and also flew to Japan. It actually had a LORAN for overwater flying--remember those?

Hope this helps...

FlyBoyd

Can't send IM yets, I'm taking it your at VT-35....


Yes...for 261 more days. Then I have to get a real job.

I flew Air Force C-12Fs at Osan, Korea in 95-96, just before they got rid of them and got C-12Js (Beech 1900 commuters). They had four-bladed props and 850 HP engines, and were certified to 14,000 lbs. Because we did have the over 12,500 lb weight I heard about guys getting their ATP in the SIM when we got trained at Flight Safety in Wichita. I believe they were actually awarded King Air 350 type ratings since, as you mentioned, the civilian King Air 200 is limited to 12,500 lb and therefore is not a type-rated aircraft. I really enjoyed flying the C-12F...it was a great little plane. We flew all over Korea and also flew to Japan. It actually had a LORAN for overwater flying--remember those?

Hope this helps...
Extreme long shot here.....but you do you happen to remember a blonde haired woman who was flying the C-12s during that same timeframe who had come from the C-5 community?

USMCFLYR

Extreme long shot here.....but you do you happen to remember a blonde haired woman who was flying the C-12s during that same timeframe who had come from the C-5 community?

USMCFLYR

I know the question was not directed at me, but ... I flew C-12's at Ramstein in the early - mid 90's.

Does the girl you are talking about have initials T.A.? If so, you can PM me. If not, please ignore my intrusion into the conversation. :p

I know the question was not directed at me, but ... I flew C-12's at Ramstein in the early - mid 90's.

Does the girl you are talking about have initials T.A.? If so, you can PM me. If not, please ignore my intrusion into the conversation. :p
I honestly can't remember her name at all - including initials.
I only remember the lady because she seemed to be flying our squadron around quite a bit during the Jan-Jul 05 UDP and I remember her prior community because she was the first female C-5 that I had met at the time.

USMCFLYR

You must have 10 hours in type within 12 months to get any type rating for military pilots.

12 month restriction no longer applies, you can go back as far as you want in your military records and apply for any type rating and/or certificate. reference is FAR 61.73

12 month restriction no longer applies, you can go back as far as you want in your military records and apply for any type rating and/or certificate. reference is FAR 61.73

Thanks you very much for this info. you can get a type even though you are no longer current in it?

TC-12s at NAS Corpus got me a BE-200 type rating after completing UPT.

The civilian world is finally catching up. Check into the HALO stc's from Centex Aero in Waco, Tx. I still haven't heard what the FAA plans to do for pilot certification.

tc-12s at nas corpus got me a be-200 type rating after completing upt.

..........+1

The civilian world is finally catching up. Check into the HALO stc's from Centex Aero in Waco, Tx. I still haven't heard what the FAA plans to do for pilot certification.

Has this Centex/Halo GW increase STC actually been approved yet? I first heard about it approx 3 years ago..... they were "working on it" way back then, and said - even back then - that it would be available "soon". I think it is still not actually approved yet ......... wonder what the hold up is. Anyone have any idea what the approx cost will be? As far as getting the BE-200 Type Rating, there are some FAA guys who can give that Type Rating ride; I had one FAA guy tell me he could do it for me if/when I needed it. But I don't think any of the sim training organizations have an approved Part 142 program for it yet, so I'm pretty sure you'd have to get the Type Rating via an FAA ride.

Off subject but for any Blackhawk pilots out there the FAA is now issuing a type rating, S-70, for all models of UH-60s. Alas my last flight was in 2007. You must have 10 hours in type within 12 months to get any type rating for military pilots.


Which FSDO is this through? We heard a rumor in New York (Albany FSDO) but understood no change was official.

Also, 61.73 doesn't reference the 10 hours in 12 months, but I can't find an old FAR to see if it used to. Unbelieveably, all the FARs here at work are current.

Edit: just called the FSDO. S-70 type is official. However, the 10-hour rule is not in the FARs, but in FAA order 8900.1 which governs the issuance of types. The latest they have (and we found on the FAA site) is 2007 which still requires the 10 hours. If anybody has newer info please post.