Airline Pilot Forums

Can anyone show evidence that an expired written will be allowed to be used for a practical exam. My training director says I probably need to retake it but I have seen reports of folks using an expired written even after furlough at a 121 operation. Mine was taken and expired before I was hired into 121. Anyone know a definitive answer on this?:confused:

There's differing opinions on this subject but it all depends on the FSDO where you're located.

Some guys I know didn't need to retake it while others were asked to retake it.

Can anyone show evidence that an expired written will be allowed to be used for a practical exam. My training director says I probably need to retake it but I have seen reports of folks using an expired written even after furlough at a 121 operation. Mine was taken and expired before I was hired into 121. Anyone know a definitive answer on this?:confused:

It depends on the FAA office where your airline's certificate is managed. XJET has already received approval for this from the Atlanta CMO.

Our carrier put out a memo a few weeks ago saying an expired written is now allowed for our FO's per an FAA exemption.

I believe expired is now allowed at SKW, but that was not the case at first.

PNCL got a waiver from the MEM FSDO

I'm over at RAH. I guess the Indy FSDO then. I recall seeing that some bill would allow us to not have to retake but I think there was some language as to something like 'said pilot must take a upgrade course' or something like that. RAH (cheap F'ers) isn't giving us any ground training just an extra day in the sim at this point so maybe that's why we haven't been given that waver. I have heard that several regional's like AE are giving substantial training for it. Maybe a AE guy could confirm that. What are you guys companies doing? Ours are just about to start doing the atp practicals here so those poor guys get to be the RAH guni pigs with the Feds watching over the whole process. What a $hit show.

61.39 (b) should have your answer.....

I took my first type ride and ATP with an expired exam.

I found this in some archives on google. "CRJDriver
10-02-2009, 02:29 PM
There seems to be a lot of confusion and different interpretations of the regulations regarding the ATP written. First, you ATP written expires after 24 calendar months. Period. It doesn't un-expire or anything! However, the regulations state: “Is employed as a flight crewmember by a certificate holder under part 121, 125, or 135 of this chapter at the time of the practical test.” The part that confused me and thought would make me ineligible is the “and has satisfactorily accomplished that operator's approved”, in this case when I would upgrade to Captain at my regional.

My ATP Written expired in March and I wanted to get my ATP in April, Pt. 61 at a local FBO. I did some research and talked to the DPE and called my local FSDO to confirm and see if I can use my expired written exam or if I would have to re-take it. After about a week of waiting and the FSDO confirming with OKC, I got the green light from the FSDO and my DPE and was told I was good to go, as long as I have a seniority number on file with my airline, I am still considered to be employed by a Pt. 121 carrier.

The issue you will run into is with IACRA. The system will reject your expired written exam. Luckily my DPE knew what he was doing and had dealt with this before. Instead of using IACRA, we completed a paper 8710, attached a copy of my furlough letter and my expired ATP written. It will definitely help if you have a DPE that knows what he is doing. I thoroughly researched this before I started my ATP and wanted confirmation from the FAA in OKC. So, it can be done if you have it all together, do some research and know what you are doing. I’ve heard some stories of regional FOs going to ALLATPs and trying to do this and got denied. I don’t know why? I really didn’t want to re-take that stupid test, as I though it was actually the hardest and most time consuming part of the whole process of getting the ATP. If you do have to re-take it or need to take the ATP written, I highly recommend the Sheppard Air program ($75). It is the same thing as the ATP program, but you won't pay $300 and you can study on your computer at your own pace."

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It seems there are several interpretations. I hope they get this figured out at my company. I would hate to have to deal with that written again.

Not sure how it will affect you since it was expired before you were hired.

I can tell you Eagle also got an exemption and people are allowed to use expired writtens for their type rides.

Had to retake it for Comair 2 months ago.

I took my ATP written last year for the 3rd time. The first time, I flunked it (68% or something). Studied up for another month, and then passed with a 88%. Didn't have the money to take the checkride before it expired, and it expired... I got hired to work for a 141 flight school that has a 135 gig on the side, and I took the ATP for the 3rd time and passed. It was nearly a year later that I finally got the opportunity to do my ATP checkride. I have my ASEL ATP and will do my AMEL ATP fairly soon. If you are working for a 121 or 135 operator, your written will not expire as long as you work there. Once you leave or quit, then it can expire at that point. My recommendation is get the hours in ASAP and take the checkride ASAP! That test is murder on the brain!

FAA Exemtion 10556, granted 6/8/2012

I took my ATP written last year for the 3rd time. The first time, I flunked it (68% or something). Studied up for another month, and then passed with a 88%. Didn't have the money to take the checkride before it expired, and it expired... I got hired to work for a 141 flight school that has a 135 gig on the side, and I took the ATP for the 3rd time and passed. It was nearly a year later that I finally got the opportunity to do my ATP checkride. I have my ASEL ATP and will do my AMEL ATP fairly soon. If you are working for a 121 or 135 operator, your written will not expire as long as you work there. Once you leave or quit, then it can expire at that point. My recommendation is get the hours in ASAP and take the checkride ASAP! That test is murder on the brain!

This is somewhat true. I took my ATP written in March 2008 and was hired at Pinnacle 2 weeks later. I left in December 2011 for my current job and because I was hired at a 135 and placed in their training program, I did not have to retake my written before getting my ATP and type rating. The FAR says nothing about being "continuously employed," so even if you leave one job for another your written may still be valid.

I took my ATP written last year for the 3rd time. The first time, I flunked it (68% or something). Studied up for another month, and then passed with a 88%. Didn't have the money to take the checkride before it expired, and it expired... I got hired to work for a 141 flight school that has a 135 gig on the side, and I took the ATP for the 3rd time and passed. It was nearly a year later that I finally got the opportunity to do my ATP checkride. I have my ASEL ATP and will do my AMEL ATP fairly soon. If you are working for a 121 or 135 operator, your written will not expire as long as you work there. Once you leave or quit, then it can expire at that point. My recommendation is get the hours in ASAP and take the checkride ASAP! That test is murder on the brain!


Not exactly correct. ATP writtens expire after 24 months, period.

The FARs allow you to use an expired written for an ATP checkride if that checkride is conducted at a 121, 125, or 135 (or military) operation and you completed their approved PIC qualification program.

Nowhere does it say you have to be continuously employed, employed by the same airline, etc. You just have to be employed when you take the checkride and complete their PIC program. What you do before that (or for how long) is irrelevant.

An ATP should be a requirement to get an Airline job in the first place.