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Old 09-20-2014, 09:14 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by rickair7777 View Post
Essentially all schools and private employers have bans on weapons possession, either because they believe anti-gun crap, pander to those who do, or for liability reasons (ie their insurance requires it).
This is such B.S. Schools have legal laws prohibiting but all private employers do not necessarily have such bans. If they do, it would be an employment issue as an "employee". Further, renting an airplane at an FBO makes you a "customer" no different than ordering a cappuccino at Starbucks.

My beliefs are, in accordance with federal and state laws (various types of concealed carry), then be your own man and do what you feel you need to do. It's your constitutional right and, if done reasonably and responsibly, you should have no problems.

I don't bet my own or my family's safety on the liberal gun control beliefs of others. Let me preface - if you carry into a federal building, a police station, courtroom, school, etc, and are caught - then penalties will be felt.

But if visiting a private business that morally objects to concealed carry (restaurant or supermarket for example) - then I say them be damned. Either don't patronize the business or carry in there anyway. As far as I'm concerned, they'll never know I'm carrying unless there's a life or death situation, and if I live, I'll be damned if I care about their moral code.
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Old 09-21-2014, 05:45 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by sandlapper223 View Post
This is such B.S. Schools have legal laws prohibiting but all private employers do not necessarily have such bans. If they do, it would be an employment issue as an "employee". Further, renting an airplane at an FBO makes you a "customer" no different than ordering a cappuccino at Starbucks.

My beliefs are, in accordance with federal and state laws (various types of concealed carry), then be your own man and do what you feel you need to do. It's your constitutional right and, if done reasonably and responsibly, you should have no problems.

I don't bet my own or my family's safety on the liberal gun control beliefs of others. Let me preface - if you carry into a federal building, a police station, courtroom, school, etc, and are caught - then penalties will be felt.

But if visiting a private business that morally objects to concealed carry (restaurant or supermarket for example) - then I say them be damned. Either don't patronize the business or carry in there anyway. As far as I'm concerned, they'll never know I'm carrying unless there's a life or death situation, and if I live, I'll be damned if I care about their moral code.
Many laws now exist, in a variety of states and locales, which criminalize carrying weapons in private establishments which post a no weapons notice.

It is what it is. Professional pilots (along with many other professions) can't go around committing felonies willy-nilly...eventually it will catch up with you and end your career.

OBTW...I can usually spot a concealed carry, a knack I acquired in another profession. I assume most off-duty cops can do that too.
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Old 09-21-2014, 06:47 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by rickair7777 View Post
Many laws now exist, in a variety of states and locales, which criminalize carrying weapons in private establishments which post a no weapons notice.

It is what it is. Professional pilots (along with many other professions) can't go around committing felonies willy-nilly...eventually it will catch up with you and end your career.

OBTW...I can usually spot a concealed carry, a knack I acquired in another profession. I assume most off-duty cops can do that too.
How will there be a felony committed in the first place if the flight school does not have a 30.06 sign or 51% sign (the only two signs that prohibit CHl carry)?
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Old 09-21-2014, 06:48 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by NotPart91 View Post
In some parts of the U.S. Firearms are not frowned upon and are treated as an common implements or tools of the trade.

Btw, there is a "criminal element" that exploits GA. So I wouldn't be against being prepared.

I see no problem carrying a loaded firearm while flying, as GA is considered a "soft target."

It would be nice to see GA pilots attend an amended FFDO type course in order to get familiar with FISA areas and related laws.

Back on topic;

Here's the AOPA answer;

Transporting Firearms in General Aviation Aircraft - AOPA

Here's the Cliff Notes version;

http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/flyi...rms-guns-ammo/
Correction; I mistakenly typed FISA and meant SIDA on my original post.

The AOPA's opinion is supportive of carriage of firearms in GA with the caveat of following any state/local rules.

There are two recent landmark case, although not involving aviation, are related to the legal possession of firearms.

1) District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008) and;
2) McDonald v. City of Chicago, 561 U.S. ___, ___, 130 S. Ct. 3020, 3050 (2010)

I believe that pilots need to view this topic the same as transporting your firearm from your home, via private conveyance, to your temporary destination and back to home. The same general rules apply, and if followed, no violation will occur.

If you follow the rules, (.e.g. avoid SIDA areas, FAA facilities and airport police stations etc) IMHO you'll have no problems.

Another option not mentioned by the AOPA is a pre-flight call to the police having jurisdiction at your fuel stops or destination. This will, 99% of the time, prevent any issues. Make a note of your telephonic contact, (time/whom/what agency).

For the posts related to threats to safety and crimes at GA airports;

There have been and currently are on going activity of major, international and intrastate crimes occurring at GA airports.

There also have been instances of non-aviation criminal operations being run out of a GA hanger and most pilots are oblivious to this type of activities.

The criminal element has realized that you can't get stopped by the police @ 10,000ft per se, thus the risk of apprehension is very low.

Just another view and perspective.

Carry on.
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Old 09-21-2014, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by NotPart91 View Post
Correction; I mistakenly typed FISA and meant SIDA on my original post.

The AOPA's opinion is supportive of carriage of firearms in GA with the caveat of following any state/local rules.

There are two recent landmark case, although not involving aviation, are related to the legal possession of firearms.

1) District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008) and;
2) McDonald v. City of Chicago, 561 U.S. ___, ___, 130 S. Ct. 3020, 3050 (2010)

I believe that pilots need to view this topic the same as transporting your firearm from your home, via private conveyance, to your temporary destination and back to home. The same general rules apply, and if followed, no violation will occur.

If you follow the rules, (.e.g. avoid SIDA areas, FAA facilities and airport police stations etc) IMHO you'll have no problems.

Another option not mentioned by the AOPA is a pre-flight call to the police having jurisdiction at your fuel stops or destination. This will, 99% of the time, prevent any issues. Make a note of your telephonic contact, (time/whom/what agency).

For the posts related to threats to safety and crimes at GA airports;

There have been and currently are on going activity of major, international and intrastate crimes occurring at GA airports.

There also have been instances of non-aviation criminal operations being run out of a GA hanger and most pilots are oblivious to this type of activities.

The criminal element has realized that you can't get stopped by the police @ 10,000ft per se, thus the risk of apprehension is very low.

Just another view and perspective.

Carry on.
Good Answer, but these articles don't mention anything about renting the airplane. They are based on ownership of the airplane...
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Old 09-21-2014, 06:57 PM
  #26  
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This really isn't that hard, OP....I have created the following matrix for you.

Does the school's policy and/or terms of rental prohibit firearms on the premises or in their aircraft?

IF YES, you have your answer. If NO:

Does local ordinance prohibit firearms?

If YES, you have your answer. If NO: It is not prohibited.

Caveat emptor, and recognize there is a risk/reward proposition for an aspiring professional pilot on this issue.
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Old 09-21-2014, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by rickair7777 View Post

OBTW...I can usually spot a concealed carry, a knack I acquired in another profession. I assume most off-duty cops can do that too.
I knew that flight school can be a financial burden, but did you have to gain "other" experience by working for TSA?

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Old 09-21-2014, 07:05 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by NotPart91 View Post
I knew that flight school can be a financial burden, but did you have to gain "other" experience by working for TSA?

Not exactly. More OCONUS.
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Old 09-21-2014, 08:06 PM
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Any experienced aviation HR Dept. can tell you; DUI is the most common saboteur of a flying career with firearms violations a close second, or getting caught peeing in the wrong place at the wrong time.
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Old 09-22-2014, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by KF5OVP View Post
I am time building for my Commercial License. I also have a CHL. Since I fly with safety pilots, other people, etc. , I feel the need is there to carry my gun for safety. I have called the FSDO, and they have told me I am legal as long as I'm licensed in the states I'm flying in. Any stories,advice, or expierences?
You should really find different people to fly with!
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