Cubdriver

What Rick said, plus I think there should be some sort of PRIA cleanup program like some airlines use with their strike systems. A trainee screws something up and earns a strike, but they can remove a strike through a decent performance next time. Take a 6 month PC smoothly, for example and get a point scrubbed off the list. People apply for airlines having no idea what they are getting into, they hook a training event and that's it, their done. That's not good for either the pilot or for industry, and the fact of the matter is people are not rigid in general aptitude and competence. They can change through additional learning experiences and may reach a point where they are adequate to the task. At one time there was a rolling PRIA window, but now it apparently lasts forever.

outaluckagain

Not only rolling, but a short roll would be best. The entire idea of the pilot having to carry a bad mark in their record for the rest of their lives is just plain wrong IMHO.

Some things take time for people to learn, and I have seen first hand how some people who seem to be deficient in a certain area, not only get better over time, but also end up excelling in the long run.

This whole PRIA is simply a way of making it look like something had been done to keep skies safe. Training is really the only way.

USMCFLYR

There is nothing wrong with having a record of training. How industry views your record is another matter and is something that rises and falls with the tide of the hiring cycles in the industry.

Concorde001

Not sure about this one...anyone knows?

Cubdriver

But there is the way it is now, it's the unilateral effect black marks have in destroying careers when there may not be much value to it in terms of air safety. If you drove like a fool once in your teens and got black mark on your driving record is there really a need to carry details about it decades later? And while saying the fallout will rise and fall with the ebb and flow of demand is right, HR screening wickets at the majors are notorious for arbitrary culling. You can go on the Delta thread and hear about screen-outs for typos and missing data let alone PRIA issues. The need for fairness in PRIA is crucial in a performance discipline like aircraft piloting. At this point all a pilot can do is toss in a rebuttal if their employer puts something in error in their file. That's not much in terms of recourse for what can amount to a career killer, and it's zero forgiveness in the event of subsequent improvement on the part of the pilot who overcomes a legitimate deficiency.

outaluckagain

There is absolutely no justifiable reason to carry all of your failures with you as you go....like you were saying.

As for PRIA, I believe it should be thrown out entirely!

ATCsaidDoWhat

I'm not trying to dampen your enthusiasm, however you need to look at some hard facts. You have 1650 TT and 50 ME. CFI and survey flying is a world of difference from a jet. Having great study habits and doing well on writtens and in a classroom environment have nothing to do with it other than you do have a demonstrated ability to do well in those environments.

You are wanting to move from a single pilot, low altitude environment to a high speed, high altitude, CRM focused, two man cockpit where the other person is counting on your experience to make things work and back them up when everything goes to hell in a handbasket.

It's not about memorizing checklists or flows. Or being a whiz at programming the magic. It's about experience that is gained before you get there. Sadly over the past few years, the mills have taught people to program the boxes, throw on the autopilot and grab a cup of coffee. And that's about it.

How much raw data flying experience do they teach...or do you have...in a high altitude environment when the magic goes blank and you are down to 3 primary instruments and 30 minutes of battery? They don't. Book sense doesn't mean squat of you can't use common sense and experience to apply it when the chips are down.

How many people honestly hand fly the plane to altitude so they can learn how it really feels...and then from cruise to the approach and mins without the autopilot...so they can learn to sense a problem before it arises?

You need to recalibrate. Get some serious IFR, multi and night experience. Haul checks. Cargo. Head up to Alaska for a year and get with someone like Era, where you can learn. Put some...a bunch...of multi time in your book.

If you go to a regional now, the best you can hope for is SIC time. You can't log PIC unless you are signing the release as Captain. Which makes it impossible for you to get the PIC time needed to upgrade.

I know you want that RJ job. Do it the right way now so that down the road you don't wake up and find out that by doing it the wrong way, you've made getting the forever job more difficult because you are less competitive.

Hang in there and good luck.

outaluckagain

PRIA only has records where you worked as a pilot. In this case he never worked,as he left before he was done.

It says on FAA website that all PRIA reportable events must now be sent to FAA, and that the carriers you are applying to are required to access the FAA data base.....as of 2010.

This speaks mostly of enforcemnet actions and says nothing about what the pilot in this post is asking about. I keep hearing that companies know everything about you, but there really has to be some limits on this.

I am a bit partial though, since I had a bad experience 5 years ago with my first 121 job. The carriers in question claim that they don't actually hire a pilot until after the check, and this helps the pilot since he won't have to report it as a PRIA...he never worked there.

How about this, call FAA and ask to see your PRIA. Make an educated decision from there. It simply can't hurt to know what the airlines know about you.

I personally feel that the pilot in this post will get hired, and he should tell the potential employer that he resigned on his own. Be forthcoming and explain it as a learning experience. You were a single engine VFR guy,with no CRM experience etc. Tell them what you learned.

I think it would not be wise to cover anything up on this guys side. Be open and honest.

outaluckagain

I completely disagree with what you are saying here. The most common 121 initial failure is the 1600 hour guy who is transitiong to a highly complex automated environment. That automation can be hard to learn the first time around. One switch in the wrong place, and it all fails.

I quite frankly can't see what a few more hours in a Baron hauling checks is going to do for a guy who is most likely having problems with the transition.

Spending some time as a CFI will keep him current, but he'll need hours and hours of sim time practicing emergencies and CRM. The CRJ standards course will help as well.

You are trying to say that experience that is as similar to CRJ flying, as C172 time is to CRJ flying, will pick this guy up. No way!! He needs to drill CRM over and over with a fellow pilot. He needs to study those CRJ systems a month before reporting to training, and have all of his regulations learned before indoc so he and a fellow pilot can sit in front of a poster and practice over and over.

outaluckagain

Concorde, Why don't you see if you can gey a copy of PRIA? I would report this to your next employer anyway, if they ask!!!

Look at my other post,where I am telling the other guy he is wrong about you neading to go fly a Baron hauling checks. I really think my suggestions are valid and will work for you.

Did you get a copy of your training record from the airline? Ask them for a copy and read the instructor comments. They may tell you something about what went wrong. "Off 500 feet on altitude, or missing calls" will likely be among the comments made. Think back to the lesson in question, and remember what went wrong. Were you fixating because multitasking and callouts gave you tunnell vision? Decide honestly for yourself what the problem was, and go from there.

Were you just not accustomed to being talked to by the instructor while you were figuring your hold entry? Just read the training file, and spend session after session on those areas.

Good luck man. I think the carrier may have given you a jolt or a scare, making you considering not coming back. Definately go back man!!!