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Old 05-11-2011, 03:08 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Do 2nd Officers Log hours??

Hi,

I'm trying do find some info on the 2nd Officer position, like the one offered by Cathay Pacific. I was wondering were do 2nd officer hours go in my log book?
Can anyone help please?
Thank you all

Fernando (Portugal)
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Old 05-11-2011, 03:31 AM   #2 (permalink)
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A second officer is usually a flight engineer, and as such will log flight engineer time only. As well, with most 3-seat aircraft going away, there is probably not a long term career option for someone just getting into that job. It is not a piloting job at all, and is not looked at as such by hiring airlines. However, historically speaking, the flight engineer job at most airlines was/is the entry level position, from which guys progress, seniority permitting, from there through the first officer (co-pilot) seat to the left seat. Good luck.
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Old 05-11-2011, 05:08 AM   #3 (permalink)
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As a pilot on an augmented crew (3-4 pilots) you are a required crewmember. You can log all the flight time in the Total Time (TT) column, but only log SIC time that you actually sit in the right or left seat. If you are the assigned relief pilot and occupy the left seat when the captain is resting, you can NOT log PIC. Only the captain who signed the dispatch release can log PIC.
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Old 05-11-2011, 05:11 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by korisko View Post
Hi,

I'm trying do find some info on the 2nd Officer position, like the one offered by Cathay Pacific. I was wondering were do 2nd officer hours go in my log book?
Can anyone help please?
Thank you all

Fernando (Portugal)
At Cathay, the "2nd Officer" is a cruise pilot. I believe Cathay got rid of their Classic 747s, which required a FE. A friend of mine is a 2nd Officer on the A340 - He is a required member of the crew. From what I understand, he doesn't land or takeoff the airplane, he only does that in the sim (every 90 days to keep currency). I would imagine he logs the flight time.

I know that when I'm a member of a 3 or 4 man crew on the B767 (for a US Airline), but just the relief pilot, I log the entire flight as "total time". I don't log the landing because I didn't make it.

You might get a better response in the Foreign section of this site, there is some discussion of CX there.
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Old 05-11-2011, 06:48 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CometCollision View Post
As a pilot on an augmented crew (3-4 pilots) you are a required crewmember. You can log all the flight time in the Total Time (TT) column, but only log SIC time that you actually sit in the right or left seat. If you are the assigned relief pilot and occupy the left seat when the captain is resting, you can NOT log PIC. Only the captain who signed the dispatch release can log PIC.
Along those lines, what about relief Captains?
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Old 05-12-2011, 12:11 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I'm a CX FO who is qualified to relieve the Captain in cruise. When I'm in the seat as PF or PM I log it as SIC. The Hong Kong "FARs" are different than the US in how we log time. When I relieve the Captain I log it as "PIC under instruction" per Hong Kong rules. I only log time in the seat not the entire flight.

The SO's log what's called P2X time, it's not SIC. There really isn't a US equivalent, its sort of "SIC under instruction" but hopefully some of the American SO's will chime in and say how the log it.
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Old 05-12-2011, 04:58 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I am also an FO at CX and I do not even keep a HKG log book. When I was hired the HKG CAD issued me a HK ATPL on the basis of my US Flight time. As for the SOs, they have to now keep a logbook in order to get the ATP when they upgrade to FO. The US SOs that I speak with about this seem to be logging all time in the seat (not much time per flight; cannot occupy a control seat below FL200, but usually not below cruise level) as SIC in their US logbooks and P2X in the HKG log books. It is legit flight time outside of HKG and may come in handy if looking for a new job.
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Old 05-26-2011, 12:57 PM   #8 (permalink)
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If there is an open column in your logbook, put it there, and then label it useless.
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