FAULTPUSH

Heavy rain will do the same.

Regarding the argument from certification, perhaps the solution is to get aircraft certification to take off with some frost on the spoilers (given that if you have just a little frost, the spoilers are typically the first place it will show up.

DBate

Well, maybe that will come one day. But as long as that is not the case, I will stick to the SOPs and the 'clean wing concept'. Better safe than sorry, especially on the less forgiving MD11 I fly .

The 'stunt' shown on the video is just plain stupid IMHO. The wing was far from being clean - even after liftoff; there was still plenty of snow.

FAULTPUSH

I am 100% in agreement with everything you said, but still think the deicing for thin frost aft of 50% chord is pointless.

FastDEW

I fly the baby bus and I would not take off with a wing like that. No way. Especially on the 321 full of pax and fuel.......

Why take the chance? Crazy. Just no sense to me.

FAULTPUSH

Amen........

Brakes Set

Nasa did the study about contamination. The wings should be clean before takeoff.

FAULTPUSH

Can you post a link to the study? Everything I've found has been with contamination over the whole wing, or on the leading edge.

Dashdog

Seems like the PF knew it was a risk, and deliberately rotated well beyond a normal Vr and climbed very shallow. Also, the flaps stayed down for the whole video which seemed like a long time. Not defending these pilots, but who knows, maybe there was no deicing available, or the airline couldn't pay the bill. I'm glad I don't have to fly in Russia.

Ominous

I don't know why I'm even responding to this drivel...


You posted the same video....

Sorry, maybe I should make this clearer.... The rest of the sane, professional, safety-minded, people-with-half-a-brain, etc. THANKFULLY do not agree with you. (and the fact that I had to spell that out for you is proof of the less-than-half-a-brain bit).

Your logic on flex t/o's is also laughable. Again, please post where you work so that we can all avidly avoid your carrier (although at this point I seriously doubt you are a pilot.... Leave the flying to the pros, plz. ).

FAULTPUSH

Very observant of you.

What is laughable about it? Reduced thrust reduces the climb gradient somewhat, and in the event of an engine failure, it is reduced substantially. Are you really saying that having a lesser climb gradient is as safe as having a greater one? My point is that light frost has, and I quote, "has about the same impact on safety margins as a reduced thrust takeoff" (in reality, I would guess that light frost on the spoilers has no measurable effect, as the airflow is turbulent at that point anyway). Instead of responding with words like "drivel" and "laughable", how about something more substantive?