SkyHigh

Pilots love to fly and the ever efficient world has taken notice. We spend the price of a starter house to pay for our own training and education to work in a profession that only pays in landings and take offs.

Competitive pressures will continue to erode at wages and benefits while those who do boring pedestrian careers gain leverage.

In 20 years garbage men will be among the highest paid professions if they are not so already. I know a big city garbage man who now lives in my rural home town and has been retired since he was 47.

In the spirit of the thread OP for your sake I hope that you take a good and hard look at where this profession is going and what other industries and careers provide.

Skyhigh

Learflyer

Sky, seriously, once again you are painting this industry with a big broad brush. The airlines ( I guess) are paid in takeoffs and landings, but there are a lot of other ways to earn a living flying airplanes. Charter (decent ones) Fracs, Sim Instructor (great gig), Training Center Examiner (did this too) Cargo (soon to be my new baby), etc. Being the highest paid profession doesn't guarantee you retirement pay and retiring at a certain age. I know people who are paid 6 figures who are barely scraping by, and folks who make 5 figures who were smart about money and have millions.

Seems like you are doubling down on the people remaining in this career because things are turning around and you don't want to see us happy. Have you looked around? If you try, even YOU can get a decent job flying airplanes with decent money.

Dan64456

Sitting in a cubicle not only costs the money of a college loan, but also costs you your soul.

Being home every night sucks when you are miserable and strung out from kissing the collective asses of your clients and bosses, every day.

I know the flying career sucks financially for the vast majority. But I also wonder if my soul is worth more (or less) than money. School of all forms is way overpriced, as are homes, rent, fuel, etc. Even as a single guy with no family (thank GOD in this economy) with a supposed good cubicle drone job, I still go paycheck to paycheck. I know people that quit to start their own business (cliché I know) and most went belly up within a year. They (like most in the downtown of the city) all have a safety net of rich parents or trust funds however. Everything is a roll of the dice... You can't win unless you were born rich, or fell into some extreme luck. Hard work seems to only get you taken advantage of.


Check this out:
The Gervais Principle, Or The Office According to “The Office”

Haven't found a better description of the office 'hierarchy' to date. It truly is soul draining to have to witness this 5 days a week, every single week. I still do wonder if flying for a living would be better for me. I haven't done it on a recreational level in years because I simply cannot afford it.

SkyHigh

Learflyer,

I sincerely hope that everyone here finds the job or situation of their dreams, including me. I have never stopped looking for a good flying job. I guess the demarcation line here is the determination of what a "good" job is.

There are a variety of pilot jobs out there that I could get however they require either a move to a different state (or country) and usually offer a wage that is below most everything else. I am not a 20 year old. I can not afford to be gone from my family and business for a regional first officers salary.

My job criteria are the following: Must be within three hours drive of where I live (no committing) and offer a wage that is considerably more than that of a mailman. Where I live there are few jobs that can meet those expectations however to accept anything less would be a disservice to my family and myself.

The problem is that most flying jobs pay far less than that of a grocery store produce manager and demand that you yield most of the control of your life to the company.

However there are still a few islands of the aviation landscape that offer a significant return on your sacrifice. If you or anyone else here knows of anything that might fit the bill and want to help me to get a job I will happily humiliate myself here on APC to their amusement. I have an ongoing offer to DE727UPS to prove me wrong by getting me hired at UPS.

FedEx? Boeing flight test? Hows about corporate 757 gig?

Any takers???

Skyhigh

SkyHigh

Dan64456,

I read the entire Ribbon Farm article and found it to be fascinating. Not only does it describe the office workplace but it directly applies to aviation as well.

All of the players in the article exist in the pilot world. I believe that if you were to become an airline pilot you would quickly discover that you have traded one cube for another.

In regards to the airlines I believe that the pilots make up the clueless layer.

From the article:

"The Clueless are the ones who lack the competence to circulate freely through the economy (unlike sociopaths and losers), and build up a perverse sense of loyalty to the firm, even when events make it abundantly clear that the firm is not loyal to them. To sustain themselves, they must be capable of fashioning elaborate delusions based on idealized notions of the firm — the perfectly pathological entities we mentioned. Unless squeezed out by forces they cannot resist, they hang on as long as possible, long after both sociopaths and losers have left..."

If you are not happy in the office environment then you would not be happy as a pilot. Perhaps you are the "true executive" as described in the article?

"Of all organization men, the true executive is the one who remains most suspicious of The Organization. If there is one thing that characterizes him, it is a fierce desire to control his own destiny and, deep down, he resents yielding that control to The Organization, no matter how velvety its grip… he wants to dominate, not be dominated…Many people from the great reaches of middle management can become true believers in The Organization…But the most able are not vouchsafed this solace."


I really think that if you want to change your life you need to change your cycle of thinking. Do not trade one bad situation for another. Break out and find an entirely new place for yourself. All large organisations are the same.

Skyhigh

USMCFLYR

You came up with a new job! I'm not sure I have ever seen you use this one before Thanks for expanding on your posts.

Corporate gig??? Not sure about that. From what I hear - attitude goes a long way into getting one of those sweet jobs.
Did DE actually offer you a recommendation?

USMCFLYR

SkyHigh

USMCFLYR,

No, DE did not offer me a recommendation but I did pitch the deal to him. In fact as a check airmen I pointed out that if I were placed into the 757 he could have abused me for the rest of my career. It would have been totally worth it too.

Anyone else want to take up the challenge? Anyone here who also works for UPS? Hows about FedEx? Alaska Airlines? Imagine the humiliation I would feel as I was publicly forced to eat my words here on APC....

Prove me and my years of posting wrong. Be the champion of the ideals of aviation.

Skyhigh

SkyHigh

USMCFLYR,

Oh I have a great attitude when it comes to a job that is worth the effort. Most however are not so great. Under those conditions a positive attitude is a detriment.

SEE: Clueless in the article The Gervais Principle, Or The Office According to “The Office”

Skyhigh

USMCFLYR

Yeah - I read your post above.

If I were a hiring manager at a top corporate flight department and had read many of the things that you called professional pilots on this forum (nothing more than automatons or 'Clueless') and your famous broad sweeping generalizations of how pilots who travel are poor family people - I'm thinking you might not pass MY 'sniff' test.

Since those are advertised on here to be your true and unwaivering feelings towards professional aviation, I'm not sure how you could possibly hide them during an interview.

USMCFLYR

SkyHigh

USMCFLYR,

I don't know how many interviews you have been on but I have had plenty. Everyone who goes in puts on their best face. Usually it is the best lier that gets the job. I have seen plenty of applicants savagely bad mouth the company that they were in the waiting room to interview with and walk out with an offer.

It seems to be the nature of the HR department to hire the guy who does not really want it. Give me a job interview for a company that I detest and I will get hired every time. In the interview I will appear to be arrogant, disinterested and radiate a sense of superiority to the position. Employers eat it like candy. However be faced with a dream job and the applicant can appear desperate, accommodating and needy. They will leave empty handed.

It is the sad theater of life. The guy who works for SWA dreamed of flying for UPS and the guy at UPS really wanted to fly for UAL and so on. I have gotten every job I have ever wanted... usually 6 months after I really do not want it anymore.

At the rate the industry is going my dream job should be just around the corner.

Skyhigh