gdube94

I will agree with everything except that most of us do the job just for retirement and medical benefits. That just hasn't been remotely close to my experience. In fact, when we do run across "paycheck" firefighters we tend to do what we can to make their station experience less than desirable.

Those types do exist, they just aren't the norm.

Like most of you I worked my way up and ended up at a 121 operation flying DC-8s out of corrosion corner at MIA. After a couple years that experience left me thinking about other ways to make a living, and I switched careers to firefighting. Was a huuuuuge decision, and for you guys looking to go from aviation to public service don't downplay what a huge decision that is.

In my case it worked out. I work for a great department, been promoted to Lieutenant, and if the retirements work out right I'm looking at a second promotion to shift commander in the next couple of years.

Firefighting is similar to LEO in that we have set schedules and usually pretty stable incomes and benefits. Both careers are very challenging, both have changed a lot since 9/11, and both have their good and bad times.

In the northeast getting hired for firefighting jobs is incredibly competitive, as they are in California from what I have heard. It isn't a guarantee you'll get hired just because you want too. I would argue it is as competitive as getting hired by a major, having been through both experiences.

In the end I love what I do. Being in command of an engine company is pretty damned similar to being in command of an aircraft. Both involve a high degree of judgment and decision making and crew coordination. I would only have left aviation for firefighting.

I will hit my 25 years and get my pension at 54. My 121 days are almost certainly over. However, with a pension to fall back on I would happily transition back to aviation in another capacity. If nothing else it leaves me with a lot of options.

Someone asked what was more dangerous, LEO or airline flying. Without question LEO. They have about 150 line of duty deaths a year. There are about 100 LODDs in the fire service. Firefighters have also been found to be 30-35% more at risk for many cancers than the general population. On Monday I was one of about 4,000 firefighters who were at the funeral for a Hartford FF who was killed last week in a building fire. Standing at attention and saluting a casket and a fatherless family will certainly make you think.

Point to ponder. At the funeral Monday there were firefighters there from Detroit, Chicago, DC, LA, Toledo, and from departments from MD to ME. They flew, they drove, they gave up time with their families to say goodbye to someone they never met. It's not all about the benefits and work schedule.

Both firefighting and LEO are more than just a paycheck. Nobody shoots at you and you aren't going to get caught in a flashover while doing a primary search for victims when you are sitting ready reserve.

Ups and downs for each career.

Good luck to you. I hope that you find a job that you love as much as I do mine. Makes life a lot easier.

wingx

Man I used to want to be a LEO, but now am going the pilot route. The more and more I browse this site I wonder if I'm doing the right thing.

Jdman

I have been following this thread for awhile and thought I would post my two cents worth. I am the son of a Naval Aviator, Dad flew in WWII and Korea, got out of the Navy in 1953, and spent several years making a lousy living in aviation and left it to become a business man. He always told me aviation was a lousy way to live. I came of age, enlisted in the Marines, went to college, then law school. Along the way I worked on getting a rating here and there. Several times from 1985 through 1998 I thought about making the leap over to aviation. I could never convince myself my dad was wrong. There was always the money, security, a wife, etc..

In 2000 after being sick of the law practice, I left, went to the LEO academy and got hired, started working the street. About 2003 my neighbor, who was deputy for 20 years and was the second in command of the local sheriff aviation unit, Three jet ranger's one Aerostar, two navajo's and a 182, he started recruiting. I could leave my agency, work the street for a year or so with them, and get into their unit as long as I had the most ratings. Went to work on the rotor PPL add on. That option was looking good, same shift work, 1800-0400, flying at least 2.0 a day for currency if no calls for service came out.

I was up for getting promoted at my agency, so I stayed. Year or two later, new sheriff in town, no more 2.0 for currency. Guys get 1-3 hours a week sometimes, the rest sitting in the hangar. Navajo's gone, might not have gotten that "next spot" after all.

So here I am with a great retirement, good schedule, great beni's, wife is still a lawyer so the kids are still in private school. I have a warrior to rent when I want and I am building a Rv-6 . I would rather be flying planes all day, but the cost was not worth it for me, for others it might be. My situation allows me to access aviation to the degree to keep me sane. If you are interested in flying for a living, don't go be a cop for the schedule. But no do think flying the line is the only aviation out there, its not.

Good friend of mine from high school is at DAL, dad was very senior DAL and got him hired in the early 2000's. He likes his job better than I do, but I like my life from 1989-2000 better than he did, the Eastern collapse, the CFi' gigs, the 5 or 6 moves with wife in tow, he is making money now, not sure if he has caught up with me from the lean years yet. He found his niche, and I found mine.

Whatever choice you make, be sure you are going TO something, not FROM something. Just an aside, recent OSHA stats had commercial pilot as more dangerous than LEO. Stay safe.

Alpha Mike Foxtrot

USAF77

Well sa a 30 year + LEO and an aviation enthusiast I might have an opinion here. Also Im a USAF vet and have known a fair amount of pilots. However I make no claim to knowing what its actually like being a Pilot. Im just a ground pounder who loves airplanes. I currently have enough seniority to have found a spot on an airport detail at a major INTL airport.

But im sure there a wide variance in Pilot and flight crew jobs. From the types of airframes you fly to the pay, to the hours, to the quality of co-workers....ect The same can be said of Law Enforcement. I do know that technology and bureaucracy and politics cuts much into the fun of flying. Which is why I hear from so many big wide body pilots that they buy small one engine "fun planes" to get the rush again. Much of the same has cut into, what was, the fun of Law Enforcement.

I'd rather be a small town or county sheriff who goes home at the end of the day feeling like he has helped someone rather then a big city beat cop who is now dealing with a 3rd or 4th gen gangsta from a family Ive been locking up my entire career. From experience I'd avoid these big city agencys like Chicago, LA, NY, Baltimore, Cinci....ect You might end up going out and taking fire for a community that hopes you got hit, and reported on by a media that never has a good thing to say about police cause "good things "dont sell" newspapers.

Also the current trend is to chip away at benefits and pay even to the point where pensions are at risk cause the thieves we elect cant help themselves from also thieving from Police and Fire pensions. Medical bennies are being cut and ALL bennies are being bargained away for new hires in many agencies. So it may not be as rosy a picture as you might think.

Do your home work for sure. Ive actually worked with more then a couple POs who got out of the flight game for LE work. Good luck with whatever you decide.

JamesNoBrakes

Yes, the private industry figured this out years ago, the government is just now figuring out how to whittle down people. I remember an agency saying that they plan for people to only work for them for about 3-5 years...well, yes, because you've whittled down benefits and made it less lucrative. At least in the government the agencies are forced to follow labor laws and don't have much leeway, which means I get treated decent, rather than in the aviation industry where a pilot earning 25K is considered a "professional" and therefore exempt from fair labor laws (of which the intention is to exempt professionals earning 100K or more like doctors, lawyers, etc). Interesting times we live in.

Bluesville

Am I glad I stumbled across this topic.

I too been really thinking about making the switch, from Regional FO to LAPD. I been in doing this thing going on 6 years now and I have nothing to show for it. A 4yr degree, 5,000 Hours... 2-Plus years flying CFi, 2-Plus years doing FreightDawg 135 P.I.C. gigs, and now 3-Plus years doing the regional side with an upgrade coming in about 2yrs and I can't get a call from anywhere (And I applied everywhere and I hate the idea of paying some shumck to look at my resume i.e. Job fairs)! I was trying my hardest to jumpship anywhere that flies something bigger (Allegiant called but its not for me), now that I'm a father I have to be selective on where I go.
For now life is... okay, Im 30 years old, I live in base (LAX), people I work with are great but I don’t have sh*t to show for it. And if I do decide to stay in it, guess where Im going to... an east coast base for one of The Big 3 for a significant amount of time commuting (I’m not relocating east. period).

I always had in interest in law enforcement, I have great people skills, my street IQ is above average, I love watching COPS haha, I want more of thrill instead of landing an Rj in a 20kt Crosswind, Im very thick-skinned and now Im going to do the next step in LAPD application process I been holding off-on partly because I been so busy this past summer.

I welcome your thoughts/opinions guys.

NotPart91

One extremely important factor is the high risk of OTJ Trauma and the extreme wear and tear on an officer's body during a 20+ year law enforcement career.

I've seen active officers, i.e. Spec Ops, OCONUS tours, Gym Rats etc. that have aliments such as knee replacements, Spinal DDD and arthritis at ages <45 and "other" stress related issues.

So an Aviation Flying Career will minimize the above accelerated wear and tear issues.

Just a thought.

Rnav

Plenty of guys on the job with injuries, but I'd say it's no different than any active job. If someone is worried about long term injuries I'd try to take a DB(detective bureau) assignment or lateral to investigative agency (State, District Attorney's Office) where you don't have to do patrol. Every job has its plus and minuses. But the pay and benefits are great, even after all the hits we've taken over the last 5 years.

flip

DON'T DO IT!!! Seriously...you have to do what you think is the right call. After you get burned out, which these days I notice the younger guys doing quicker, you'll miss flying so bad you'll want to kick your ass!

You see the worst of the world day in and day out and after a while it wears on you. Nobody ever calls the police and says, "Hey, everything is great...you guys come on over". If that happens its an obvious ambush..lol!

I think the economy is going to start rebounding and things may get a little better for aviation...I hope.

If you need some excitement go jump in a 172 and shoot an ILS to DA in a 20kt xwind...with a hood on. I did at BHM Saturday in 15kt gust and I was excited..lol! Anyway..good luck in your decision but take it from a 20 year LE vet...this job is just another job when the newness wears off.

Rnav

You can get burned out on both. Having done both, I can safely say both have their pro and cons. But I can attest that I like helping people and being an LEO it provides that niche. If you don't like helping people or seeing them during the worse moments in their lives don't become a LE. If you focus on all the bad of any job you will be burned out. Flying or LEO.