Virgin America Online Assessment?
03-06-2012, 01:43 PM
#61
Banned
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,480
Actually those union pilots he refers to are getting crappy pay imposed by the bankruptcy court BECAUSE people like you are willing to sell yourselves for 2/3rds pay. Take a look at how UAL and USAir got there and to a lesser extent DAL.
Its precisely because the court vacated their pay scales and imposed jetBlue pay rates. And now YOU are dragging us down in exactly the same way.
Its precisely because the court vacated their pay scales and imposed jetBlue pay rates. And now YOU are dragging us down in exactly the same way.
03-06-2012, 04:18 PM
#62
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Position: A320 eff oh
Posts: 277
Originally Posted by Fishfreighter
And you're satisfied with current industry "average"? A pay rate imposed by bankruptcy courts? And you can't see how YOUR "industry average" pay rate is dragging the rest of the industry down?
You guys really are a piece of work. But you keep on justifying it to yourselves. Use the same justification scabs do when they cross picket lines..."I had to feed my family."
What VX pilots either fail or refuse to understand is the cause and effect your crappy wages have on the rest of the industy. When you CHOOSE to work for a non-Union carrier who pays substandard wages, you become an anchor around the neck of the piloting profession.
Why do you think USAir and UAL narrowbody rates are so crappy? Its because the Court dumped their pay rates and imposed jetBlue rates "in order to compete" as their respective managers claimed. Then, the day before the Bankruptcy Law changed, Delta filed and gutted their pay rates.
Now those Union pilots have to fight hammer and tongs to recover and its a long road. Why? Exactly because there are guys like you who are willing to sell themselves on the cheap.
Oh well, I guess you know what you're worth. What sucks is that you're dragging everyone else down to your level and then you demand to be given "professional courtesies." Unbelievable.
Thanks for nothing.
P.S. And again, ThrustMonkey proves that if you can't come up with a rational rebuttal, just toss an insult. Good job, Monkey.
You guys really are a piece of work. But you keep on justifying it to yourselves. Use the same justification scabs do when they cross picket lines..."I had to feed my family."
What VX pilots either fail or refuse to understand is the cause and effect your crappy wages have on the rest of the industy. When you CHOOSE to work for a non-Union carrier who pays substandard wages, you become an anchor around the neck of the piloting profession.
Why do you think USAir and UAL narrowbody rates are so crappy? Its because the Court dumped their pay rates and imposed jetBlue rates "in order to compete" as their respective managers claimed. Then, the day before the Bankruptcy Law changed, Delta filed and gutted their pay rates.
Now those Union pilots have to fight hammer and tongs to recover and its a long road. Why? Exactly because there are guys like you who are willing to sell themselves on the cheap.
Oh well, I guess you know what you're worth. What sucks is that you're dragging everyone else down to your level and then you demand to be given "professional courtesies." Unbelievable.
Thanks for nothing.
P.S. And again, ThrustMonkey proves that if you can't come up with a rational rebuttal, just toss an insult. Good job, Monkey.
03-06-2012, 05:22 PM
#63
Banned
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,480
If you had the ability to read for comprehension, the Atlas discussion was all about options for Atlas. OPTIONS and OPINIONS.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
FACT: YOUR pay rate is a drag on the piloting profession.
FACT: You have no say in your pay rates because as a non-Union carrier you have no CBA.
FACT: With no CBA, Sir Dick can pay you whatever he wants.
FACT: Your current CA pay rate is only slightly more than Regional CAs earn.
FACT: YOU have decided to sell yourself and, by extension, your professional peers either for a quick upgrade or an A320 type rating.
Those are the facts. Refute them if you can. But, you can't so a string of insults will be forthcoming.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
FACT: YOUR pay rate is a drag on the piloting profession.
FACT: You have no say in your pay rates because as a non-Union carrier you have no CBA.
FACT: With no CBA, Sir Dick can pay you whatever he wants.
FACT: Your current CA pay rate is only slightly more than Regional CAs earn.
FACT: YOU have decided to sell yourself and, by extension, your professional peers either for a quick upgrade or an A320 type rating.
Those are the facts. Refute them if you can. But, you can't so a string of insults will be forthcoming.
03-06-2012, 06:30 PM
#64
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Position: A320 eff oh
Posts: 277
Originally Posted by Fishfreighter
If you had the ability to read for comprehension, the Atlas discussion was all about options for Atlas. OPTIONS and OPINIONS.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
FACT: YOUR pay rate is a drag on the piloting profession.
FACT: You have no say in your pay rates because as a non-Union carrier you have no CBA.
FACT: With no CBA, Sir Dick can pay you whatever he wants.
FACT: Your current CA pay rate is only slightly more than Regional CAs earn.
FACT: YOU have decided to sell yourself and, by extension, your professional peers either for a quick upgrade or an A320 type rating.
Those are the facts. Refute them if you can. But, you can't so a string of insults will be forthcoming.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
FACT: YOUR pay rate is a drag on the piloting profession.
FACT: You have no say in your pay rates because as a non-Union carrier you have no CBA.
FACT: With no CBA, Sir Dick can pay you whatever he wants.
FACT: Your current CA pay rate is only slightly more than Regional CAs earn.
FACT: YOU have decided to sell yourself and, by extension, your professional peers either for a quick upgrade or an A320 type rating.
Those are the facts. Refute them if you can. But, you can't so a string of insults will be forthcoming.
) but my observation was you defending your opinions about their future decisions when those who are probably much more in the know are calling you out, calling your theories rather silly based on their money making business model, yet you stubbornly won't entertain others opinions. Anyway, you are a waste of my time. This is my final retort to you (so I'm sure you'll have a field day and attempt to unload on this post because you know I won't be responding). Cheers.
03-06-2012, 11:36 PM
#65
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,898
Originally Posted by Fishfreighter
If you had the ability to read for comprehension, the Atlas discussion was all about options for Atlas. OPTIONS and OPINIONS.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
FACT: YOUR pay rate is a drag on the piloting profession.
FACT: You have no say in your pay rates because as a non-Union carrier you have no CBA.
FACT: With no CBA, Sir Dick can pay you whatever he wants.
FACT: Your current CA pay rate is only slightly more than Regional CAs earn.
FACT: YOU have decided to sell yourself and, by extension, your professional peers either for a quick upgrade or an A320 type rating.
Those are the facts. Refute them if you can. But, you can't so a string of insults will be forthcoming.
03-06-2012, 11:38 PM
#66
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,898
Actually those union pilots he refers to are getting crappy pay imposed by the bankruptcy court BECAUSE people like you are willing to sell yourselves for 2/3rds pay. Take a look at how UAL and USAir got there and to a lesser extent DAL.
03-07-2012, 06:00 AM
#67
New Hire
Joined APC: Jul 2011
Position: Front Seat
Posts: 6
You forgot to mention Alaska in your comparison. I also overlook them as they are so small and insignificant. They only make about 2/3 of Southwest, UPS, and Fed Ex. They do have a CBA, but it is useless because it allows them to furlough pilots whenever management decides to do it. When looking over the posts on APC you never see Alaska mentioned. My guess is we are not the only ones to overlook them. Thank god they have one pilot who is brave enough to bring their pilot group to the forefront of the discussion on APC. they must be so proud.
03-07-2012, 08:26 AM
#68
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Posts: 120
Originally Posted by Lake Lice
You forgot to mention Alaska in your comparison. I also overlook them as they are so small and insignificant. They only make about 2/3 of Southwest, UPS, and Fed Ex. They do have a CBA, but it is useless because it allows them to furlough pilots whenever management decides to do it. When looking over the posts on APC you never see Alaska mentioned. My guess is we are not the only ones to overlook them. Thank god they have one pilot who is brave enough to bring their pilot group to the forefront of the discussion on APC. they must be so proud.
Last edited by stuart716; 03-07-2012 at 09:39 AM.
03-07-2012, 09:19 AM
#70
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,423
Originally Posted by Fishfreighter
If you had the ability to read for comprehension, the Atlas discussion was all about options for Atlas. OPTIONS and OPINIONS.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
FACT: YOUR pay rate is a drag on the piloting profession.
FACT: You have no say in your pay rates because as a non-Union carrier you have no CBA.
FACT: With no CBA, Sir Dick can pay you whatever he wants.
FACT: Your current CA pay rate is only slightly more than Regional CAs earn.
FACT: YOU have decided to sell yourself and, by extension, your professional peers either for a quick upgrade or an A320 type rating.
Those are the facts. Refute them if you can. But, you can't so a string of insults will be forthcoming.
When discussing VX its FACTS:
FACT: You get paid 2/3rds what other narrowbody CAs make.
FACT: YOUR pay rate is a drag on the piloting profession.
FACT: You have no say in your pay rates because as a non-Union carrier you have no CBA.
FACT: With no CBA, Sir Dick can pay you whatever he wants.
FACT: Your current CA pay rate is only slightly more than Regional CAs earn.
FACT: YOU have decided to sell yourself and, by extension, your professional peers either for a quick upgrade or an A320 type rating.
Those are the facts. Refute them if you can. But, you can't so a string of insults will be forthcoming.
Can you convince our fence sitters?
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