aspiring_pilot

I flew into Gunnison today. It was the loooooooooongest approach ever, next to that of vail. the final was less than a mile.

gunnison isnt wedged in a deep valley, why the need for a weird approach?


and why on vail approach do you fly around in the valleys for 30 minutes with gear and flaps?

anyone have comments? flew aa 757 today. brutal landing in case the captain is on here

ryane946

As a college student in Colorado, I have flown into Aspen many times on United Express (BAE-146's out of SFO, sometimes CRJ's). Although I have never personally flown an airplane into either of those airports, I have talked with many glider and airplane pilots about mountain flying, specifically Leadville and Aspen.

Aspen represents all the challenges with mountain flying. Within a close vicinity of Aspen lies terrain the stretches from 12-14,000ft. It is very important to know WHERE you are where the TERRAIN is when flying into Aspen. Aspen's runway 15/33 is slightly over a mile long (7,000ft), and yet there is a 200ft vertical rise. At an altitude of 8,000ft, it is not uncommon in the summer to see density altitudes in excess of 12,000ft! Better approach with your engines turning. Now throw low visibility into this crazy layout, and you have Aspen.

A much steeper than normal glideslope is required, not only for the reasons above (terrain, etc...), but also because of mountain winds. As a glider pilot, I know that a change from the upwind to the downwind portion of a mountain wave is a difference between a 1000ft/min rate of climb to a 1000ft/min rate of descent. Add in strong downdrafts like these, and you want to have a big margin between you and the mountain terrain. There are also noise abaitment considerations.

Hope this helps,
I plan to take a mountain flying course this summer so that I can fly in and out of airports like that.
Ryan

contrails

Someone currently flying into Vail EGE this season can chime in but I jumpseated into there last winter and the approach was not long at all. We held at Kremling for about a turn and a half just for traffic ahead and then went right in. Left the hold at 14,000 I think it was and I forget the name of the fix but this airline's rule on the special airport chart was to be fully configured by this fix, which was turning final.

Thirty minutes with gear and flaps sounds a bit long.

cactusmike

It's been a long time ago but I did my captain IOE into EGE on the 737. It was snowing so we did the whole approach, and I remember a long dogleg approach to get lined up on final. The next week I went in on my own and it was VFR so we just ducked in over the hills. We saved about 15 minutes doing a visual.

Chances are, if you had a firm landing the captain was not going to let it float going for a greaser. Also, if the runway slopes up a few degrees you get an optical illusion and you can misjudge the flair. That's the excuse I've used, anyway.

JayDub

I'll go with what he said!

Respectfully,

JayDub

av8r4aa

I have never disliked a airport more than Aspen.

Elevator ride on the decent and then a uphill runway.
One way in and one way out. I
have seen Cessna 206 crash within 20 feet of where I was standing.

I tried a spoiler extended no flap approach vor dme stepdown
only to be frightened to see the STALL light and HORN GO OFF
IMC ABOUT 1300 feet AGL in a snowstorm. Yes I did have to pull the seatcushion out after landing.
Needless to say I will never try that technique again.
It never got easier going in there.

I hated it everytime.


I am glad that AA does not go in to that Death Trap.

My old Chief Pilot would decend to minimums then follow the highway
to the approach end of the runway.
What a Friggen A-hole,
Yes he got fired .