Pilots helping pilots

View over 100 airline profilesAdd to Google



Go Back   Airline Pilot Central Forums > Airline Pilot Forums > Major
Register FAQ Advertising Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Major Legacy, National, and LCC

 

Welcome to Airline Pilot Forums

    Already registered? Login above

OR
 
To take advantage of all the site's features, become a member of
the largest community of airline pilots in the U.S. and beyond.

The advertising to the left will not show if you are a registered user.


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-05-2008, 08:15 AM   #1 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: DAL-S, B
Posts: 127
Default USA Today: Three airlines drop self-reporting safety program

Three airlines drop self-reporting safety program

Several leading safety experts and the FAA's acting chief criticized the companies and unions in recent days, accusing the two sides of letting politics and bargaining get in the way of safety.

By Alan Levin, USA TODAY

Three large airlines have abandoned a safety program credited with helping to lower accident rates, prompting criticism of the airlines and unions by safety advocates and government regulators.

American Airlines, Delta Air Lines and Comair have dropped programs that encourage pilots to come forward and report their own mistakes without fear of being punished. Known as the Aviation Safety Action Program (ASAP), the program has helped airlines and regulators uncover scores of potentially dangerous situations and make fixes before they caused crashes.

ASAP depends on a consensus among pilot unions, airlines and the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), any of which can halt the agreement by refusing to participate.

Union leaders have charged that airlines have gone back on their word and unfairly punished pilots who voluntarily disclosed problems.

The airlines insist that they have treated employees fairly.

Several leading safety experts and the FAA's acting chief criticized the companies and unions in recent days, accusing the two sides of letting politics and bargaining get in the way of safety.

"There are at least two sides to every story, but I couldn't care less about either," said Bill Voss, president of the Flight Safety Foundation. "Safety systems do not belong on the bargaining table. There is simply no excuse."

FAA acting Administrator Bobby Sturgell called the breakdown "disheartening," in a speech last week.

National Transportation Safety Board member Robert Sumwalt said the shutdowns represent a troubling trend. "The relevant players need to do whatever is necessary to ensure that these programs remain active and vital safety tools," Sumwalt said.

American, the first carrier to start ASAP 14 years ago, suspended its program in October after talks with the Allied Pilots Association (APA) broke down.

APA's safety chief, Mike Michaelis, said the program broke down because of a lack of trust. Capt. Billy Nolen, American's flight safety manager, said the company wants to renew a program that has operated for years.

Delta halted its program in November 2006 over disagreements with the Air Line Pilots Association.

Comair, whose pilots are represented by the same union, suspended its ASAP last October.
E1Out is offline   Reply With Quote
Advertising above will not show if you are a registered user.
Old 12-05-2008, 08:30 AM   #2 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: FO
Posts: 613
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by E1Out View Post
"There are at least two sides to every story, but I couldn't care less about either," said Bill Voss, president of the Flight Safety Foundation. "Safety systems do not belong on the bargaining table. There is simply no excuse."
This guy couldn't work for the FAA. That's exactly how they view safety. Lives lost vs. cost of improvment.
cencal83406 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 08:53 AM   #3 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
exwaterski's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Posts: 193
Default

Nowhere in the article did it mention ambulance chasing lawyers trying to get their hands on ASAP reports. It's much easier to simply blame the unions.
exwaterski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 09:18 AM   #4 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
Boomer's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: OH 10yr FO
Posts: 3,541
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by E1Out View Post
Three large airlines have abandoned a safety program...

...American Airlines, Delta Air Lines and Comair...
By what definition can they call post-BK Comair a large airline?
Boomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 09:49 AM   #5 (permalink)
Moderator
 
USMCFLYR's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 10,292
Default

I'm not knowledgable enough on the facts concerning the unions and airlines in this case but I agree with exwaterski here that safety has been comprimised at the hands of the judicial system and the judge who allowed ASAP reports released in a lawsuit.
My community is already having a hard time accepting the ASAP program and I'm sure that this will just add ammunition to those who never believed in it to begin with in the first place.

USMCFLYR
USMCFLYR is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 12:45 PM   #6 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 484
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by exwaterski View Post
Nowhere in the article did it mention ambulance chasing lawyers trying to get their hands on ASAP reports. It's much easier to simply blame the unions.
That's what I thought was behind this move. Didn't a few other carriers announce they were looking at dropping the program after that "honorable" bench idiot let the lawyers in the Comair case look at the reports? Too bad there isn't a measure of how many lives have NOT been lost.
__________________
http://www.searchk9.net/helitac/harryreasoner.htm
deadstick35 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 03:06 PM   #7 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
UCLAbruins's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: F/O- G-V/550
Posts: 1,090
Default

This is sad and troubling, puts everything into perspective.

I can't believe the airlines went that far, and just to get back at the pilots/unions of all thigs, I don't even know what to say.

How should pilots return the favor?? start the APU at 15,000ft.........

its never going to end (eye for an eye)
UCLAbruins is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
 

 
Reply
 



« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
American Airlines Considers Ala Carte Pricing vagabond Major 15 10-12-2008 12:07 PM
Republic Airlines History Splanky Regional 11 09-17-2008 02:52 PM
FDX - Airlines Balk at Indy Hub Bill DLax85 Cargo 3 08-30-2008 07:00 PM
United Airlines: O'Hare Today, Gone Tomorrow JiffyLube Major 23 08-16-2008 04:49 PM
Whiney Pilots Complain That Stingy Airlines Are Forcing Them To Fly Uncomfortably Low Atreyu Regional 16 08-11-2008 10:10 AM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:51 AM.


vBulletin® v3.8.6, Copyright ©2000-2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2012 Internet Brands, Inc.