Go Back  Airline Pilot Central Forums > Airline Pilot Forums > Major > Delta
Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? >

Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Notices

Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Old 07-22-2014, 02:18 PM
  #163541  
Gets Weekends Off
 
buzzpat's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Urban chicken rancher.
Posts: 6,070
Default

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar View Post
Simple math; addition and compound interest.

I would not use the word "sacrifice" but if you chart out a career's earnings, as many of us did, the losses and accumulated losses are larger the earlier in one's career that total earnings were reduced.

Further, those who held a percentage obviously have more than those who did not.

Now as to how you and Buzz "feel" ... I dunno.

Certainly our new hires will have opinions about scope, but they were off property when those changes were made. In as much as they have votes, their opinions matter as much as yours or mine.

If you want to say you have a greater sense of entitlement, OK. I got no problem with your feelings, but simple math still adds up the same.
Bar, I think that if there's any sense of entitlement it's found in charting out career earnings. Seems to me that's pretty foolish in this industry. I guess those of us who were put on the street for years have a different perspective. The only entitlement I hope for is employment.

Last edited by buzzpat; 07-22-2014 at 02:39 PM.
buzzpat is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 02:23 PM
  #163542  
Gets Weekends Off
 
buzzpat's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Urban chicken rancher.
Posts: 6,070
Default

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar View Post
Although if Buzz calls me out again I will send 20 bucks to Hillary ' s Presidential Campaign just to spite him.
Haha!!

You're going to have to step up with Soros money, though, if you want her to pay attention.
buzzpat is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 02:33 PM
  #163543  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Schwanker's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,224
Default

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar View Post
The topic came up in the context of retirement savings.

Either way, take yearly income, less opportunity cost, compounded by whatever rate you believe. (My investment experience has been an overall 9.5 average, but I use 7 for my retirement modeling) To match what my father enjoys from FedEx, plus inlfation, will take me about 4.5 million in producing assets.

Alternatively take the view that new hires know the deal and lost nothing.

I think those who lost the most are those who have not yet been hired due to outsourcing.

Matters not which view you take. My family dealt with more than 7 years of furlough and I do understand your frustration with events. Even more so since your furlough could have been mitigated better than it was. Rather than complaining about J C Lawson, the Delta MEC could have simply negotiated with Delta to hire Delta pilots at Delta's divisions who were rapidly hiring.

Kind of like Compass? Mesaba wouldn't allow furloughed NWA pilots access to the 76 seaters if scope relief was given (although they were ok with going to new hire positions without coughing up your seniority number). Therefore, the scope relief resulted in the creation of Compass providing jobs to those furloughed plus allowing future flowbacks providing excellent furlough protection we still enjoy today.
Schwanker is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 02:38 PM
  #163544  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Permanently scarred
Posts: 1,707
Default

Originally Posted by tsquare View Post
Why don't you get a dictionary and look up the word "entitled".

Look, I am not drawing any kind of disunity line like you seem to want to claim. But it really bugs me when PD and others come on here and talk about sacrifice and restoration when they were not involved in that time. It's like me saying that I deserve credit for walking the picket line at NWA since they are now at DAL. I wasn't there. You weren't here. If you want to talk about getting pay back to C2K levels + some, fine. I have no problem with that, but don't act like you gave anything, because you didn't. Sorry if that is insulting to you, that's not the intent.
I don't feel entitled and I don't think you're insulting me. But I do believe that a pilot, regardless of when he or she came on property, should be able to voice their satisfaction or displeasure with what our representatives are seeking (in the form of TAs and PWAs) on our behalf as a pilot group. We are one and should speak as one voice. Limits on what some are allowed to speak to from the group as to what that one voice speaks to, IMO, should not determined by a segment who feels their voice is more important and can silence others because of their time on property. If that were the case our own FO representative for my LEC would have to sit there with his mouth closed and sit on his hands when the topic (restoration) came up between him and my other reps (not that it does).
GunshipGuy is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 02:43 PM
  #163545  
Back on TDY
 
Carl Spackler's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Default

Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
You miss the point. ALPA does have the data, but the pay data that you have from the internet is just one part of it.
No acl, it is you that is purposely "missing the point." The fact that their compensation data (that is freely available) is "just one part of it" is meaningless. Nobody has ever said their compensation was the entire part. Their other "parts" are available too, but we were talking about compensation.

Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
ALPA does have the data, but they had to agree not to publish it to see it.
I didn't have to agree to anything. I just went on to Google. ALPA could have just done that too, but they were looking for a way NOT to put that data into the contract comparisons. They found their excuse by claiming they had to agree not to publish it...in order to see it. Why our union actively looks for reasons to make us look better than we are is a mystery...sort of.

Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
ALPA has stated that the data is not as clear as you like to state it to be.
I've not read any such thing. Please post any such statement from ALPA.

Carl
Carl Spackler is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 02:47 PM
  #163546  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Permanently scarred
Posts: 1,707
Default

Originally Posted by Carl Spackler View Post
I just cannot imagine why I'm having to say this instead of DALPA. Worse yet, we have an active rep like you purposely mischaracterizing the meaning of the plain written word in a way that favors the company and hurts the jobs of Delta pilots. I would expect that from management, but it's depressing to see this behavior from a rep.

Carl
I think this is why we consistently hear, "Volunteer so you can understand the process." i.e. Convince you how to think the right way.
GunshipGuy is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 02:57 PM
  #163547  
Moderator
 
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Default

Originally Posted by Carl Spackler View Post
I didn't have to agree to anything. I just went on to Google. ALPA could have just done that too, but they were looking for a way NOT to put that data into the contract comparisons. They found their excuse by claiming they had to agree not to publish it...in order to see it. Why our union actively looks for reasons to make us look better than we are is a mystery...sort of.

Carl
Carl,

Do you have a link to the earnings info you found? I googled Air France pilot pay, and all I found were links to Air France pilot jobs, payscales and entry requirements.

Thanks
johnso29 is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 03:01 PM
  #163548  
Super Moderator
 
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DAL 330
Posts: 6,851
Default Shipping a Bicycle

Guys,

What is the best way to ship a bike? I have it all boxed up and received a $130 quote from FDX with the discount but when I got to the FDX store the actual price was $220.

Delta cargo says employees receive a 90% discount - anyone ever use this option? Pros/cons?

How about shipping it as oversize baggage when non-reving?

Thanks - Scoop
Scoop is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 03:13 PM
  #163549  
Back on TDY
 
Carl Spackler's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Default

Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
Wait, wait wait. I got this one.....

Didn't we do that in C2K? What happened to them?
I wasn't here then. Neither were you. Can you answer your own question...truthfully?

Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
Lets say we would reconsider that. Who would we use? Who has USAPA and APA used? Oh yeah that's right the same firm that those who are trying to unseat ALPA uses.
One of the biggest fallacies around is that only ALPA and Seham are qualified to write labor contract language. The sad truth is that there are many great law firms that could do this. ALPA will only outsource to one firm, and that firm is either incompetent or complicit with airline management to write language that can't be defended. It's a mess.

Carl
Carl Spackler is offline  
Old 07-22-2014, 03:20 PM
  #163550  
Back on TDY
 
Carl Spackler's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Default

Originally Posted by tsquare View Post
OK everybody, get your defibrillators ready. Carl is right about this... sort of. ACL, you are hiding behind legal technicality. What SHOULD be happening is that the lawyers should have the grievance documentation drawn up, and should file it within 10 seconds of the moment that the company is (legally) out of compliance. They should also let the judge know that this paperwork will be inbound so that he can make a ruling as soon as possible. There need be no study. There need be no debate. There need be no committee meetings after that moment. File it. Immediately.

I suggest a stronger voltage on the defibrillators.




I think that's twice now this year you've agreed with me.

I'm tellin ya man, Dogs and Cats living together!!

Carl
Carl Spackler is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
On Autopilot
Regional
22594
11-05-2021 07:03 AM
AeroCrewSolut
Delta
153
08-14-2018 12:18 PM
Bill Lumberg
Major
71
06-13-2012 08:36 AM
Quagmire
Major
253
04-16-2011 06:19 AM
JiffyLube
Major
12
03-07-2008 04:27 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Your Privacy Choices