Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
01-26-2012, 01:15 PM
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by buzzpat
Unreal. Just read it. I don't know what other fleets do but we check it three times on the -800.
Every fleet has 2 times on the checklist where the flaps are checked and the new-ish callout for positioning them at the start of taxi.
I maintained early on that the change to the CA calling for the flaps at the start of taxi wouldn't change a lack of checklist discipline, and that is obviously the case. Whether the CA calls for it or the FO does it on the salute, it doesn't matter if you're not doing the freaking checklist.
I rode on a maddog a few weeks ago where the FO was just calling out the checklist from memory. Pretty dang poor- and quite the amazing memory considering how many items there are.
01-26-2012, 01:15 PM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,989
Ok ... this is more interesting (to me) that this debate:
Canadians put a man in space for $500:
Two Teens Sent This Lego Man 15 Miles Into Space For $500
Canadians put a man in space for $500:
Two Teens Sent This Lego Man 15 Miles Into Space For $500
01-26-2012, 01:16 PM
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by DAL 88 Driver
Well I guess you told me what's what! 
Spare me the righteous indignation and condescension. I don't have time to read every post on this thread every day. Sometimes I have to skip ahead.
I asked clamp a simple question about a statement he made. Seems I struck a nerve with you. You're going to have to brush up on your savoir-faire if you want to keep climbing these political ladders.
Good luck with whatever it is you're trying to do these days. 
Spare me the righteous indignation and condescension. I don't have time to read every post on this thread every day. Sometimes I have to skip ahead.
I asked clamp a simple question about a statement he made. Seems I struck a nerve with you. You're going to have to brush up on your savoir-faire if you want to keep climbing these political ladders.
Good luck with whatever it is you're trying to do these days.
01-26-2012, 01:19 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 618
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
Can someone explain why this argument about openers is interesting?
Nothing has happened. Isn't this like arguing about what color antlers look good on a Unicorn? I mean, it doesn't exist, at least not yet.
Can we wait until there is news, to fight about the news?
Bacon ... More Bacon ... looking forward to your Friday night post.
Nothing has happened. Isn't this like arguing about what color antlers look good on a Unicorn? I mean, it doesn't exist, at least not yet.
Can we wait until there is news, to fight about the news?
Bacon ... More Bacon ... looking forward to your Friday night post.
The rumors are nice. But arguing about them? Really? Its like a trekkie convention arguing about the color of Uhura's pubic hair. Interesting? Sure.... Important? Meh......
And.
88, clearly you have either a grudge or serious man-crush on acl. If you want to go off half cocked about something that has been published a couple of times in union posts... Feel free. But someone bringing it to your attention isn't pushing an alternative agenda.
Clearly acl wants to be our MEC leadership eventually. And let's be honest, a person as well informed, engaged and straight with people should be welcomed. Or shot from long range with a management sniper rifle.
Either way, let us all pray we get what we all need and deserve as a pilot group on C2k12. And for this contract too.
01-26-2012, 01:20 PM
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
Originally Posted by sailingfun
I always find it curious why people have to resort to insults and name calling. I love the boot licking comment. The good news is that most understand the mettle of those who resort to such comments.
Now, maybe it's a misunderstanding. Maybe not. But your posts almost always follow the line of thinking I would expect from management in their counter argument to an argument for restoration. What are we supposed to think?
Originally Posted by sailingfun
I am on record here many times stating what I consider a reasonable contract. It exceeds what SW has.
Originally Posted by sailingfun
I am also a realist and what I have posted has over and over again been far more correct then many others.
Originally Posted by sailingfun
I will also point out that I have made my feelings known to management behind signed letters. I did not lack the courage to only make comments on forums hiding my identity from management. Because of that I have had to have personal conversations with both the VP of flight ops and the CEO of Delta airlines to counsel me on my attitude. I doubt many on the forum can make that claim. I put my job on the line with the CEO in defense of the pilots furloughed by management for political reasons.
I did not post what I believe managements opener will be to further any DALPA goal. I posted it because it reflects the reality of how Delta management feels and thinks. If anyone on this forum thinks otherwise they have had their head in the sand and not read any of management comments over the last few years.
If we are going to get anywhere close to SW wages and retain the aspects of our contract that are better then SW it will come only as a long struggle.
I did not post what I believe managements opener will be to further any DALPA goal. I posted it because it reflects the reality of how Delta management feels and thinks. If anyone on this forum thinks otherwise they have had their head in the sand and not read any of management comments over the last few years.
If we are going to get anywhere close to SW wages and retain the aspects of our contract that are better then SW it will come only as a long struggle.
Originally Posted by sailingfun
A struggle that will require a united pilot group. It is a struggle that will be won or lost behind the scenes in DC via political means. I can only conclude that those who at this stage support DPA would prefer to see DALPA fail and of course the pilots lose income and quality rather then work as a unified group to get the very best contract possible. DPA leadership itself when they started their effort fully recognized the danger this posed and gave themselves a hard deadline to end the process to insure a unified group. Sadly they abandoned what was a correct and smart initial choice for what we have today. Management is toasting them every night on the 4th floor.
But since you brought it up... that's an interesting comment about the 4th floor. As far as I know, our CEO, CFO, company negotiators, etc. do not work on the 4th floor. Are you saying that our flight ops management is happy about DPA's efforts? And if so, then why have they tried to throw every roadblock they could possibly throw in front of DPA?? Weird!
01-26-2012, 01:20 PM
Banned
Joined APC: Jul 2010
Posts: 793
Originally Posted by Tomcat
Hey Clamp,
I certainly hope your right, but I've flown with two diffierent people within the administration and I been told that us seeing the opener is no certainty. THis has and is being debated.
As I told the last individual, if the rank and file have little to no information between the openers and the TA the MEC needs to be prepared for a restless pilot group.
I certainly hope your right, but I've flown with two diffierent people within the administration and I been told that us seeing the opener is no certainty. THis has and is being debated.
As I told the last individual, if the rank and file have little to no information between the openers and the TA the MEC needs to be prepared for a restless pilot group.
01-26-2012, 01:22 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 514
Deleted due to confidential info quoted.
Last edited by 80ktsClamp; 01-26-2012 at 02:17 PM. Reason: yep, that.
01-26-2012, 01:22 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Urban chicken rancher.
Posts: 6,070
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
The way it reads, it sounds like takeoff was initiated only (likely due to a config warning) without the flaps set. I just don't get it.
Every fleet has 2 times on the checklist where the flaps are checked and the new-ish callout for positioning them at the start of taxi.
I maintained early on that the change to the CA calling for the flaps at the start of taxi wouldn't change a lack of checklist discipline, and that is obviously the case. Whether the CA calls for it or the FO does it on the salute, it doesn't matter if you're not doing the freaking checklist.
I rode on a maddog a few weeks ago where the FO was just calling out the checklist from memory. Pretty dang poor- and quite the amazing memory considering how many items there are.
Every fleet has 2 times on the checklist where the flaps are checked and the new-ish callout for positioning them at the start of taxi.
I maintained early on that the change to the CA calling for the flaps at the start of taxi wouldn't change a lack of checklist discipline, and that is obviously the case. Whether the CA calls for it or the FO does it on the salute, it doesn't matter if you're not doing the freaking checklist.
I rode on a maddog a few weeks ago where the FO was just calling out the checklist from memory. Pretty dang poor- and quite the amazing memory considering how many items there are.
In that same vein, I just flew with an LCA and we were experimenting (at the company's request) with combining the performance and taxi checks. It's even more convoluted and doesn't make sense. Hopefully, cooler heads will prevail because, in my mind, it's stupid.
01-26-2012, 01:23 PM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,989
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
I rode on a maddog a few weeks ago where the FO was just calling out the checklist from memory. Pretty dang poor- and quite the amazing memory considering how many items there are.
I'm (not by choice) becoming one of those old, cantankerous, got too much time in this seat kind of FO's (although I try to be polite about it) who says, "Hey Boss, I got to get caught up." Beats an error.
IMHO the checklist change made things WORSE, not better. Now I sit and wait for a command from the Captain which may, or may not, come. He might be busy. Meanwhile, I get busy. Then it gets forgotten until it is really embarrassing for everyone. The "do what you need to do when it needs doing" philosophy is safer, IMHO.
Think I'll just star putting flaps out, then apologizing for it. Cpt. JG will make me cycle the flaps just to prove he's in charge. Honey Badger ... .
01-26-2012, 01:26 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Position: 320B
Posts: 511
Originally Posted by buzzpat
Hey Tomcat, it's great to have you back. How've you been? You ought to see the new pilot digs in LA. First renovation since Pan Am Clippers were flying to Midway.
Glad to hear everything worked out with your family emergency lately. At the end of the day, it's about the people we work with that makes us proud to work at Delta.
V/R, TC
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