Recession and furlough at other airlines and they are taking new airplanes and hire new pilots?
WB,
Wow! I don't wish a furlough on my worst enemy but you seem to get your kicks beating on those that are already down. If this was bragging or an attempt at some sort of humor, your sensitivity chip needs replacing.
There might be other reasons why you have vacancies. One of them sat next to me for three days last week. He certainly filled me in on what it is really like at JB (pay, schedules, reserve, etc.). Are you sure having a union on property won't help improve things?
I know very well what it feels like to be furloughed.
I did not try to put anyone down, quite to the opposite-
tell a furloughed guy that JetBlue is hiring!
As far as the union is concerned - in case you did not notice - we just voted that down.
If you like your union, stay. If your union allowed you to get furloughed - send an application to us.
WB,
Just to let you know I am quite aware that your pilot group rejected and in-house union recently. I have also read all of your posts in that regard and I believe your positions are quite apparent.
Perhaps I misread your post and you did not mean to put people down. My sensitive nature must have interpreted a slight when one was not there. I will watch for your future statements to see if I was totally wrong. Please review the post and perhaps you will see why I might have interpreted it that way and believe it to be at least flippant. I will say that blaming furloughs (in your last post) on unions that "allowed" them might engage my sensitivity mode so if you wish to explain I am all ears.
Perhaps you should also know that I am not a big union guy. I do know what they have done for me and others in the past and recognize that achievements were made through the existence of those unions. I am also aware of mistakes that have been made by unions by overreaching at times and taking advantage of management in much the same way they accused management of doing to them. Balance between two opposing forces should be the goal. If you believe that your management will do the right thing by your pilot group, so be it. Many of us will be observing to see if this will come to fruition.
You did not address my reference to the FO that I flew with last week (former JB). Between those on property at SWA that left JB and my good friend who is a CP at JB I believe I am getting pretty good info. Is your flippant remark that JB is starting classes and NOT furloughing meant to imply that things are perfect there? If so, I beg to differ. One only need to look at your pay scale (especially on the 190) and some of your work rules to realize that with or without a union you guys have a lot of improvements to make!
Let me also say that I don't believe that things are perfect here at SWA, but (as I have said in the past) they don't suck either.
I know very well what it feels like to be furloughed.
I did not try to put anyone down, quite to the opposite-
tell a furloughed guy that JetBlue is hiring!
As far as the union is concerned - in case you did not notice - we just voted that down.
If you like your union, stay. If your union allowed you to get furloughed - send an application to us.
Is Jetblue is hiring or growing? Didn't think so myself.
Be careful. Any airline that "needs" to furlough will do so!
You're not immune cos you are being paid less than your brothers at all the other Majors which all happen to be unionized.
Just to let you know I am quite aware that your pilot group rejected and in-house union recently. I have also read all of your posts in that regard and I believe your positions are quite apparent.
Perhaps I misread your post and you did not mean to put people down. My sensitive nature must have interpreted a slight when one was not there. I will watch for your future statements to see if I was totally wrong. Please review the post and perhaps you will see why I might have interpreted it that way and believe it to be at least flippant. I will say that blaming furloughs (in your last post) on unions that "allowed" them might engage my sensitivity mode so if you wish to explain I am all ears.
Perhaps you should also know that I am not a big union guy. I do know what they have done for me and others in the past and recognize that achievements were made through the existence of those unions. I am also aware of mistakes that have been made by unions by overreaching at times and taking advantage of management in much the same way they accused management of doing to them. Balance between two opposing forces should be the goal. If you believe that your management will do the right thing by your pilot group, so be it. Many of us will be observing to see if this will come to fruition.
You did not address my reference to the FO that I flew with last week (former JB). Between those on property at SWA that left JB and my good friend who is a CP at JB I believe I am getting pretty good info. Is your flippant remark that JB is starting classes and NOT furloughing meant to imply that things are perfect there? If so, I beg to differ. One only need to look at your pay scale (especially on the 190) and some of your work rules to realize that with or without a union you guys have a lot of improvements to make!
Let me also say that I don't believe that things are perfect here at SWA, but (as I have said in the past) they don't suck either.
The Oscar
But then, unlike WB, you could always negotiate improvements.
Recession and furlough at other airlines and they are taking new airplanes and hire new pilots?
There are quite a few pilot groups out there that are represented by Unions who AREN'T furloughing. As a matter of fact, AirTran has offered recalls to all pilots who were furloughed, and no furloughs at DAL/NWA just to name a few.
Oh, and you can thank the Unions who fought hard over the last 60+ years for contracts and workrules. If it wasn't for them, there would be no basis for that contract you have at JB. All be it the gem that it is.
P.S. Sorry for the thread drift. Good Luck and Congrats to the JB Newhires.
I know very well what it feels like to be furloughed.
I did not try to put anyone down, quite to the opposite-
tell a furloughed guy that JetBlue is hiring!
As far as the union is concerned - in case you did not notice - we just voted that down.
If you like your union, stay. If your union allowed you to get furloughed - send an application to us.
So WB,
Without a union, how are those muchneeded and long overdue improvements coming along ?
There are quite a few pilot groups out there that are represented by Unions who ARENT furloughing. As a matter of fact, AirTran has offered recalls to all pilots who were furloughed, and no furloughs at DAL/NWA just to name a few.
Oh, and you can thank the Unions who fought hard over the last 60+ years for contracts and workrules. If it wasn't for them, there would be no basis for that contract you have a JB. All be it the gem that it is.
P.S. Sorry for the thread drift. Good Luck and Congrats to the JB Newhires.
I wish the best to all pilots on furlough.
I have to say, the vast majority of pilots I know are not on furlough. I have friends at all the majors and all have been there for 3 years plus and have remained unaffected with the exception of 1 UAL guy.
My friends at CAL and AT are both junior but were also unaffected by furloughs there.
Also, certain younger airlines are not affected by the age 65 rule like the legacies!
Of course, management at certain airlines like to weild the "others are/or will furlough" card to justify relatively low pay. Trouble is, no guaruntee of relatively greater job security comes with those inferior paychecks!
Some are either too spooked or stupid to see through this.
I can tell you that Waterboarder does not speak for all JetBlue pilots. I, along with 646 other pilots are embarrassed that we did not vote for representation. he is apparently still under the impression that management will "do the right thing". The only good to come out of this mess is that there is now a ALPA drive starting. It's tasteless to discuss furloughs, myself being one of them. Let me know when you get your raise Waterboarder, I know management will "take care of us"
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He certainly filled me in on what it is really like at JB (pay, schedules, reserve, etc.). Are you sure having a union on property won't help improve things?
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