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Major Legacy, National, and LCC

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Old 10-19-2009, 11:02 AM   #191 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by slowplay View Post
How do you think that'll work out for them next year, after the DCA resets kick in?
I said nothing about next year, I said historically.

Fact is that they have awesome margins. If they are not in the bottom two at DOC+5 those resets are going to kill about every DCI airline out there.
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Old 10-19-2009, 12:37 PM   #192 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by nwa757 View Post
I find it interesting how mainline pilots are worried about 'what they would have to give up' in order to negotiate for Compass, or combine the lists.

Think about everything that regional pilots have had to give up for years now. Since 9/11, regional pilots have 'given up':

-a livable wage to raise a family or pay a mortgage. $20k doesn't even compare to six figures.
-job security, wondering if your company's aircraft will be shuffled around next year
-whipsawing until no tomorrow
-sub par work rules, including no cancellation pay, etc.
-furloughs mean starting over at another crappy regional for $20k
-working under contracts that are 1/2 of what mainline contracts are.
-being betrayed by people like Lee Moak in order to use scope as a bargaining chip


Not to name a list of complaints, but I wish this could be a wake up call for some.

Regional pilots have been giving up things like this for years, and now it would take a nice collective effort and sacrifice for mainline pilots to bend over backwards a bit to help the young.
I see it differently. Over the last decade I've seen exponential growth at most regionals at the expense of mainline. The guys starting at $19/hour went willingly to build hours, fly jets or whatever, knowing that growth was coming from mainline carriers all over the country. New captains were minted like pennies while mainline pilots saw the road to captain virtually disappear. I don't see any benefit in bringing regional carriers onto mainline except of course for the regional guys who've already received our growth and possibly as furlough protection for the most junior mainline guys. Merging mainline and regional lists would be a nightmare as well. I think the best strategy is to use our negotiating capital to draw a line against any further outsourcing and increase payscales and QOL, bringing more higher paying jobs to the mainline for anyone interested in pursuing them.
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Old 10-19-2009, 01:06 PM   #193 (permalink)
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Default H50 you would see if differently

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Originally Posted by Hawaii50 View Post
I see it differently. Over the last decade I've seen exponential growth at most regionals at the expense of mainline. The guys starting at $19/hour went willingly to build hours, fly jets or whatever, knowing that growth was coming from mainline carriers all over the country. New captains were minted like pennies while mainline pilots saw the road to captain virtually disappear. I don't see any benefit in bringing regional carriers onto mainline except of course for the regional guys who've already received our growth and possibly as furlough protection for the most junior mainline guys. Merging mainline and regional lists would be a nightmare as well. I think the best strategy is to use our negotiating capital to draw a line against any further outsourcing and increase payscales and QOL, bringing more higher paying jobs to the mainline for anyone interested in pursuing them.
You are reading Nwa757's opinion. It reflects his background, your opinion reflects your background and experiences. If you read the past posts from Nwa757 you will likely form the opinion that it isn't from anyone who ever flew in the majors let alone a NWA 757. He is stating what many at the regionals post: their opinions of what should happen at the majors that will be to THEIR benefit.

Last edited by ratsnrip : 10-19-2009 at 01:07 PM. Reason: missed a preposition
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Old 10-19-2009, 02:03 PM   #194 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ratsnrip View Post
You are reading Nwa757's opinion. It reflects his background, your opinion reflects your background and experiences. If you read the past posts from Nwa757 you will likely form the opinion that it isn't from anyone who ever flew in the majors let alone a NWA 757. He is stating what many at the regionals post: their opinions of what should happen at the majors that will be to THEIR benefit.
If pilots didn't use scope as a bargaining chip than NWA757 would be flying at mainline instead of a regional. If he didn't take the job someone else would have. However, if the "regional" jobs were never made available in the first place everyone would be happy. No arguing with that, so I'd call that fact and not opinion. Just look at first year pay at every airline. We take from those who don't even have a voice for our own greed.
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