Not that I support Nancy's Public Health Care Plan, but does anyone think that there will be more senior pilots retiring prior to 65 or more Pilots willing to take an airline offered early retirement program (Like the Delta PERP) if there was a Public Health Care Plan? Just curious as to your thoughts on how this may effect our industry and seniority lists.
I doubt it. Don't forget who you're dealing with here... the baby boomer "I got mine" & "me, me, me" generation.
They'll keep taking more and more. If they get health care from the government, they'll just take that and keep working until they are 65. More cash in their bank accounts.
I doubt it. Don't forget who you're dealing with here... the baby boomer "I got mine" & "me, me, me" generation.
They'll keep taking more and more. If they get health care from the government, they'll just take that and keep working until they are 65. More cash in their bank accounts.
The rules have changed. Get over it. You're painting a very large and diverse group with a very broad brush.
I think your image of a senior captain is delusional. Rather than someone who is wealthy, yet stays after age sixty out of greed, it's more likely that he is someone who was headed toward a moderately comfortable retirement until the pension disappeared, and the stock market imploded.
Next thing, you're going to be calling a pilot over 60 a scab...
The rules have changed. Get over it. You're painting a very large and diverse group with a very broad brush.
This same sentence could be aimed at all the people who paint the people "under 40" with the "entitlement/me generation". Some food for thought. I don't blame people staying over 60 anymore than I blame 20 and 30 somethings for taking RJ jobs for crappy wages. The rules have changed, rather than demonizing the people who are staying/starting, perhaps if we feel so strongly about this, we should set out to change the rules? Balancing out the wages so that they aren't so top heavy would be a great way to start with getting people to retire earlier so that they don't feel they HAVE to stay just to make up for the years of poverty at the beginning, and taking back scope will stop the talk about the people taking jobs for peanuts. Would it be easy? No. Might it require some sort of B-scale for new people starting at an airline, so as not to screw the people already at the top? Yes. Will it require some sacrifices by mainline to resecure scope? Yes. Will it require some sacrifices by regionals to somewhat slower overall career progression? Yes. It's a mixed bag folks, but throwing around names and insulting ANY generation of people does nothing but hurt ourselves and create division.
Not that I support Nancy's Public Health Care Plan, but does anyone think that there will be more senior pilots retiring prior to 65 or more Pilots willing to take an airline offered early retirement program (Like the Delta PERP) if there was a Public Health Care Plan?
Guys staying past 60 don't **** me off. It's the ones who pick up overtime when junior guys are on furlough. At least at my airline, a huge number of our 60+ guys have never ever been furloughed in their career, but are more than willing to throw the junior guys under the bus for a few more $$$ in their pockets.
We still have our A-Plan on the property, so I don't want to hear the no pension argument.
So, that's what gets under my skin. It's not the rule change, but the behavior of the over 60 crowd with regard to flexing up to the monthly max and signing up for time and half trips.
Maybe they should have invested their money wisely in their younger years and not been thrice divorced with a big house, a cabin in the woods, boat, etc. That's their own fault, but the junior guys have to pay for it I guess.
I'll finish up here... but, we actually have a handful of these 60+ guys who are quite wealthy and don't need this job. They could have retired years ago, but they are sticking around because "they are having fun doing this job." The total disregard towards the plight of a young family not being able to put food on the table, because they are having fun makes my blood boil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CVG767A
The rules have changed. Get over it. You're painting a very large and diverse group with a very broad brush.
I think your image of a senior captain is delusional. Rather than someone who is wealthy, yet stays after age sixty out of greed, it's more likely that he is someone who was headed toward a moderately comfortable retirement until the pension disappeared, and the stock market imploded.
Next thing, you're going to be calling a pilot over 60 a scab...
Not that I support Nancy's Public Health Care Plan, but does anyone think that there will be more senior pilots retiring prior to 65 or more Pilots willing to take an airline offered early retirement program (Like the Delta PERP) if there was a Public Health Care Plan? Just curious as to your thoughts on how this may effect our industry and seniority lists.
(1) That's Speaker Pelosi to you. Let's keep respectful tongues in our mouths.
(Actually, I blame the media for this - where I'm from you refer to your politicians, like them or not, by their title and last name. But the news media doesn't anymore.)
(2) Probably not. Given the royal rogering that the pilot profession has received, combined with the financial crisis evaporating what if anything was left of everyone's retirements, it will take more than cheap healthcare to make the area codes punch out.
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It sounds like it's my duty to more junior guys to retire immediately...
Please don't. I feel better when I get on a jet and see people with gray hair in the cockpit. (Something about old, bold, but no old and bold )
__________________
"Gear down, flaps thirty, before landing checklist."
Just don't be oblivious to what's going on with your pilot group. If you're part of a union, act like it. Lift a finger to help out the junior guys.
Are you the type of person who would contribute money to the furloughed pilots' fund? Are you the type of guy who would vote yes for an assessment to provide medical coverage for your furloughed brothers and sisters? Are you willing to drop down to your monthly min to save some jobs? If the answer is yes, then great. Stay until you're 65.
Almost none of your 60+ guys are willing to do any of the things I mentioned above to help.
You don't like the fact that I'm painting with a broad brush. I see the behavior of the senior guys at my airline. But, I've also talked to my friends at other airlines. Their experience has been about the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CVG767A
It sounds like it's my duty to more junior guys to retire immediately...
Are you the type of person who would contribute money to the furloughed pilots' fund? Are you the type of guy who would vote yes for an assessment to provide medical coverage for your furloughed brothers and sisters? Are you willing to drop down to your monthly min to save some jobs? If the answer is yes, then great. Stay until you're 65.
Almost none of your 60+ guys are willing to do any of the things I mentioned above to help.
You don't like the fact that I'm painting with a broad brush. I see the behavior of the senior guys at my airline. But, I've also talked to my friends at other airlines. Their experience has been about the same.
Tough to say for sure. At pre-merger Delta, we don't have enough 60+ year-olds to draw any conclusion, and I'd be surprised if there is a very big group at any other airline. (The law didn't change that long ago).
We do have a history of passing those type of assessments by an overwhelming margin, though, so I would guess that the very senior guys voted for them, too.
I've got to wonder if you (a) actually know that many pilots that are over 60 years old, (b) know how they have voted on assessments, and (c) have seen their pay sheets for the month. The senior guy you describe is more myth than reality, IMO.
FWIW, you never have, and never will, see me painting any group with a broad brush.
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