I guess the pay rate really doesn't tell the whole story if you're on reserve or on a reduced schedule. Anyway, bottom line for me is pay per day. That's the way I bid, it's not for everybody. I am really happy with the new contract because I'll average over $1000 per day of work as an FO. And of course, I'll be overnight in El Paso not Paris.
At any rate, good luck to us all. If pilot pay rates determined the success of a company, the industry would be making money hand over fist right now.
Last edited by LuvJockey : 11-02-2009 at 10:05 PM.
I think our guarantee is only 884, but a lot will be well below that this year. The other thing, this is our final raise until the next contract is signed in 2011 or 2015. You guys are not that dumb.
We do have annual raises including one on the ammendable date, hope everyone is still on the property. Since we are having to take everything in our contract to arbitration to get the company to live up to the agreement I wouldn't call us that smart.
I guess the pay rate really doesn't tell the whole story if you're on reserve or on a reduced schedule. Anyway, bottom line for me is pay per day. That's the way I bid, it's not for everybody. I am really happy with the new contract because I'll average over $1000 per day of work as an FO. And of course, I'll be overnight in El Paso not Paris.
At any rate, good luck to us all. If pilot pay rates determined the success of a company, the industry would be making money hand over fist right now.
Glad the Southwest guys where able to get a bump upwards and the last paragraph is what we should all remember when they come to us for concessions of any kind.
The scope language is excellent. Our Union Preident said it best.
"As any observer will note from my writings over the last few years, nothing is more important to our pilot group than our scope language. And this contract significantly improves our contract in this area. It provides protections for our pilot group that many other groups only dream of."
This is what sold me in the end.
Hopefully I was clear: I think the WN guys are great, your working conditions are great, and to turn down a TA and get one with even better Scope language is incredible. Being a 190 pilot at JetBlue Scope is number one on my priority list (as is convincing my fellow pilots we need a CBA even with recent improvements.....).
It just saddens me that we're celebrating an almost-return to levels from nearly a decade ago, with very little real opportunities for improvement in the real future. The ROI on this career has probably never been lower.
Hopefully I was clear: I think the WN guys are great, your working conditions are great, and to turn down a TA and get one with even better Scope language is incredible. Being a 190 pilot at JetBlue Scope is number one on my priority list (as is convincing my fellow pilots we need a CBA even with recent improvements.....).
It just saddens me that we're celebrating an almost-return to levels from nearly a decade ago, with very little real opportunities for improvement in the real future. The ROI on this career has probably never been lower.
That's fine, I'm pretty happy the contract. It raises the bar for narrow body pay (highest ever, I don't understand the hand-wringing sadness about the this, but whatever dude). Anyway, I hope your company raises the bar at some point in the future. As for very little opportunities for improvements, we open negotiations again in two years.
I don't have any axe to grind with the JB guys, I don't know how things are over there, I have several friends that work there.
Last edited by LuvJockey : 11-03-2009 at 08:32 PM.
That's fine, I'm pretty happy the contract. It raises the bar for narrow body pay (highest ever, I don't understand the hand-wringing sadness about the this, but whatever dude). Anyway, I hope your company raises the bar at some point in the future. As for very little opportunities for improvements, we open negotiations again in two years.
I don't have any axe to grind with the JB guys, I don't know how things are over there, I have several friends that work there.
I think he is just saying that it's sad that we are just now getting back to where we were in 2000.
I, for one, am happy that we are at least talking about pay raises again instead of paycuts. Congrats to the Southwest guys! Now it is up to AA, DAL, UAL, and CAL to keep the trend going.
Are your narrowbody payrates published yet? Also, does anyone have the pre-9/11 payrates from DAL and UAL? I'd like to see how far we've come (or, returned to).
The best I can tell, DAL 737 Pilots were SUPPOSED to make $229.67 per hour in 2004. I don't think the contract made it that far.
New K Now
__________________
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First, thanks to the guys that recognize the importance of the scope portion of the language.
Second, all we've gotten for the legacies here is the 2001 rate of $80/hr for the 737 (at 2nd year). SWA rate is around $135/hr (8th year) and around $93 (2nd year) still well above the "good old days", but we are still hand wringing, and I don't know why. We are getting back to where we were back in 2000? I don't understand that, but hey, we are all collectively saddened according to the JetBlue E190 First Officer. I will let him explain why.
Third, as far as I can tell, I don't know what DAL pilots were SUPPOSED to make in 2004. I am just a First Officer, I guess you're saying that all DAL first officers were SUPPOSED to make $229.67 an hour. To be honest, I am preparing to raise the Barbra Streisand Flag once again Mr. NewKnow. Please enlighten all of us as to where you came up with the figure of $229.67. That's pretty specific, please don't make me call you a liar.
Fourth, NewKnow said "just now getting back to where we were in 2000." Can you please explain that?
Fifth, if this post angers you, I'm not sorry. Pay and Scope are the most important sections of your contract. If management convinces you otherwise, then they've done their job. The economy is bad, I am lucky to have a job, I'd do this job for free, look at that big shiny jet, I travel the world, my neighbors look up to me, this is my dream job, labor costs must come down, they pay this rate because they can, I make industry average, times are tough, nobody is willing to strike, just happy to be here, I have a retirement anyway, I'd cross a picket line, we're a major now so maybe I'll be able to fly an AirBus. No, I've never said any of that.
Last edited by LuvJockey : 11-03-2009 at 10:24 PM.
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