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Air Tran 717's reported to go to Delta

Old 04-09-2012, 11:27 AM
  #511  
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News about the aircraft market from AirInsight.

Additionally - not in this article - talk of a GTF 737 is back on. The 737 Leap X is 2% more efficient than the Airbus alternative. A GTF variant could be decisively better. ... and the 777-X will be larger than the A350, only about 40 or 50 seats smaller than the 747-800.

Although Airbus and Boeing came off a record year for orders in 2011 and Boeing is expected to have a record year this year as nearly 1,000 commitments for the 737 MAX are converted to orders, there are plenty of worrisome signs across commercial aviation and throughout the world that this year and next could be worse than appears on the surface.
Airlines and leasing companies are reporting decent earnings. But there not only is plenty of visible evidence that all is not well, behind the scenes there are plenty of concerns.
The visible signs of emerging trouble:
  • Aviation in India is an unmitigated disaster, with Kingfisher, Air India and Jet Airways all experiencing difficulties. Kingfisher is on the verge of collapse and Air India is operating only through the largess of the government. Jet is struggling.
  • Carriers in Asia and Australia are struggling. AirAsiaX found that its low-fare, long haul service is unsustainable in European markets. It used Europe’s ETS scheme as an excuse to withdraw, but economics of low-yield service from Asia to Europe as problematic even in the best of circumstances. The fuel pricing environment today hardly falls within that characterization. Australia has seen recent air carrier failures and the financial results from several Asian airlines are poor.
  • Europe has seen the collapse of several airlines.
  • Ryanair and easyJet, which have depended on aircraft sales of middle-aged aircraft to boost income, now find the market for these aircraft dried up with financing unavailable to potential buyers.
  • Fuel prices passed the $100bbl mark again, on the way to $105bbl and even higher. The Middle East’s geopolitical situation appears to be getting worse, particularly with the rhetoric of the US presidential campaign heating up. Some Republican candidates are openly advocating military action against Iran and Israel is threatening to unilaterally bomb Iran’s nuclear facilities. President Obama is trying to walk a fine line between sanctions and being forced into military action. The situation in Syria remains volatile and the situations in Egypt and Libya remain unstable.
  • Some lessors are finding increasing numbers of aircraft between leases or soft lease rates. Boeing 757 lease rates are coming under severe pressure as United Airlines prepares to place a major order next month for a replacement. United’s management, dominated by the Continental group following the merger of the two carriers, wants to dump the older, Pratt & Whitney-powered 757s operated by legacy United (Continental’s newer 757s are Rolls-powered). This means leases rates being demanded by United from lessors to keep the airplanes for a few more years are reported to be as low as $90,000 per month.
AirInsight is viewing the next 18 months with growing caution as these and other factors build in frequency across the globe. Cargo traffic remains a leading indicator for passenger airlines, and this was softening in the last few months of 2011. Although we fully expect airplane orders to continue to be strong, we also believe the OEMs will face growing skyline management issues.
  • Pratt powered 757's? Yummy. I'd sure like those more than 717's or 737's.
  • Airbus is not getting paid by Kingfisher in India, neither are their employees, who have ceased coming to work.
  • The GTF is coming in on Spec. Airplanes should be flying in December. Engines can got to 100,000 pounds of thrust! Widebody applications actually work better as the technology scales up well. Even after taking penalties for fan size (weight & drag) the engine it supposed to be 16% more efficient than those currently offered. A GTF 787-900 anyone?
  • There is activity all over the market all of a sudden.

Last edited by Bucking Bar; 04-09-2012 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 04-09-2012, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Bucking Bar View Post
News about the aircraft market from AirInsight.

Additionally - not in this article - talk of a GTF 737 is back on. The 737 Leap X is 2% more efficient than the Airbus alternative. A GTF variant could be decisively better. ... and the 777-X will be larger than the A350, only about 40 or 50 seats smaller than the 747-800.

  • Pratt powered 757's? Yummy. I'd sure like those more than 717's or 737's.
  • Airbus is not getting paid by Kingfisher in India, neither are their employees, who have ceased coming to work.
  • The GTF is coming in on Spec. Airplanes should be flying in December.
  • There is activity all over the market all of a sudden.
Why not all of the above? More 757s, 737s and 717s? They're all different. Except that both the 737 and 757 are 763 replacements.
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Old 04-09-2012, 11:40 AM
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C Series Update ... go to 9:20 for a brief economics discussion.

Chet Fuller Bombardier ISTAT 2012 - YouTube

Flight Deck:

http://youtu.be/YyVa8amVPig

Shame it isn't cheap.

Last edited by Bucking Bar; 04-09-2012 at 11:52 AM.
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Old 04-09-2012, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Bucking Bar View Post
Shame it isn't cheap.
It will be if they want to actually sell any.
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Old 04-09-2012, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by gloopy View Post
It will be if they want to actually sell any.

Agreed, and they want to sell some to a Major airline in North America.
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Old 04-09-2012, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
Agreed, and they want to sell some to a Major airline in North America.
If you count Republic Airlines Holdings as a major, they already are.
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Old 04-09-2012, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
Agreed, and they want to sell some to a Major airline in North America.
Well let's make a deal.

We have 350+ CRJ-200s... what can you do with those?

Unfortunately, still might not be enough to make it happen. Bombardier has run down a dark alley that Embraer was too scared to go down, and all Embraer is hearing is Bombardier taking a beating. And Embraer is tip toeing away and probably will not call 911 and never sleep well again.

Maybe, since anything smaller than the 737-700 or A319 has been a market flop thus far, and since both A&B skipped out on the RJ craze, maybe they can get back in that market by buying the darn thing and selling it as their own? Use a little North American pride action or maybe a French connection?

The Boeing C7? Airbus C100?

Takers?
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Old 04-09-2012, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Boomer View Post
If you count Republic Airlines Holdings as a major, they already are.
I just threw up in my mouth a little bit.
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Old 04-09-2012, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by forgot to bid View Post
Well let's make a deal.

We have 350+ CRJ-200s... what can you do with those?
Freighters!
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Old 04-09-2012, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp View Post
Freighters!
No money in freight!
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