Details on Delta TA
05-21-2015, 08:10 PM
#4541
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by Onigawara
I understand the "wait and see" but, current rumors of scope give backs both on the wide body side as well as small jet (76 seat continued proliferation), minuscule gains in pay, per diem, vacation and training, etc... Coupled w/ profit sharing reductions, do not bode well. Tag on LOE/TOE givebacks with additional acquiescence on the ever hard to define sick leave "issue" and it isn't adding up to a significant improvement / winning C15. It seems to me the indications are that "productivity enhancement" will surpass tangible net gains for the pilot group. Am I alone in this impression?
Jerry and his homies are the worst rumor spreaders out there... and mostly it's just sensationalism to get a rise. I HATE it when someone does that.
I hope I'm not proven wrong. I'll try to vote yes just like I tried to vote yes on C2012, and will vote no as need be just like I voted no on 2012. If it's lackluster, I'll absolutely join you.
Costing of the package and pay rates have yet to be exchanged, so anything spread as concrete is actually a good ways away from being anything on solid ground. I refuse to raise the pitchforks and torches until something solid comes about.
It's a strange day when I end up agreeing with sailing.
I believe the next meeting is in another week or so.
05-21-2015, 08:11 PM
#4542
Super Moderator
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DAL 330
Posts: 6,865
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
I do have some connections, and I'm not seeing this playing out in that manner yet. Everything that Jerry has yelled about has not come to fruition.
The big red flag on my horizon is the fact that harwood has inserted himself in the process again.
Other than that, I'm in wait and see mode given what I know.
The big red flag on my horizon is the fact that harwood has inserted himself in the process again.
Other than that, I'm in wait and see mode given what I know.
Ditto. But I really don't like the rumors that I am hearing, very reminiscent of C2012. Lets hope the majority of the rumors are BS, but I have a bad feeling about some of them.
We do have one big advantage this time - PS is steadily rising and a deal with any concessions, even a few, will have a very hard time passing memory rat.
I say this as someone who voted yes on C2012, but my minimum level of an acceptable contract has increased proportionally to the DAL profits.
Let the NC do their best - if its not good enough we will give then another chance.
Scoop
Last edited by Scoop; 05-22-2015 at 07:12 AM.
05-21-2015, 08:12 PM
#4543
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2009
Position: Lowest Pay I Could Find
Posts: 1,044
Originally Posted by Onigawara
I understand the "wait and see" but, current rumors of scope give backs both on the wide body side as well as small jet (76 seat continued proliferation), minuscule gains in pay, per diem, vacation and training, etc... Coupled w/ profit sharing reductions, do not bode well. Tag on LOE/TOE givebacks with additional acquiescence on the ever hard to define sick leave "issue" and it isn't adding up to a significant improvement / winning C15. It seems to me the indications are that "productivity enhancement" will surpass tangible net gains for the pilot group. Am I alone in this impression?
05-21-2015, 08:16 PM
#4544
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by Scoop
Ditto. But I really don't like the rumors that I am hearing, very reminiscent of C2012. Lets hope the majority of the rumors are BS, but I have a bad feeling about some of them.
We do have one big advantage this time - PS is steadily rising and a deal with any concessions, even a few, will have a very hard time passing memory rat.
I say this as someone who voted yes on C2012, but my minimum level of an acceptable contract has increased proportionally to the DAL profits.
Let the NC do there best - if its not good enough we will give then another chance.
Scoop
We do have one big advantage this time - PS is steadily rising and a deal with any concessions, even a few, will have a very hard time passing memory rat.
I say this as someone who voted yes on C2012, but my minimum level of an acceptable contract has increased proportionally to the DAL profits.
Let the NC do there best - if its not good enough we will give then another chance.
Scoop
There are a couple individuals (no acl) that I highly respect that have MEC input whom I've had very frank conversations with... that gives me some optimism this time around.
Again, the big red flag is Harwood.
05-21-2015, 09:46 PM
#4545
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Posts: 335
Originally Posted by Purple Drank
And it's laughable to think MEM would have voted in favor.
05-22-2015, 02:59 AM
#4546
Runs with scissors
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
Posts: 7,722
You know, if I was a negotiator and showed up at a MEC meeting to sell more concessions, in this time of unprecedented profits, already paid for by our concessions for the past 11 years, I'd cry too...
05-22-2015, 03:11 AM
#4547
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,919
Originally Posted by Timbo
You know, if I was a negotiator and showed up at a MEC meeting to sell more concessions, in this time of unprecedented profits, already paid for by our concessions for the past 11 years, I'd cry too...
05-22-2015, 03:28 AM
#4548
Straight QOL, homie
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
Posts: 4,202
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
The big red flag on my horizon is the fact that harwood has inserted himself in the process again.
Other than that, I'm in wait and see mode given what I know.
Also confirmed: concessionary changes to sick leave. I think it's safe to say that concession directly opposes the survey results.
Those are not rumors. Those are confirmed as approved by the MEC. As additional confirmation, note that none of the usual Dalpa suspects are denying it.
Guys, we're in trouble. It's time to mash the panic button and spread the word.
Last edited by Purple Drank; 05-22-2015 at 03:40 AM.
05-22-2015, 03:41 AM
#4549
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,919
Originally Posted by Purple Drank
We've already got confirmation that a concession not in the survey (LCAs' trips removed from FO PBS bidding) has been granted.
Also confirmed: concessionary changes to sick leave. I think it's safe to say that concession directly opposes the survey results.
Those are not rumors. Those are confirmed as approved by the MEC. As additional confirmation, note that none of the usual Dalpa suspects are denying it.
Guys, we're in trouble. It's time to mash the panic button and spread the word.
Also confirmed: concessionary changes to sick leave. I think it's safe to say that concession directly opposes the survey results.
Those are not rumors. Those are confirmed as approved by the MEC. As additional confirmation, note that none of the usual Dalpa suspects are denying it.
Guys, we're in trouble. It's time to mash the panic button and spread the word.
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