Originally Posted by alfaromeo (Post 806195)

ALPA Merger Policy was changed last year. There are three factors to consider in building the list. This is not a priority list (the first one listed isn't necessarily the most important) and there is no weight given to any factor. They are:

1. Status and category
2. Longevity
3. Career expectations

So longevity, or date of hire, is a consideration.

Originally Posted by Captain Bligh (Post 806182)

Not to mention the fact that if you do get a copy of SoCal's relative list, the first thing you may notice is that there are CAL pilots on the list that were born in 1938, a few in 1942... I doubt that the list holds any more credibility than the straight DOH list.

Originally Posted by LifeNtheFstLne (Post 806214)

Longevity and date of hire are not interchangeable terms. One can easily have many years since they were hired and only a few of them be active (ex: UAL guys that have been furloughed twice). There seems to be much confusion over this. Longevity for pay purposes is contract specific.

Originally Posted by chuckyt1 (Post 806216)

Can anyone confirm, or deny, that the dissenting opinion of the Nicolau Award was written by a member of the CAL Merger Committee?

Originally Posted by cactusdog16 (Post 806143)

The main reason for relative seniority being on one side of the windfall spectrum is the preponderance of widebodies at UAL and career expectations. Roughly 58% of UAL's fleet are widebodies (if you include the 757 in that mix as it is flown as the same fleet as the 767), while only 31% of CAL's current fleet is widebody (again, including their 757s). A pilot who is halfway up UAL's seniority list is much closer to a more lucrative widebody position than a pilot who is half way up CAL's seniority list. If you merge simply by relative seniority, all CAL pilots are much closer to the higher paying equipment, while all UAL pilots are further away than they were pre-merger, or even bumped off. Simply stated, UAL is bringing mostly widebodies to the merger, while CAL is bringing mostly narrowbodies.

Even fences will not fix this problem as most of us who are under 60 are in this for the long haul. No one is going to put up a 25-year fence.

Strict date-of-hire would not be fair either, as UAL's most junior active pilot (after the Tilton furlough) is several years senior to the most junior CAL Captain.

As many have already said, it will not be strict DOH or strict relative seniority, but some conglomeration of both along with several other factors.

Originally Posted by LifeNtheFstLne (Post 806214)

Longevity and date of hire are not interchangeable terms. One can easily have many years since they were hired and only a few of them be active (ex: UAL guys that have been furloughed twice). There seems to be much confusion over this. Longevity for pay purposes is contract specific.

Originally Posted by SoCalGuy (Post 806222)

I think the term you maybe looking for is "Year's of Service"??.....Actually being active on property.

Just a guess....could be wrong.

Originally Posted by cactusdog16 (Post 806143)

The main reason for relative seniority being on one side of the windfall spectrum is the preponderance of widebodies at UAL and career expectations. Roughly 58% of UAL's fleet are widebodies (if you include the 757 in that mix as it is flown as the same fleet as the 767), while only 31% of CAL's current fleet is widebody (again, including their 757s). A pilot who is halfway up UAL's seniority list is much closer to a more lucrative widebody position than a pilot who is half way up CAL's seniority list. If you merge simply by relative seniority, all CAL pilots are much closer to the higher paying equipment, while all UAL pilots are further away than they were pre-merger, or even bumped off. Simply stated, UAL is bringing mostly widebodies to the merger, while CAL is bringing mostly narrowbodies.

Even fences will not fix this problem as most of us who are under 60 are in this for the long haul. No one is going to put up a 25-year fence.

Strict date-of-hire would not be fair either, as UAL's most junior active pilot (after the Tilton furlough) is several years senior to the most junior CAL Captain.

As many have already said, it will not be strict DOH or strict relative seniority, but some conglomeration of both along with several other factors.

Originally Posted by thor2j (Post 806286)

Boy you've got this all screwed up. CAL's career expectation are 10x that of UAL pilots. Yes there are more widebodies at UAL, but years to upgrade are 500 times sooner then those at UAL. UALs career expectations are pretty much nada. UAL will fence the 747 and CAL will need to fence upgrades for 10 years. A 2005 hire at CAL is less then 40% on the FO over all list.