Tshugart3

So I did the math to figure out about what it would cost for me to change careers and go fly for a living. Looks like I'd have to fly until about 2035 to break even with where I'd be financially if I kept going in the Navy and retired in 2022 (at 30 yrs service).

My calculations assumed the following:
- that I make O-6 in 2016 and retire at that pay grade in 2018.
- that I can knock out my instrument and commercial in the next year or so, and leave here with about 300-400 hrs.
- that I can get my CFI and knock out another 1000-1100 hrs in the two years after that, so that I'm at 1500 hrs soon after I retire. I can do this either by CFI or by just buying a plane and flying the heck out of it, changing my own oil, etc.
- that I get hired by 2020 by a regional at 1500 hrs and after getting the ATP
- I used Piedmont Airlines pay scale
- that I am a regional for six years, FO for 4 and then upgrade for two years and get 1000 TPIC in two years
- that I get picked up by a major after 6 years at a regional (I know that this very optimistic, but I keep hearing about LOTS of retirements happening in the next few years).
- That I am a FO at a major for about 10 years and then make CA, after which point I'd have about four years until mando retirement.

Please let me know if I'm totally out to lunch on any of this. I know that a lot of my time estimates are very different than they have been for others in the past, but by my math (counting up retirements as listed online), about half of the pilots at the majors will have to retire in the next ten or so years. I also know that I have the financial means to get over the 1500 hr hurdle that I know is now slowing down a lot of other prospective airline pilots.

Thanks again to all for your advice so far.

USMCFLYR

Sooooooo.......even though a majority of the posters, especially those former military members, are telling you to use your experience to find employment in something relating to your skills and experience, buy an airplane, fly your family and friends around where YOU want, when YOU want, but you are still talking about pursuing an airline career to include slogging it out in the regionals for years?

Tshugart3

I know, I know, but then I go out to the beach and see the 777s coming in on short final to 8L at PHNL and think, "Man, that looks cool!"

I'm sure it's a grass is greener problem - oh well.

UAL T38 Phlyer

There's also no price on personal satisfaction. Airline flying isn't as challenging (stick and rudder) as military flying, especially tactical flying.

But it has unique challenges, requires intelligence and skill, and for most of us, is still fun. Each flight is a little different. sometimes get to see interesting places.

There's a lot of time gone from home, lots of time wasting time, and missed times with family. There's crowded airports, terrible management, frequent derailment of careers, cranky employees, and rude customers.

And once in a while there's the traveling family who truly appreciates what you do and says so, or the little kid who looks up to you the way you did as a kid when you thought "I want to do that someday...."

I could probably make as much money in a non-flying job, and be home more.

But I would hate it, because I still love flying. Love the family too; it's a balance.

Here's an idea: get your promotion, stay in to get three years and retire as an O-6, and THEN play airline pilot. If you're worried about age, about 50 seems to be the upper limit for a major, but Cargo operators with big jets might go mid 50s. AND, for a guy with your networking, there are bound to be some corporate connections with planes; Gulfstreams and their ilk.

When you are at the twilight of our life, looking back, I hope you'll be able to say you chose the path that made you and your family the happiest, not necessarily the richest. For you, the money will not be an issue on either course.

But the path might be. Think it over carefully.

bruhaha

There really is no way of knowing what the regional landscape will be in 5 years. You probably will make out better than the Piedmont payscale, but it doesn't hurt to be pessimistic.

You mostly likely won't need your ME ATP before getting hired, as the regionals will have developed their own in-house ATP CTP program which will allow you get take the ATP written and get the ATP upon completion of the regional newhire training program.

If this is what you really want to persue, I would recommend trying to get all of your certificates: private, IR, commercial SE, Commercial ME, CFI, CFII, multi instructor, done before retiring, so that after retirement you can move right on in to instructing or whatever time building program you've devised to get to ATP minimums. You will have the benefit of a pension, so the urgency of generating income probably won't be as great as when I decided to leave the Navy... probably easier to do if you're a boomer guy as opposed to a fast-attack guy. But I think if you're a CO, you'll have no problem doing what it takes to get there.

I was a 10-year AD 1110 SWO when I resigned from the Navy to pursue this second career. From the moment I made the decision to resign to my separation date (about 12 months), I was balls to the walls working on my certs (IR, commercial SE, commercial ME, CFI) , using all $50,000 (minus taxes) of my SWOCP retention bonus to fund my flight training. (Yes I know different circumstances - I was really lucky that a regional hired me right after I resigned so that I didn't get to complete my CFI - with all of 700hrs of flight time all acquired by privately finding $100 hamburgers all over the country)

You'll also need to define what major airline after the regional airline means to you. Does it mean strictly AAL/DAL/UAL? or does it also encompass Virgin America/JetBlue/Southwest/other LCC players that fly things bigger than 86-seat RJs.

10 years after resigning I finally find myself in the right seat of a narrowbody at a LCC. 10 years ago my envisioned desired end-state was going to be at Southwest or one of the 6 (back then) major airlines, didn't know when and didn't know how. Never in my wildest dreams did I ever see myself where I am now but I am okay with it.

Anyways the point is, it seems as though you are committed to an aviation career after you retire. Does it have to be that 777 finishing the long haul flight into Pearl or will being captain of your private corporate jet do the same thing. The 777 seems glamous (greener on the other side), but it's the same destinations all the time, four walls and a bed all the layover cities look the same. You really don't answer to anyone, but there's always management always turning the screws somewhere. At the regional level, it's like being checked to see if you have your hall pass all the time.

I get a thrill managing all the challenges of trying to get a flight out on time despite the obstacles the station/ATC/passengers seem to throw at me, just like the thrill I had trying to juggle the schedule as the ship's ops officer. I get the same personal satisfaction flying a challenging approach that I did when bringing ship into port and docking alongside a pier. I love seeing the stars in the sky on a clear moonless night, the airflow across the flight deck windows and throaty hum of IAE engines, just like I loved hearing the bow slicing through the waves and the splashes as flying fish leapt out and plunged back into the Pacific accompanied by the whine of LM-2500 turbine engines.

But it's a few small thrills and personal satisfaction, with lots of other stuff and fluff and BS in between.

Either way, aviation will be easiest job you've ever had compared to anything you've done in the Navy. (Not frustration free though)

Columbusohio

Pursue your dreams, you will regret it if you dont

Jetjok

Tshugart3,

Sounds like you've made your mind up, even before your first post. Good luck in your upcoming aviation career. And, again, Thanks for your service.

Lucky8888

When my daughter went into the Navy, she wanted sub duty so bad she could taste it. She didn't get it. Now she is a rated combat pilot. Go figure.

Yes, it sounds like you've got the "itch." Good luck and also thanks for your service.

skytrekker

Given what the industry has been through, and where it is going, I would stay in for your 30.

If you are in Hawaii go see RP the owner of BPFS. He has a background that may help you.

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rickair7777

The submarine force is full of wannabe aviators who flunked the vision test after four years of college.