F-15 vs F-14
11-18-2015, 09:19 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Right Seat 737, Front seat T-6
Posts: 536
Originally Posted by Adlerdriver
Ok, I’ll throw my .02 in specifically referencing the F-15A/C and focusing primarily on air-to-air combat. 3 tours flying that active duty with another 11 years in the ANG. Never flew the F-14 but fought against it.
When you speak of F-14, it’s important to specify F-14A versus F-14B/D. Two very different fighter aircraft.
F-14A: older AWG-9 radar, very limited usefulness in look down, especially over terrain, TF-30 engines that required significant attention at high altitude and high AOA, very outdated avionics compared with the F-15C.
F-14B: much better GE engines and eventually upgraded with better avionics though still saddled with the old AWG-9.
F-14D: GE engines, better avionics and an APG-71 radar vastly superior to the AWG-9.
Generally speaking, I would characterize the F-15 as much more user friendly. It was designed from the outset to be employed by a single pilot. The interface between pilot and weapons systems/avionics is far superior to the two crew member set up in the F-14. The engines are not the biggest/best on the block any longer, but they are robust and can be operated relatively care-free in any manner necessary throughout the entire flight envelope without concern. Considering the radar, engine and avionics disadvantages across the board in the F-14A, it’s really not worth comparing those with the F-15. F-14 B/D are more worthy of comparison.
BVR:
The F-14 wins the longest stick award with the AIM-54 missile, at least on paper. In reality, the AWG-9/AIM-54 combination was optimized for over water, non-maneuvering engagements. Under any other circumstances, i.e. over terrain against aware F-15s, the chances of successfully using those missiles drops dramatically. F-14D would probably be a better match with the APG-71, however, the AIM-54 (while very capable) was still at least a generation behind the AIM-120 AMRAAM.
Considering no operational F-14 ever gained the capability to employ AIM-120 AMRAAMs, I would have to give the BVR edge to the F-15.
WVR:
In a visual fight, an F-14A would quickly lose the advantage due to lack of engine power. One drawback of all F-14 aircraft is the auto wing-sweep. As the aircraft slows and loses energy, the wings sweep forward giving a visual indication of its airspeed and energy state which can be exploited, especially by a fighter with superior thrust and acceleration capability like the F-15.
F-14B/D would be a more challenging adversary due to the improved engines. I would say they would be closer to equal aircraft in terms of thrust to weight and maneuverability. However, the F-15 would still be able to offset that with a weapons advantage. All current F-15 are able to employ AIM-9X with helmet mounted sight, allowing significantly higher off-boresite weapons employment that the AIM-9M carried by the F-14.
So, overall: If you took two F-14D crews and two F-15C pilots of equal skill/training, gave them a full up weapons load with the same ID criteria/ROE and started them 100 miles apart with the mission to shoot each other down – barring any major errors on the part of the Eagle drivers, by the end of the engagement, both F-14s would most likely be destroyed.
When you speak of F-14, it’s important to specify F-14A versus F-14B/D. Two very different fighter aircraft.
F-14A: older AWG-9 radar, very limited usefulness in look down, especially over terrain, TF-30 engines that required significant attention at high altitude and high AOA, very outdated avionics compared with the F-15C.
F-14B: much better GE engines and eventually upgraded with better avionics though still saddled with the old AWG-9.
F-14D: GE engines, better avionics and an APG-71 radar vastly superior to the AWG-9.
Generally speaking, I would characterize the F-15 as much more user friendly. It was designed from the outset to be employed by a single pilot. The interface between pilot and weapons systems/avionics is far superior to the two crew member set up in the F-14. The engines are not the biggest/best on the block any longer, but they are robust and can be operated relatively care-free in any manner necessary throughout the entire flight envelope without concern. Considering the radar, engine and avionics disadvantages across the board in the F-14A, it’s really not worth comparing those with the F-15. F-14 B/D are more worthy of comparison.
BVR:
The F-14 wins the longest stick award with the AIM-54 missile, at least on paper. In reality, the AWG-9/AIM-54 combination was optimized for over water, non-maneuvering engagements. Under any other circumstances, i.e. over terrain against aware F-15s, the chances of successfully using those missiles drops dramatically. F-14D would probably be a better match with the APG-71, however, the AIM-54 (while very capable) was still at least a generation behind the AIM-120 AMRAAM.
Considering no operational F-14 ever gained the capability to employ AIM-120 AMRAAMs, I would have to give the BVR edge to the F-15.
WVR:
In a visual fight, an F-14A would quickly lose the advantage due to lack of engine power. One drawback of all F-14 aircraft is the auto wing-sweep. As the aircraft slows and loses energy, the wings sweep forward giving a visual indication of its airspeed and energy state which can be exploited, especially by a fighter with superior thrust and acceleration capability like the F-15.
F-14B/D would be a more challenging adversary due to the improved engines. I would say they would be closer to equal aircraft in terms of thrust to weight and maneuverability. However, the F-15 would still be able to offset that with a weapons advantage. All current F-15 are able to employ AIM-9X with helmet mounted sight, allowing significantly higher off-boresite weapons employment that the AIM-9M carried by the F-14.
So, overall: If you took two F-14D crews and two F-15C pilots of equal skill/training, gave them a full up weapons load with the same ID criteria/ROE and started them 100 miles apart with the mission to shoot each other down – barring any major errors on the part of the Eagle drivers, by the end of the engagement, both F-14s would most likely be destroyed.
It was always fun to fly dissimilar against Tomcats ... especially if you needed to pad your shot log!
11-19-2015, 06:33 AM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Walmart Greeter
Posts: 694
Originally Posted by F15Cricket
Very good description ... a much shorter analogy for the OP, have you ever heard the not-so-pc phrase "clubbing baby seals"?
It was always fun to fly dissimilar against Tomcats ... especially if you needed to pad your shot log!
It was always fun to fly dissimilar against Tomcats ... especially if you needed to pad your shot log!
