AFSOCFlyr

Folks,

Its about time that I stop trolling! I've read multiple threads over a few years about military SE time not being looked down on by the majors.....BUT:

A friend of mine recently retired from the AF and couldn't even get an interview with a major. He was a former C-5 Evaluator and spent the last 4-5 years of his career as an AFSOC U-28 (modified PC-12) co-pilot and then aircraft commander. He ended up signing with Horizon.

I am also a U-28 guy (once in U-28s, you'll always be in U-28s..) and although my commitment isn't up until Fall '18, it is about time to start considering my options if I elect to get out. I could probably fall back on flying BE-300s for L3 overseas and make 6-figures...but I'm also already in double digits on deployments and would HIGHLY prefer to get off that pain train. Plus flying contract jobs isn't much of a 'career' and the gigs can be turned off at virtually any time. But I also don't want my wife and I to have to live off beans and bread for 3 years.

Also, do the airlines give any extra consideration to combat/special operations time and the associated complexities?

I'd appreciate any input and look forward to contributing to APC!

Thanks,
-AFSOCFlyr

-Running Estimates-
3000TT (including T-37/38)
2000 Combat
1200 PIC (Aircraft Commander)
500 Instructor

Otterbox

How much multi time do you have? I think they're looking for 500 multi for the OCONUS ISR gigs in the King airs. Not sure when that gravy train is going to stop either- it seems to be in flux often.

Military single engine jet PIC time seems to be >= military multi PIC time. I've never heard of anyone applying with just U28 time but I know dudes who were handicapped by low multi time after a FAIP tour, and Dudes with healthy multi time but greater than 12 months non- flying ended going to the regionals.

Things could change in a couple years (and likely will given how much they changed the last 3) but I'd plan on applying to all of the majors and the regionals you think are the "best fit" for you and plan on starting out as a regional pilot until you get the call.

Toonces

Don't know from any personal anecdotes, but likely you will benefit only from checking the "military" and "ip/ep" boxes.

To put it in perspective, a friend of mine was a helicopter driver and then did an instructor tour in the T-6. He didn't hear a peep from the majors but was picked up at Skywest. One year there and he was hired by Delta. With only SE time, you will likely need a transition job to check off some more boxes (ME jet, 121, etc).


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AFSOCFlyr

Thanks to both of you for your responses.

U-28s are still too 'new' to have any U-28 only background folks testing the airline waters. The L3 folks have been picking up U-28 guys with no addtl experience other than helos at least. I guess it begs the question whether it'd be worth doing a contract gig for 1-2 years (if accepted) while making good money and then apply to the majors..or fly a regional gig to get on a majors radar. I know at that point it's anyone's guess.

I guess I'm mostly curious if single engine turboprop folks will get a shake similar to the pointy nose SE. I know that it is a fairly new concept and there aren't a lot of us doing it, but it presents its own unique challenges.

PS, my only ME time is T-37/38s.

Thanks again!

Hacker15e

My guess is that U-28 time won't be looked at with the same value as F-16 time.

Not because of some "fighter mafia" hate, but more because the guys at the majors pulling and scoring applications just won't know what the heck a U-28 is, nor what it does and where it does it. I think that most of us who have worked overseas with the U-28 know and appreciate the airmanship such experience builds, but I think it probably falls into a similar category as military helo time (which is also horrendously under-appreciated at the airlines).

My bet is that you'd get better attention from the 121 majors with a short stint at the regionals than you would with the same amount of time doing King Airs on contract overseas. I know of more than a few military guys who have applications in with the majors and are working overseas contract while they wait, and are not getting any calls for interviews for some substantially long periods of time (over two years at least with a couple guys I know of).

At the same time, I know a good number of military guys who have initially not received any interview invites straight out of the .mil, but after 12-18 months at a regional are moving on to a major. For some reason the majors just like to see that military time coupled up with regional experience.

Yes, the regionals suck, the pay sucks, the schedules suck...but it appears the be the best door to go through to get to the majors. Not an answer a lot of military dudes want to hear, but it is the majors that are making the rules, not us.

ApachePhil

Those qualities probably won't get you an invite to interview, but they will make great conversation during the panel portion of the interview.

Of my 45-60 minutes at the table, a substantial portion was spent talking about my time at the 160th SOAR flying helicopters, time spent in Africa and the Middle East, and having gone to DLIFLC for Arabic when I was enlisted.

My invitation to interview was probably from having 8500 flight hours (4000 helo), and an undergrad GPA of 3.9. During a break in active-duty service, I did a short time at a regional airline in 2001-2003. I doubt deployments, combat, medals, tabs, nor badges got me a job offer at Delta.

Peers of mine, with similar qualifications, are having to do their time at LCC, ULCC, and/or regional airlines before they get the call to interview at any of the majors. There is an element of luck present to getting the call...Good luck to you!!

AFSOCFlyr

Thanks a ton for the info. It all makes sense. I'm guessing I'm probably not the first one to show up on here after taking a good long look at a calendar for the first time in awhile.

I'm starting to see the luck aspect that's involved...it's nothing like the merit based system of the AF (*cough*)

At this point I just want to move on. But in reality I'll need these couple of years to prepare. ATP coming up, pushing for AIS, etc.

Cheers,
AFSOCFlyr

P.S. Apache, 8500 mil hours? You kept busy! I guess the 160th will do that to a man

HoursHore

Apply to some heavy reserve units. My old unit hired a u28 guy. You'll have some guaranteed income while staying current, and broadening your resume. You will have to deploy though.

AFSOCFlyr

Definitely looking at that. I know a few folks got out of U-28s and did that. It might be my go to move if I can get picked up.

Honestly I could take the occasional deployment in a heavy. Don't get me wrong, I know it's still a deployment and it's common for some heavy airframes fly their @$$es off deployed..but it'd be enough of a change of pace and the hours would be priceless.

WARich

Dude, having done the whole MC-12 commander deal I know what you do. Not so much the airlines. I'm guessing just do a yr or so with a regional to prove you can do the gig and your in. It's crazy we're even here at this point. So many qualified dudes and they're get all picky and wanting every job since middle school....