Military Options
08-13-2016, 05:41 PM
#1
On Reserve
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 19
Military Options
Hi all, I am about to begin my senior year at a large aviation university. I am a commercial aviation major and will have CPL AMEL/ASEL + CFI/I when I graduate. Up to this point my plan was always to go the flight instruction to regional route. Recently I have begun to reconsider however. The chance to serve and experience the type of flying that the military does is starting to appeal to me. Like everyone else, my preference is fighters if I can make it, but flying multi engine heavies would also be fine. Helicopters also have a certain appeal, but my ultimate goal is the major airlines. I have several questions about the ANG, USAF and USN. Firstly the air guard.
I understand that you simply apply to the specific unit. If selected, you attend UPT and have a guaranteed airframe, correct?
What is the best way to be selected?
Are fighter units more competitive than airlift units?
What happens to the pilots if the unit changes missions to UAS operations?
As far as USAF and USN/Marines, what is the usual breakdown of airframes out of primary training?
And can I attend OCS with a guaranteed flight slot?
Or will I have to compete for it in some way?
Which one has a better chance of flying something with a pointy nose? And lastly as a general question, how much will my current experience help me in flight training and with selection?
Thanks for your help ahead of time! I appreciate any answers you can give me
I understand that you simply apply to the specific unit. If selected, you attend UPT and have a guaranteed airframe, correct?
What is the best way to be selected?
Are fighter units more competitive than airlift units?
What happens to the pilots if the unit changes missions to UAS operations?
As far as USAF and USN/Marines, what is the usual breakdown of airframes out of primary training?
And can I attend OCS with a guaranteed flight slot?
Or will I have to compete for it in some way?
Which one has a better chance of flying something with a pointy nose? And lastly as a general question, how much will my current experience help me in flight training and with selection?
Thanks for your help ahead of time! I appreciate any answers you can give me
08-13-2016, 11:37 PM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 2,889
Originally Posted by 9GulfTango
Hi all, I am about to begin my senior year at a large aviation university. I am a commercial aviation major and will have CPL AMEL/ASEL + CFI/I when I graduate. Up to this point my plan was always to go the flight instruction to regional route. Recently I have begun to reconsider however. The chance to serve and experience the type of flying that the military does is starting to appeal to me. Like everyone else, my preference is fighters if I can make it, but flying multi engine heavies would also be fine. Helicopters also have a certain appeal, but my ultimate goal is the major airlines. I have several questions about the ANG, USAF and USN. Firstly the air guard.
I understand that you simply apply to the specific unit. If selected, you attend UPT and have a guaranteed airframe, correct?
Yes.
What is the best way to be selected?
Go to Baseops and read up on the UPT selection process. Best bet is to visit units you want to join on their open house/pilot board events
Are fighter units more competitive than airlift units?
Typically, hell yes.
What happens to the pilots if the unit changes missions to UAS operations?
It depends. You are probably ****ed. Some folks may follow the jets to other bases, some won't
As far as USAF and USN/Marines, what is the usual breakdown of airframes out of primary training?
I will defer to my Gold Winged brethren
And can I attend OCS with a guaranteed flight slot?
Yes. More importantly I would not attend without one
Or will I have to compete for it in some way?
If unit sponsors you the slot is yours. If you ignore my advice above and join Active duty, at times there are slots available you can wrestle by doing well. It depends on needs of the service at the time. I wouldn't go to OCS hoping for that however...
Which one has a better chance of flying something with a pointy nose?
ANG/Reserve will be your best overall shot. That said, I flew the F-15 for 15 years after flying the OV-10, and a host of my contemporaries off active duty got fighters as well. It comes down to your performance and needs of the Air Force at the time.
And lastly as a general question, how much will my current experience help me in flight training and with selection?
Any expereince will help with your selection. The debate is how much does your GA flying help in UPT. It helped me in primary, but by T-38s was a non-factor. I know a guy who went with 4000+ hours including lear time and he was DG in his C-130 track. I also know a guy who had 12 hours GA and graduated number one in my class, and later went to weapons school in the F-15C. I generally think more experience gives confidence and helps to a point, but more important is ability, adaptability, and knowing when to flush what you know to adopt the new material you are being taught.
Thanks for your help ahead of time! I appreciate any answers you can give me
I understand that you simply apply to the specific unit. If selected, you attend UPT and have a guaranteed airframe, correct?
Yes.
What is the best way to be selected?
Go to Baseops and read up on the UPT selection process. Best bet is to visit units you want to join on their open house/pilot board events
Are fighter units more competitive than airlift units?
Typically, hell yes.
What happens to the pilots if the unit changes missions to UAS operations?
It depends. You are probably ****ed. Some folks may follow the jets to other bases, some won't
As far as USAF and USN/Marines, what is the usual breakdown of airframes out of primary training?
I will defer to my Gold Winged brethren
And can I attend OCS with a guaranteed flight slot?
Yes. More importantly I would not attend without one
Or will I have to compete for it in some way?
If unit sponsors you the slot is yours. If you ignore my advice above and join Active duty, at times there are slots available you can wrestle by doing well. It depends on needs of the service at the time. I wouldn't go to OCS hoping for that however...
Which one has a better chance of flying something with a pointy nose?
ANG/Reserve will be your best overall shot. That said, I flew the F-15 for 15 years after flying the OV-10, and a host of my contemporaries off active duty got fighters as well. It comes down to your performance and needs of the Air Force at the time.
And lastly as a general question, how much will my current experience help me in flight training and with selection?
Any expereince will help with your selection. The debate is how much does your GA flying help in UPT. It helped me in primary, but by T-38s was a non-factor. I know a guy who went with 4000+ hours including lear time and he was DG in his C-130 track. I also know a guy who had 12 hours GA and graduated number one in my class, and later went to weapons school in the F-15C. I generally think more experience gives confidence and helps to a point, but more important is ability, adaptability, and knowing when to flush what you know to adopt the new material you are being taught.
Thanks for your help ahead of time! I appreciate any answers you can give me
08-14-2016, 08:20 AM
#3
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Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 376
Originally Posted by 9GulfTango
As far as USAF and USN/Marines, what is the usual breakdown of airframes out of primary training?
We have more tactical jets than other aircraft, but those Helos/Maritime platforms have 2-3 pilots in them so the numbers always seemed to be about the same.
Keep in mind if you go Navy or USMC then your first opportunity to go to the reserves will be about 10 years after your commissioning day. Local CFIs are getting their hours an into the regionals in under 12 months (90-110 hrs/month).
The only reason to serve right now (my opinion) is if you have some type of internal calling to serve your country AND experience tactical flying. The flying is fun but it dries up after 1-2 tours on active duty and the BS can quickly outweigh the adventure.
Just wanted to offer my 2 cents since your stated goal was Major Airline. USN time may push you on to the backside of the hiring wave.
08-15-2016, 08:55 AM
#4
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Joined APC: Sep 2013
Position: Left
Posts: 636
With the right planning/prep, testing and such you can go in with a guaranty of flight training, providing you pass all the steps along the way, including medical. There is no guarantee of outcome, that's one part that keeps you on your toes.
When I started with the Navy in 85 I had no clue or intention with an airline job, my goals were right in front of me. That ended up being almost 2.5 years, from AOCS in Pensacola to deployment on the USS AMERICA. The airline thing came years later.
One needs a lot of motivation to go through a military flight program and then the 8+ years that follow. If one is looking to just get an airline pilot career started, I'd look to the regionals. On the flip side, with the military flying you will be exposed to stuff you won't find anywhere else.
That said, there's no way I would trade my military time for a 5-7 yr earlier seniority number(factoring in some regional time). One could easily spend 6+ years at a reigional before highly competitive for an interview at a major, depending.
A flight slot at a Guard/Reserve unit may be the best of both worlds. Getting that slot can take some ingenuity on the applicants part.
When I started with the Navy in 85 I had no clue or intention with an airline job, my goals were right in front of me. That ended up being almost 2.5 years, from AOCS in Pensacola to deployment on the USS AMERICA. The airline thing came years later.
One needs a lot of motivation to go through a military flight program and then the 8+ years that follow. If one is looking to just get an airline pilot career started, I'd look to the regionals. On the flip side, with the military flying you will be exposed to stuff you won't find anywhere else.
That said, there's no way I would trade my military time for a 5-7 yr earlier seniority number(factoring in some regional time). One could easily spend 6+ years at a reigional before highly competitive for an interview at a major, depending.
A flight slot at a Guard/Reserve unit may be the best of both worlds. Getting that slot can take some ingenuity on the applicants part.
08-15-2016, 09:48 AM
#5
On Reserve
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 19
To make my motivations clear, it is tactical/military flying that appeals to me. The military wouldn't be a time builder, it would be my job until the time is right to move on. The guard/reserve looks like a great deal, but very competitive. Active duty seems like a better chance of getting the aircraft i want, but then I am looking at a 10 year sentence if I get rotary or something else I don't want. What I have learned in my investigation is that there are no easy answers!
08-15-2016, 10:50 AM
#6
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Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,837
Originally Posted by 9GulfTango
To make my motivations clear, it is tactical/military flying that appeals to me. The military wouldn't be a time builder, it would be my job until the time is right to move on. The guard/reserve looks like a great deal, but very competitive. Active duty seems like a better chance of getting the aircraft i want, but then I am looking at a 10 year sentence if I get rotary or something else I don't want. What I have learned in my investigation is that there are no easy answers!
I went through with people who were 110% tactically motivated (meaning they wanted jets). Talk to them a few years later and most are in love with their airframe and mission. EVERY aspect of military flying has its own set of challenges and amazing flying - from maneuvering the airplane every which way to traveling to 100s of airports (and some times not airports) all over the world!
Every branch and every airframe will give you experiences which will benefit you later in life if you decide that you want to be a professional pilot. Even if you get helos (
), your second tour could be flying trainers and building fixed wing time and you'll have some great stories to tell.Speaking of *military* flying - - -they obviously do a lot of HomeLand Security missions right now - but I fly with a handful of former USCG guys and I'm totally in awe of some of the missions they flew. I'm a huge fan of the Coasties and wish I had been given an opportunity to transition at some point after I got to 'do my job' in the USMC.
08-15-2016, 12:15 PM
#7
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Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 376
Needs of the service
If you go active you must embrace the concept that at every turn ITS NOT ABOUT YOU. Every door that opens or closes is based on the needs of the service.
That being said - I don't know of anyone that hated their assigned platform. I have flown props, light jets, helos, tactical jets and heavy prop aircraft and I think flying helos was the most "fun" followed by day carrier landings. Fighter maneuvers was challenging but not the "fun" I thought it would be. (About as physically hard as boxing out of your weight class). Low level Ops was "Fun". Probably the most rewarding was teaching and leading large formations and tactical elements. But you might get assigned the C2 greyhound which is not sexy but gives your more port calls than you can count and no night traps.
That being said - I don't know of anyone that hated their assigned platform. I have flown props, light jets, helos, tactical jets and heavy prop aircraft and I think flying helos was the most "fun" followed by day carrier landings. Fighter maneuvers was challenging but not the "fun" I thought it would be. (About as physically hard as boxing out of your weight class). Low level Ops was "Fun". Probably the most rewarding was teaching and leading large formations and tactical elements. But you might get assigned the C2 greyhound which is not sexy but gives your more port calls than you can count and no night traps.
08-17-2016, 06:22 AM
#8
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Joined APC: Aug 2015
Posts: 233
Tacair guy, but like the guy above I have flown other mil aircraft (helos, props, etc). Helos are probably the most fun, from a flying perspective and the most challenging. I'd still take jets knowing what I know now. That being said take a look at the culture of the services and figure out which fits you best. I didn't, but was lucky enough to get into the service that I fit best with. You will spend a good part of your life with them, it will be better if they think like you.
Timing is everything in the Navy and Marine Corps for jets. Though you do have to do your part and if you do really well they will try to help you. When I went through I heard guys complaining about no jet slots, and later found out no one had jet grades. I know of at least one Navy guy in my time frame they sat because he did well and got a jet slot. Also, I know of several Marines who did not want jets but barely made the cut and were forced jets.
Timing is everything in the Navy and Marine Corps for jets. Though you do have to do your part and if you do really well they will try to help you. When I went through I heard guys complaining about no jet slots, and later found out no one had jet grades. I know of at least one Navy guy in my time frame they sat because he did well and got a jet slot. Also, I know of several Marines who did not want jets but barely made the cut and were forced jets.
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