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Title Match tomorrow: Heavy Weight (Delta) VS. Middle Weight (MESA)

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Title Match tomorrow: Heavy Weight (Delta) VS. Middle Weight (MESA)

Old 01-31-2009, 09:01 AM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by JetJock16 View Post
Facts:

1) Mesa is one of, if not the worst, airline in America. Not because of their employees but because of Orenstein. He used to work for Lorenzo (chip off the old block) . . .
1987 - 1993, JO first worked in aviation, for Air LA and Mesa
1994 - 1995, JO works for CO Express (under David Bonderman)
1996 - 1997, JO is CEO of Virgin Express
1998 - present, JO is CEO of Mesa

Frank left Texas Air Group in 1990. When did JO work for Frank?

BTW, when I speak of quality I’m not talking about the pilots. . . . No, when I’m talk about quality I’m talking about the a/c and other aspects. All one has to do is get on board and see the lack of care . . . (when you two leg commute you quickly get to know who is Q and who is not).
As a pilot, I've traveled on virtually all of the Delta Connection carriers, both as a jumpseater and as a non-rev passenger. As a Gold Medallion Delta passenger, I also travel on Delta and their Connection carriers plenty as a revenue passenger, accessing their lounges, Business Elite services and all other aspects of the premium experience. I’ve generally found that employees are not privy to most of the passenger quality initiatives – as a non-rev or while working, you’re the last priority or providing the customer service, not receiving it. What is the worst part about Mesa's JFK Delta Connection service IMO - the surly gate agents, rampers, and the horrible facilities of Terminal 2 in JFK, especially the boarding procedures of Terminal 2, where all of Mesa's flights operate. None of this is under Mesa's control - it's all Delta mainline. JFK is the international hub of the world's 2 largest airlines, Delta and American (Air France KLM is not a single airline). Look @ Delta's facilities and American's - there is no contest: one has a clean, airy, brand new terminal where you board using jetways; the other uses Pan Am's two terminals from the 60's (the oldest operating hub terminals of any major international airline in the world I believe), where you board RJ's by being herded into one of 2 gates by some of the most ill-tempered employees I've ever met, who then march you through the snow and rain to your aircraft, partially sheltered only by some netting and plywood - and that's before you have to wait @ the bottom of the stairs in the elements as the 15 people in front of you find their seats. Your carry-on bag, which is too small to fit in the overheads, sits out in the elements for another 10 minutes before being manhandled into the bin, breaking the delicate items you didn't put in your checked bag and that had made it all the way from China, only to break on the last leg of your journey.
All this talk about Delta's 'focus on quality' is great, but this focus on Mesa's potential removal as a primary part of this process is ridiculous. We’re talking about the world’s largest airline, and they have no first class product and outdated facilities in a hub most of their premium passengers pass through – believe me, that stands out a good deal more than the differences b/t a Mesa, a Comair, and a Skywest flight (I don’t see an appreciable difference, honestly – I’ve had good and bad experiences everywhere in equal frequency).

The contract is all that matters here. It appears both Mesa and Delta admit Mesa fell below the minimum performance levels, allowing Delta to get out of the contract. None of us know why Delta chose to attempt to exercise this option with Mesa and not another carrier. All that matters is the contract:
1) Does the contract differentiate between cancellations due to actions by Delta and those within Mesa's control?
2) If so, did Mesa initiate cancellations of flights on the request of Delta?
3) If so, can Mesa show, through a preponderance of the evidence (ie, was it more likely than not) that Mesa would have been in compliance with the contract had Delta not interfered?

It doesn't matter what Delta pilots, Delta Connection pilots, or even Delta's premium passengers think - only the contract and the courts matter now.

What matters most though – a Steeler’s victory tomorrow!
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Old 01-31-2009, 10:22 AM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by JetJock16 View Post
The new stadium is very nice and now it's become an event to attend. I fear that once the newness wears off and they start to stink again, you'll see the stadium start to thin out as their bandwagon fans move on. Not many teams have the solid fan support equal to that of GB, CHI, CLE, NY (2), PHI, PIT, DAL, etc.

When I lived there I found it odd that the majority of the fans at the game where there to watch the visiting team. I know I went every time the Cowboys were in town, tickets where CHEAP!!! I'd say a large majority of AZn's are transplanted peeps from other parts of the county/world, so it's kind-of understandable.
Everyone knows the best hard core fans are in Los Angeles. I mean look how well the Rams and the Raiders are doing there..............Oh...What? they both moved because everyone in LA likes football but not enough to go to a game? HUH. however football is alive and thriving in Los Angeles, just not the american kind.
Useless rant out.
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Old 01-31-2009, 03:51 PM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by Sniper View Post
It doesn't matter what Delta pilots, Delta Connection pilots, or even Delta's premium passengers think - only the contract and the courts matter now.
Very interesting post. I think some of this might hinge on exemptions to the contract that Delta MIGHT have made when the moved Mesa into airports where they knew performance would be a problem.

Delta seems to have got itself into several contracts that it would dump tomorrow if it could. SkyWest had Delta in a tough position and got a sweetheart deal.
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Old 01-31-2009, 06:31 PM
  #104  
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Important things to remember:

1) Mesa is cheap

2) As much as the pride of Delta wants to think they are all about quality, price still matters.

3) Delta wants to shrink regional lift.

4) Mesa was the easiest target after cutting out huge chunks of others (Comair, ASA... more to come)

5) As much as everyone hates JO, he is good at what he does and will probably put up a good fight and possibly win.

6) Saying Mesa will lose cause you think you work at a better regional and you like to feel better than someone else shows how ignorant you are.

7) For every person who hopes Mesa will liquidate, someone hopes your company will liquidate as well.

8) I would bet there are more "fair weather" Steelers fans than Cardinals fans any day.

9) A drink count is the best idea yet.

10) Drink count - 6
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Old 01-31-2009, 06:39 PM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by mking84 View Post
Well I heard they were not in SLC because they could not manage a w/b with the alt....


I would say that is very performance related.
Oh you heard. Well now it comes out. For a second it sounded like there was confirmation that RAH was losing flying to actual personnel/company performance. As far as the aircraft go you do realize that the Ejets were based in DEN right?
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Old 01-31-2009, 07:16 PM
  #106  
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Originally Posted by ebl14 View Post
Important things to remember:

1) Mesa is cheap

2) As much as the pride of Delta wants to think they are all about quality, price still matters.

3) Delta wants to shrink regional lift.

4) Mesa was the easiest target after cutting out huge chunks of others (Comair, ASA... more to come)

5) As much as everyone hates JO, he is good at what he does and will probably put up a good fight and possibly win.

6) Saying Mesa will lose cause you think you work at a better regional and you like to feel better than someone else shows how ignorant you are.

7) For every person who hopes Mesa will liquidate, someone hopes your company will liquidate as well.

8) I would bet there are more "fair weather" Steelers fans than Cardinals fans any day.

9) A drink count is the best idea yet.

10) Drink count - 6

You just lost all credibility with statement #8 I Suggest you go to Harolds(a Steelers bar) in Cave Creek(http://haroldscorral.com/steelers/). 4000 reservations and will have plenty of walk in fans as well. How many Cardinals bars are there in Pittsburg?

Remember the days where there were 40,000 fans at Sun Devil stadium(it holds about 77k) and 20,000 were fans of the OTHER team! Everyone in AZ has a favorite team, and it usually ain't the Cards! Cards are always the 2nd choice team for most in AZ. Hope the fall off the ban wagon doesn't hurt too many Cardinalites.

I actually like some of the Cards players and think they look very strong during the playoffs(as opposed to their last 1/3 of the season and the weak NFC West title), but the Bidwells DO NOT deserve a Super Bowl win.

What was this thread about again???

Last edited by RichieAshburn; 01-31-2009 at 07:23 PM.
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Old 01-31-2009, 07:53 PM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by RichieAshburn View Post
You just lost all credibility with statement #8 I Suggest you go to Harolds(a Steelers bar) in Cave Creek(http://haroldscorral.com/steelers/). 4000 reservations and will have plenty of walk in fans as well. How many Cardinals bars are there in Pittsburg?

Remember the days where there were 40,000 fans at Sun Devil stadium(it holds about 77k) and 20,000 were fans of the OTHER team! Everyone in AZ has a favorite team, and it usually ain't the Cards! Cards are always the 2nd choice team for most in AZ. Hope the fall off the ban wagon doesn't hurt too many Cardinalites.

I actually like some of the Cards players and think they look very strong during the playoffs(as opposed to their last 1/3 of the season and the weak NFC West title), but the Bidwells DO NOT deserve a Super Bowl win.

What was this thread about again???
I said "Fairweather fans", not fans. Pittsberg is becoming the new New England, where everyone likes them cause they have been sucessful. Who can make that argument for the Cards? Maybe after they beat the Steelers . By the way, I'm a Seahawks fan.
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Old 02-01-2009, 06:14 AM
  #108  
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Default United States Court of Appeals

For you guys who keep asking about the Delta / Mesa injunction appeal decision, I do not think a decision has been reached yet. You can check the United States Court of Appeals, Eleventh Circuit website for updates. Click on Opinions to see if an opinion has been issued. I would think if decision has been reach, an opinion would be published.

Good Luck to All

P.S. My crappy regional if better than your crappy regional. Oh, I forget, I'm furloughed, I do not have a regional
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Old 02-01-2009, 06:42 AM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by flycrj200 View Post

Oh, I forget, I'm furloughed, I do not have a regional
Heeheeheee! I love this line!
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Old 02-01-2009, 07:20 AM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by ebl14 View Post
I said "Fairweather fans", not fans. Pittsberg is becoming the new New England, where everyone likes them cause they have been sucessful. Who can make that argument for the Cards? Maybe after they beat the Steelers . By the way, I'm a Seahawks fan.
I see the problem, our definition of "fair weather fans" is different. I'm talking about AZ locals who usually don't support the Cardinals and are now jumping on the ban wagon. Local Steelers fans support them through good and bad seasons, not so with AZ fans.

I never liked the Cardinals, but they have a great offense. We'll see if they old saying is true...A great defense usually beats a great offense.
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