I must say that I disagree with you two. This type of information *may* be found out anyways by a potential employer. And this information SHOULD be available. The problem is, the PIC of the Colgan crash was able to HIDE his deficiencies and as such, may have been casual to the tragic loss of life.
If you suck as a pilot, or if you suck as an employee, WE should know about it.
You guys WOULD NOT LAST in the military. Every company that I interviewed with wanted to see EVERY Officer Performance Report (yearly), all of my training records, and my ENTIRE Flying Evaluation history .... to include Pilot Training.
You have no idea the hoops, bullcrap, and what it takes to have a clean military record to present to potential employers. Personally, I see this as leveling the playing field. No more sluffing off as a the average joe in your regional while you are "building time" for the majors.
Last edited by IC ALL : 10-16-2009 at 10:17 PM.
Reason: tos
Might be taking that a tad far. The differences are numerous, the selection process, training, types of mission, stress is all very different. But i don't think you would do well to label everyone as "would not last". I'm sure there are some pilots around here with skeletons in their closets. But at the same time, there are plenty of individuals who have records equally as squeaky clean, some who are a stick and rudder with the best of them. Keep in mind, that none of us, are the end all, be all that is professional aviation...
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I wasn't meaning to label everyone. I quoted two individuals ... the quotes deleted for some reason ... dondk and someone else, who were complaining about a company having access to your personal records and felt that it was intrusive and wrong.
My point was, when I interviewed, the companies had 10 years worth of military reports, equivalent to about an 1/2 inch of loose leaf paper ... all from multiple military commands, numerous commanders, and many check airman -- some of who weren't very friendly.
It is very difficult and takes a lot of work to have a stellar military flying career as well as a stellar officer career. And personally, I think companines shoud have access to all of this type of information when it hires someone. They are putting a tremendous amount of responsibility in your hands.
I must say that I disagree with you two. This type of information *may* be found out anyways by a potential employer. And this information SHOULD be available. The problem is, the PIC of the Colgan crash was able to HIDE his deficiencies and as such, may have been casual to the tragic loss of life.
How was he able to "hide" it? The guy failed rides, that info is out there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
If you suck as a pilot, or if you suck as an employee, WE should know about it.
You guys WOULD NOT LAST in the military. Every company that I interviewed with wanted to see EVERY Officer Performance Report (yearly), all of my training records, and my ENTIRE Flying Evaluation history .... to include Pilot Training.
You have no idea the hoops, bullcrap, and what it takes to have a clean military record to present to potential employers. Personally, I see this as leveling the playing field. No more sluffing off as a the average joe in your regional while you are "building time" for the majors.
Just a couple examples, How did these guys make it in the military?
Again DoJet ... my comments weren't a civlian versus military flying. They were about the information the companies require from military pilots versus a civilian. Vast differences there.
The point was, you guys would not last in the military if the records requirements in the House bill bothers you.
There's plenty of baffornery in the DOD. No need to flaunt it DoJet. And by the way, you picked two accidents with literally the most senior pilots you could ever have in military cockpits. That whole "flying by the seat of my pants" because I'm experienced doomed both of those crews. Tragically, some lost their lives.
Again DoJet ... my comments weren't a civlian versus military flying. They were about the information the companies require from military pilots versus a civilian. Vast differences there.
Fair enough, but the information is out there. If the employer checked for the records, it's there. Whatever decision that company made is another matter. And with what you've written so far, I'm not sure how it CAN'T be interpreted as a mil vs. civ thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
The point was, you guys would not last in the military if the records requirements in the House bill bothers you.
Really, we wouldn't last in the military? I didn't know you had the authority to determine who would and wouldn't last in the military. I told you the reason I didn't go mil, still have that issue. If that wasn't there, are you so sure that I wouldn't have cut it? Sometimes I wonder how guys that were in the military made it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
There's plenty of baffornery in the DOD. No need to flaunt it DoJet. And by the way, you picked two accidents with literally the most senior pilots you could ever have in military cockpits. That whole "flying by the seat of my pants" because I'm experienced doomed both of those crews. Tragically, some lost their lives.
Wow, interesting. So what you're saying is this; In the military, the guys with the most experience are the most dangerous?
Quite the comparison. People are screaming that there's not enough experience at the regionals so it's dangerous. In the military, there's too much experience, so it's dangerous.
Oh bejesus DoJet ... how many things can you take OUT OF CONTEXT?
Grow up !!!
The point was, and I'll SAY IT AGAIN
THIS WASN'T A CIVILIAN VERSUS MILITARY PILOT WHO HAD THE BIGGEST JET FIGHT
THIS WAS ABOUT ... If you think the record requirements in this bill are horrible, and as such will keep you from flying as a civilian, then you certainly aren't going to like ... or last ... in the military. Can you at least be intelluctually honest with yourself?
Both of those accidents you highlighted, out of a desperate move to prove a childish point, we're the results of senior aircrew who felt they were above the rules and as such didn't fly by the regulations and crashed because of it.
WHERE did I say in my post anything about senior aircrew being the most dangerous? I didn't.
Seriously, you guys are very sensitive some time. SNAPs
Oh bejesus DoJet ... how many things can you take OUT OF CONTEXT?
Grow up !!!
The point was, and I'll SAY IT AGAIN
THIS WASN'T A CIVILIAN VERSUS MILITARY PILOT WHO HAD THE BIGGEST JET FIGHT
Spool down turbo, don't get the panties all wound up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
THIS WAS ABOUT ... If you think the record requirements in this bill are horrible, and as such will keep you from flying as a civilian, then you certainly aren't going to like ... or last ... in the military. Can you at least be intelluctually honest with yourself?
Maybe you should use more tact or betting wording with your posts. Do you have the intellectual capacity for that? Keep making it personal, it'll be fun, at least till the mods shut it down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
Both of those accidents you highlighted, out of a desperate move to prove a childish point, we're the results of senior aircrew who felt they were above the rules and as such didn't fly by the regulations and crashed because of it.
Nothing desperate about it. Just pointing out that a well trained, experienced flight crew can wreck a plane JUST AS GOOD AS A CREW THAT ISN'T.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
WHERE did I say in my post anything about senior aircrew being the most dangerous.
Sorry, what?
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
And by the way, you picked two accidents with literally the most senior pilots you could ever have in military cockpits. That whole "flying by the seat of my pants" because I'm experienced doomed both of those crews. Tragically, some lost their lives.
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