All I can say is that this further affirms that ALPA sold out the guys who were furloughed - after months of the company 'not coming to the table' an agreement is reached less than two weeks after the latest round. Nice.
And, no, I'm not bitter!
Ya know... I was thinking the same thing but my question is wouldn't this "hurt" their reelection if the intent was to sell us out? I understand us furloughed guys have no vote but the active pilots do if this turns to a bust. Also even if ALPA itself has agreed to it, the pilots have to vote it in. There is still 5 months? till the current ALPA guys terms are up, ALPA is supposed to release more information on this "agreement" so there should "in theory" be plenty of time to see how good or bad this deal really is. And if it is bad, well our fellow pilots have control of its fate.
You all are so screwed. Our PBS sort of rewards the guys at the top (although once the "unstacking" starts, they get screwed too) and screws the most junior guys and reserves.
Good luck ever getting days off you ask for unless you're #1 or 2 on your roster, and never ever getting them off if you're a reserve.
And stand by for more furloughs... Our management has managed to use use PBS to furlough more and more pilots, figuring they can JRA and offer incentive flying to guys who will stab their mothers for opentime at 1.5x the normal rate.
PBS is designed for mainline carriers who have their own schedules, and want to staff the routes... it's not for Fee-For-Depature carriers whose trips come from other sources and are constrained by what they get rather than what they build themselves.
NO PBS... Hope it's gone soon... and if you get it, you're gonna regret it without language to hold Management's feet to the fire. Otherwise you're gonna get burned.
__________________
You're only as good as your last landing
I got the lowdown directly from the source today (an ASA ALPA PBS negotiator).
You all are going to like this. We got most of what we asked for. It will not be anything like what SkyWest has... more like what DAL has. We also got some "problems" with the current contract fixed. Most importantly, ASA has agreed that there will be no need for additional furloughs. The "source" says ASA management thinks this is going to cause us to grow like crazy.
I beg you all (ASA pilots) to wait for the details to become public before deciding. Don't listen to the pundits at other airlines telling you PBS sucks. We are completely reinventing it. Those tho know me know I'm one of ALPA's biggest critics, but after hearing the details, I have to admit I'm impressed. We got a good PBS system, yet DID NOT overreach.
The process is going to be slow. Don't expect implementation for at least six months. Stay tuned as info becomes public.
I got the lowdown directly from the source today (an ASA ALPA PBS negotiator).
You all are going to like this. We got most of what we asked for. It will not be anything like what SkyWest has... more like what DAL has. We also got some "problems" with the current contract fixed. Most importantly, ASA has agreed that there will be no need for additional furloughs. The "source" says ASA management thinks this is going to cause us to grow like crazy.
I beg you all (ASA pilots) to wait for the details to become public before deciding. Don't listen to the pundits at other airlines telling you PBS sucks. We are completely reinventing it. Those tho know me know I'm one of ALPA's biggest critics, but after hearing the details, I have to admit I'm impressed. We got a good PBS system, yet DID NOT overreach.
The process is going to be slow. Don't expect implementation for at least six months. Stay tuned as info becomes public.
I agree 100%... wait till details are out. But....... what does this mean for the 136 guys that got kicked to the curb? Is ASA really going to attempt next summers flying 56 pilots short of 2009's summer staffing plus attrition? Granted attrition is slow.. but we are still losing around 10-15 pilots every 6 months. I have already gone up almost 50+/- since ASA STOPPED hiring/about 25+/- since the 1st round of furloughs. How lean does ASA want to run staffing at? It's GREAT that no more pilots will get furloughed but hey... all that's left is the ones on the no furlough clause that SEEMS to be holding right now. So that really isn't a gain, more like a draw. These are just concerns and opinions, not conclusions. Like I said... I agree wait till details are out.
I agree 100%... wait till details are out. But....... what does this mean for the 136 guys that got kicked to the curb? Is ASA really going to attempt next summers flying 56 pilots short of 2009's summer staffing plus attrition? Granted attrition is slow.. but we are still losing around 10-15 pilots every 6 months. I have already gone up almost 50+/- since ASA STOPPED hiring/about 25+/- since the 1st round of furloughs. How lean does ASA want to run staffing at? It's GREAT that no more pilots will get furloughed but hey... all that's left is the ones on the no furlough clause that SEEMS to be holding right now. So that really isn't a gain, more like a draw. These are just concerns and opinions, not conclusions. Like I said... I agree wait till details are out.
If this makes us grow like ASA thinks it will, the furloughs will be back quickly. ASA thinks we will be well positioned to capture the RFPs that are out there. And I heard this through the ALPA filter!
If this makes us grow like ASA thinks it will, the furloughs will be back quickly. ASA thinks we will be well positioned to capture the RFPs that are out there. And I heard this through the ALPA filter!
oh yeah good plan, lets kill qol by giving the company complete control over schedules so we can get all those RFPs out there. Cause you know theres a s***load of RFPs out there now. And I dont see too many RFPs in the next 5 years either. Except for if UA puts the nail in mesas coffin.
PBS sucks, like said before if your not senior its a hit or miss, and if you dont believe me. Wait till your months when you have either vacation/recurrent GS/or a PC. You get hosed royally.
I hear Express Jet is getting the United RFP anyway. Regarding the furloughs, they are already out and will only get back through attrition at the Regionals or through growth. Not by schedule making.
I got the lowdown directly from the source today (an ASA ALPA PBS negotiator).
You all are going to like this. We got most of what we asked for. It will not be anything like what SkyWest has... more like what DAL has. We also got some "problems" with the current contract fixed. Most importantly, ASA has agreed that there will be no need for additional furloughs. The "source" says ASA management thinks this is going to cause us to grow like crazy.
I beg you all (ASA pilots) to wait for the details to become public before deciding. Don't listen to the pundits at other airlines telling you PBS sucks. We are completely reinventing it. Those tho know me know I'm one of ALPA's biggest critics, but after hearing the details, I have to admit I'm impressed. We got a good PBS system, yet DID NOT overreach.
The process is going to be slow. Don't expect implementation for at least six months. Stay tuned as info becomes public.
I'm unfamiliar with the DAL system, can you explain it and the differences between the Skywest system?
Not to steer the thread, but everyone says they think they are getting the RFP's.
Back to pref-bid. PBS CAN be done well- the question is "well" for who? If the company doesn't have rules against them it works well for them, all pilots get loaded up on trips and it can even be junior based for higher time lines (saves the company $$). It can work well for pilots if you are senior OR have firm enough restrictions on the construction of your line- especially with training, vacations, and other pre-assigned calendar items.
I'm unfamiliar with the DAL system, can you it and the differences between the Skywest system?
For one thing, DALPA has final QC on all lines and can make the company rerun categories if QOL drops. The lines aren't posted until line pilots approve them. I'm 45 from the bottom of a 450 pilot category, ATL ER B, and I've gotten my first choice of days off for the last 6 months. Seems to work here.
Similar Threads
Linear Mode
