If there is a max pay, i.e $6000 in the HSA just like the ppo, why would a major health care cost be a bigger deal in the HSA? I mean, if you had a traumatic event like a cancer care, wouldn't you just be on the hook for the max?
I guess it depends on how long the cancer treatment lasts. With my mom, it was 3 years. That would be $18,000 out of pocket, or more if the 36 months were split between 4 calendar years. With my current PPO plan, our max out of pocket is $1,500 per year.
I admit I don't have all the info on an HSA plan, and I might even advocate them for some people. From my perspective, HSA is to HMO, as 401(k) is to pension. It takes personal responsibility--something Americans want, but most can't handle. If you look at Americans as a whole when it comes to 401(k)s, it's not very impressive. Companies that offer HSAs need to have a lot of guidance on what an appropriate amount to save.
I admit I don't have all the info on an HSA plan, and I might even advocate them for some people. From my perspective, HSA is to HMO, as 401(k) is to pension. It takes personal responsibility--something Americans want, but most can't handle. If you look at Americans as a whole when it comes to 401(k)s, it's not very impressive. Companies that offer HSAs need to have a lot of guidance on what an appropriate amount to save.
This is an accurate comparison...Like pensions, however, HMOs and PPOs are not sustainable long term...They are nice "promises", but the money simply isn't there to follow through on the "promises"...The pensions aren't very impressive anymore either....
The current mess we are in is because of the lack of personal responsibility you refer to....That is our downfall...
...The pensions aren't very impressive anymore either....
The current mess we are in is because of the lack of personal responsibility you refer to....That is our downfall...
Baloney. The mess that we are in is a result of encouraged and institutionalized greed birthed during the Reagan era. Lack of regulatory oversight led to the Great Depression. The right wing steadiliy eroded oversight through legislation and neglect, creating another economic crisis.
The difficulties we face are not due to some widespread failing of the American people. These difficulties have been created by the system of crony capitalism in place in our country. Government has the ability through the crafting of tax laws and financial regulation to facilitate and encourage individual savings. Pension systems fail due to poor business decisions, not because Americans are morally weak or lack individual responsibility.
The monied class has used the government/corporate revolving door to line its own pockets and ignore the long term needs of our nation. They are focused on this quarter's profits and this year's bonus check. They do not care about the ever expanding fiscal bite health care costs take from working americans. They do not care about steering our educational system in a way that insures americans will be the world's best educated work force. All they care about is diverting more and more of our nation's wealth into a narrow and very wealthy sliver of the population. At this, they have been phenomenally successful.
Baloney. The mess that we are in is a result of encouraged and institutionalized greed birthed during the Reagan era. Lack of regulatory oversight led to the Great Depression. The right wing steadiliy eroded oversight through legislation and neglect, creating another economic crisis.
The difficulties we face are not due to some widespread failing of the American people. These difficulties have been created by the system of crony capitalism in place in our country. Government has the ability through the crafting of tax laws and financial regulation to facilitate and encourage individual savings. Pension systems fail due to poor business decisions, not because Americans are morally weak or lack individual responsibility.
The monied class has used the government/corporate revolving door to line its own pockets and ignore the long term needs of our nation. They are focused on this quarter's profits and this year's bonus check. They do not care about the ever expanding fiscal bite health care costs take from working americans. They do not care about steering our educational system in a way that insures americans will be the world's best educated work force. All they care about is diverting more and more of our nation's wealth into a narrow and very wealthy sliver of the population. At this, they have been phenomenally successful.
So you don't think people over extended themselves and spent more than they had? I saw a lot of "regular" folks get "greedy" with the housing boom...They actually believed that it was going to continue.
As far as regulation...It was government involvement in trying to put people in houses that couldn't qualify normally that made the problem worse...
Health care costs and lack of retirement savings are the next shoes to drop....At least we have our fancy cell phones, X boxes, and plasma TVs....
So you don't think people over extended themselves and spent more than they had?
As far as regulation...It was government involvement in trying to put people in houses that couldn't qualify normally that made the problem worse...
Health care costs and lack of retirement savings are the next shoes to drop....At least we have our fancy cell phones, X boxes, and plasma TVs....
People certainly over-extended themselves. Lack of government oversight led to bizarre mortgages and financial products behind the scenes such as credit default swaps. Eventually the whole house of cards came down. Were home buyers greedy and hyped up by unrealistic increases in home values? Sure. This same combination of greed and lack of government scrutiny led Enron and A. G. Anderson executives to use wacky accounting to falsely value their assets, eventually leading to another spectacular failure.
"Lack of retirement savings"? Is the problem a lack of savings or people believing the stock market would never decline and making investments containing too much risk? George W. Bush wanted to privatize Social Security. Too bad I could not get my hands on my SSA account and invest the whole nut on breathtakingly complex financial products. Or better yet, take it all to Vegas and place it on "red".
What is the greater economic engine; people saving a lot or buying consumer goods? Probably a combination of the two. The government has the power to steer this with smart fiscal and economic policy and a system of regulatory oversight.
hey question for someone with an understanding of how the ASA system works.
If I choose to go with the HSA plan now, I was using the PPO, when I enroll in the HSA plan do I need to click on the medical tab under open enrollment and choose "i decline coverage" where the option to otherwise choose PPO is?
I'm amazed how in the same post somebody can 1. blame government for all the ills of society, and 2. expect government to come to the rescue.
The government didn't put a gun to the head of borrowers and force them into 3:1 ARMs, or buying houses with monthly payments over 35% their net income, or using their house as a home equity ATM machine, or force them into thousands of dollars in unsecured credit card debt for their flat-screen TVs and iPhones.
Yes, greed and the zealous desire to produce returns for shareholders played a role in this economic situation...but its far too simple (and naive) to point a finger at people with (R)s beside their name without pointing one just as hard at the LACK OF PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY involved in all this.
Americans proclaim to want choice & responsibility, but as a whole are clearly unwilling to accept that responsibility and the consequences that comes with it.
A little less government and a little more Dave Ramsey would do this country a hell of a lot of good.
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