Notices
Mesa Airlines Regional Airline

Mesa

Old 03-30-2013, 06:34 PM
  #11  
Gets Weekends Off
 
sidestep's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: F0
Posts: 403
Default

I think Sulk might be being a bit too optimistic. There are probably 300 lifers, and HI based upgrade senority is currently mid-2005. Choose wisely.
sidestep is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 12:06 AM
  #12  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Position: South Paw
Posts: 630
Default

Sulkair is correct on the training. Excellent group of guys in the training department. Excellent chief pilots as well. It has gotten better. But let me tell you. Shorting my paychecks and having to fight for my money. Trying to bring me below min days off to deadhead back to base. Management is still horrible here. No duty Regs, block or better is crap. Lots of block of better lost do to cancelled flights.
skillett is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 12:45 AM
  #13  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Position: South Paw
Posts: 630
Default

Originally Posted by sulkair View Post
Right now the most Jr mainland upgrade is about 9 1/2 years. Not sure about HI. Probably at least 6 yrs, maybe worse.

My prediction is that upgrade will return to about a 5 year average within the next year or two. Just a guess tho. Who knows! We would need to grow significantly for that to happen, and/or mainline hiring picks up significantly. So actually that is a foolish prediction to even make.

Mesa doesn't have an inordinate number of lifers, they just make up a larger percentage of the group than they used to because we went from near 2000 pilots to 650 in a short period of time. The only people who could hold the left seat after the decimation were ~10 year guys and of course they tended to be the people who hadn't moved on, (As we all know many reach a point with age, and pay, where it doesn't make sense to move on.)

If Mesa could grow again to a pilot group of 2000 then those 200 to 300 pilots who are truly lifers (if they even represent a number that big) would only represent 10 to 15 % of the group, as they once did.

Do I personally see us ever being that big again? Not rea, but who knows?
Would have to grow to 2000 before short upgrades happen again? Not going to happen. Not enough pilots out there. You are feeding the koolaid with Vodka. You will have a better chance getting a job at mainline before you upgrade here in five years. Most Captains hear over 50 and not planning on starting over, I fly with them everyday. If your a senior Captain here you have a pretty good life. On reserve your screwed. Line holding FO not to bad if you like bringing home about 36,000 a year. But it will get worse. We are short FO's now!

Last edited by skillett; 03-31-2013 at 12:47 AM. Reason: Inaccurate amount.
skillett is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 07:55 AM
  #14  
Line Holder
 
GearMover's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: A-320
Posts: 79
Default

Originally Posted by sulkair View Post
A few positives just for fun.

#1) Training

I don't know how to compare our training department to others because I've only been here, but after 10 years here, many years in the Navy and in other professional fields I am continually impressed with the degree of professionalism that the individual instructors, examiners and check-airmen exude. With rare exception they have always been extremely competent, understanding, helpful, and enjoyable.

Strangely whenever I've been in the pipeline for a transition (3 different a/c over 2 different certificates) or upgrade, or recurrent. I absolutely feel like I'm at a different company. Hell even ASAP remedial was a pleasure - sorry it's true!

You will have a solid training experience here, no doubt about it!

#2)

Chief Pilots out west are phenomenal! (Can't speak to the ones out east) These guys work their asses off for the pilot group. In many cases their hands are tied, but they persist in trying to do the right thing and are extremely fair. They are not out to get you, and are real pilot's pilots, (experienced pilots from the old school). We're dang lucky to have them, and most of us know it!

#3)

Down to earth professional crews who work hard, fly well, and act like decent human beings to one another and the people they come in contact with i.e. station personnel. Sounds mushy but we're all beat up and we know it, the only thing we truly have is each other, and so we tend to protect it, for sanity's sake.

#4)

A fleet of big RJ's.

#5)

Electronic Flight Bag! Yes, i know we have to pay for the Ipad ourselves but I don't mind because this is huge

#6)

Very good on-time/completion numbers which hopefully translates into extended contracts and future business. Please see #3 for the reason behind this.


This is not Koolaid guys. Trust me, I'm a big critic of this place, but I also know good things when I see them, and what I've mentioned in this post is the truly good, and not the only good, there is more, but this stands out for me.


I agree 1000%. The training department is awesome. I've seen guys having difficulty with parts of training and the instructors, on their own time, spend as much time as needed until they UNDERSTOOD. Same with the sim(they dont have as much time but they will work hard with you) I would say to a man the training department wants you to pass. They know the time effort and sacrfice you put in to get there they are going to make sure you make it. (You have to show the will and desire to pass if you show unprepaired and dont care then you're going to have trouble)

Chief pilots will go to bat for you as long as your honest. You can be 100% wrong and they will still fight for you. They do have to answer to management so they have their limits but great group.

Crews-never discount how important this is. There are several Mesa lifers but it is by choice 99% of them are just hard working good people its hard to put into words how nice it is to show up to a plane and know that even if everything goes wrong with the trip (weather maint) the crew you are with are going to take it in stride, do what needs to be done and go home safe at the end of the trip.

9 new CRJ-900's coming on line in the next few months. Don't discount the fact that Mesa has only 700/900's (go! is a Mesa product so I don't count it in the fleet count). These aircraft are in demand and I can't see them going away any time soon.

I've been furloughed and came back, I have many friends who didn't come back but wish they did and more friends who went to another carrier and came back. LIFE AT MESA IS WHAT YOU MAKE IT. I've flown with the 25 year guys who say Mesa sucks but they are the guys who STAYED and did nothing (worked with ALPA on contracts) to change the things that are wrong. There are bitter guys like SKILLET who have something bad to say about everything yet when you point the way to the door have a million excuses why they are still here.

If you are a new hire there is a chance you may get Hawaii I wont pull any punches it is very expensive. I've been there I was paying more for a room then for an apartment back east. If your single and flexable you can make it work. Remember the crews at Mesa are great when you get there they will help you any way they can. go! is understaffed and thats not going to change. Name another place where you can get off the plane change into you board shorts grab your surfboard out of the crew room get on the bus and hit the waves? Island flying is hard (8+ legs a day of about 20min each) but you will learn so much about flying the CRJ from it. As I said before IT IS WHAT YOU MAKE IT.

YEP SCREW schedualing is horrible but I don't know of any place that has schedualing that calls and says "hey we had someone call out and would like it for you to show up to take the flight but if you dont want to dont worry about it you just do what you want and we'll work around what works best for you" if you're dealing with these people get ready its going to suck for you.

Mesa screws up paychecks, benifits, calling on days off and much much more deal with it professionally and you will be fine.

The contract sucks but I am one that believes pay and other areas will need to get better because of new aircraft and Mesa has to bring people in to fly them. Stand by on this one I'm sure management will kick and scream about everything but I also think they understand it needs to be done.

If you come to Mesa as a new hire come in knowing with the shortage of pilots is going to make things "interesting". The staffing issue is something every regional will have to deal with very soon do some research on your own. Where ever you go start with a good attitude and good luck!
GearMover is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 08:40 AM
  #15  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: ERJ CA
Posts: 262
Default

Originally Posted by citation35hf View Post
Ok, I understand the morale isn't great.

With that said, I promise you don't have the worst pay in the industry. We have no duty rigs, no cancellation pay, at RAH. I credited 40hrs during the month of Katrina. Same with Gojets, look at their pay.
That doesn't even make sense. what about the 75 hour monthly guarantee? Also Mesa has lower hourly rates than RAH and does not have duty rigs or any other type of work rules either. I credit about 20 hours more a month at SkyWest than I was at Mesa working similar trips.
Drums4life is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 09:05 AM
  #16  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Position: CRJ
Posts: 273
Default

RAH apparently doesn't have a line guarantee. FO there was in my jump recently and echo'd the same thing. When Sandy hit, whole trips CX'd and they didn't get paid for it. I think that's the point the other poster was trying to make. Mesa has line guarantee and RAH doesn't.
squall line is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 09:41 AM
  #17  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: ERJ CA
Posts: 262
Default

Originally Posted by squall line View Post
RAH apparently doesn't have a line guarantee. FO there was in my jump recently and echo'd the same thing. When Sandy hit, whole trips CX'd and they didn't get paid for it. I think that's the point the other poster was trying to make. Mesa has line guarantee and RAH doesn't.
Thats insane. I didn't realize there was anybody out there without a monthly guarantee. Guess they need to update the profile section on here to reflect that.
Drums4life is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 11:49 AM
  #18  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Position: South Paw
Posts: 630
Default

Originally Posted by GearMover View Post
I agree 1000%. The training department is awesome. I've seen guys having difficulty with parts of training and the instructors, on their own time, spend as much time as needed until they UNDERSTOOD. Same with the sim(they dont have as much time but they will work hard with you) I would say to a man the training department wants you to pass. They know the time effort and sacrfice you put in to get there they are going to make sure you make it. (You have to show the will and desire to pass if you show unprepaired and dont care then you're going to have trouble)

Chief pilots will go to bat for you as long as your honest. You can be 100% wrong and they will still fight for you. They do have to answer to management so they have their limits but great group.

Crews-never discount how important this is. There are several Mesa lifers but it is by choice 99% of them are just hard working good people its hard to put into words how nice it is to show up to a plane and know that even if everything goes wrong with the trip (weather maint) the crew you are with are going to take it in stride, do what needs to be done and go home safe at the end of the trip.

9 new CRJ-900's coming on line in the next few months. Don't discount the fact that Mesa has only 700/900's (go! is a Mesa product so I don't count it in the fleet count). These aircraft are in demand and I can't see them going away any time soon.

I've been furloughed and came back, I have many friends who didn't come back but wish they did and more friends who went to another carrier and came back. LIFE AT MESA IS WHAT YOU MAKE IT. I've flown with the 25 year guys who say Mesa sucks but they are the guys who STAYED and did nothing (worked with ALPA on contracts) to change the things that are wrong. There are bitter guys like SKILLET who have something bad to say about everything yet when you point the way to the door have a million excuses why they are still here.

If you are a new hire there is a chance you may get Hawaii I wont pull any punches it is very expensive. I've been there I was paying more for a room then for an apartment back east. If your single and flexable you can make it work. Remember the crews at Mesa are great when you get there they will help you any way they can. go! is understaffed and thats not going to change. Name another place where you can get off the plane change into you board shorts grab your surfboard out of the crew room get on the bus and hit the waves? Island flying is hard (8+ legs a day of about 20min each) but you will learn so much about flying the CRJ from it. As I said before IT IS WHAT YOU MAKE IT.

YEP SCREW schedualing is horrible but I don't know of any place that has schedualing that calls and says "hey we had someone call out and would like it for you to show up to take the flight but if you dont want to dont worry about it you just do what you want and we'll work around what works best for you" if you're dealing with these people get ready its going to suck for you.

Mesa screws up paychecks, benifits, calling on days off and much much more deal with it professionally and you will be fine.

The contract sucks but I am one that believes pay and other areas will need to get better because of new aircraft and Mesa has to bring people in to fly them. Stand by on this one I'm sure management will kick and scream about everything but I also think they understand it needs to be done.

If you come to Mesa as a new hire come in knowing with the shortage of pilots is going to make things "interesting". The staffing issue is something every regional will have to deal with very soon do some research on your own. Where ever you go start with a good attitude and good luck!
Number one I'm not bitter about everything. see good tranining department, good chief pilots, good pilots, very experienced we all are. Shown the door and go where. Start all over again, I guess? Go back to college. Hiring is coming and that gets me excited. Bitter about everything I am not. I invested 4 years of college, 15 years in the business. The management sucks here is what I'm saying. These aircraft will not be staffed and all my friends here are interviewing and ****ed about the treatment they have been receiving. 8 years at Mesa and still bringing home 36,000 a year. That is crap wages for what I have invested. I'm bitter about the pay at all regionals. It sucks. All my friends make well over 100,000 in other jobs. I had bad timing, it happens even to the best of people. And it's not Mesa's fault. I took a chance in the biz and all my chips are in. But before you start firing shots over my bow, gets your facts straight. Mesa is still a crap ran regional, it will always be a place to get in and get out. unless your a 15 year Captain, but that still won't hold you a line in Phoenix.
skillett is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 12:05 PM
  #19  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Position: South Paw
Posts: 630
Default

And by the way, you can make 36,000 a year at Mcdonalds. live in Hawaii, get done with work and grab your board and hit the waves as well. Like you said, Mesa is what you make it. And at 40, my wife, kids, friends and family are all reaping the benfits of my incredible success.
skillett is offline  
Old 03-31-2013, 01:34 PM
  #20  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,459
Default

Originally Posted by skillett View Post
And by the way, you can make 36,000 a year at Mcdonalds. live in Hawaii, get done with work and grab your board and hit the waves as well. Like you said, Mesa is what you make it. And at 40, my wife, kids, friends and family are all reaping the benfits of my incredible success.
Yep, skillett - I'm the same age, and in the same exact boat. Downgrade, two small children. Point about Micky D's well taken, and I agree. This sucks bad and I feel stuck!

But... If I'm honest... Out of a new-hire class of well over 30, myself and only one other pilot are still at Mesa. Half dozen of them are now at Southwest. Half dozen at Virgin. Another half dozen at Jet Blue, I think one got on at Alaska. The rest are at Emirates, Atlas, you name it.

Point is I have no-one to blame but myself and I know it. Should have flown more, (not always bid CML reserve) should have knocked out that degree in the hotel rooms (at least you got that under your belt), should have upgraded earlier, should have been an instructor, check airman. Should have shook more hands, made more friends, and on and on.

What will become of us guys who are too old to start over yet still young enough to hope for a shot at a good airline job? Don't know but I'm as discouraged as you are trust me.

It'll get better next year right?
sulkair is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
nwa757
Regional
31
07-31-2018 04:58 PM
AirbornPegasus
Regional
14
04-08-2009 07:17 PM
Spanky189
Regional
10
05-16-2008 09:38 AM
familyguy
Regional
49
04-11-2008 12:03 AM
LOW FUEL
Regional
104
08-17-2007 04:41 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Your Privacy Choices