TalkTurkey

judging by the recent pages of posts, there's nothing new happening at this airline, eh? Hiring is down and there is no growth. I'm guess we are, for now, not that marketable as the other regionals...

iFlyRC

Thats from the RAA, the same spinsters that want to remove the 1500 hour rule so they don't have to raise pay to attract people.

JetDoc

And who stands to benefit?

"Researchers included University of North Dakota, Embry Riddle Aeronautical University, South Dakota State University, Purdue, Middle Tennessee State University, Arizona State University, and Ypsilon Associates, an independent research consulting firm."

Here is my shocked face...

Foodstamps

Absolutely INCORRECT. If the industry pays well, people can get loans (because banks will give them, because banks will know they can actually **be repaid** with fair wages) get the training they need in as little as six months, CFI for a bit to get their time up and be hired at a regional.

If regional jobs all paid what even the LOWEST tiers of the majors pays for a starting FO, PROBLEM SOLVED overnight!!

They don't want to pay, they want to drag this out as long as possible till they just can't source anyone for dog$hit wages anymore. Then and only then will they pay a professional wage for a professional job.

Unfortunately aviation is full of rich kids spending daddy's money and propagating the problem further and further. There is less of that now, but far from none. Easy to work for nothing when you're bankrolled your whole life.

PSA help

It will take a couple years to see the large numbers graduate from flight school, work as a CFI, and get their time. That will take time.

The fact is, though, that there are lots of pilots that would work for the airlines (even the regionals) if they pay was better. Look at the corporate jet guys, the 135's, the small cargo companies, even the lifer CFI's. If the pay and benefits were enough, they would make the jump to 121.

There really isn't a pilot shortage, there is a regional airline pay shortage. There are pilots, but not ones willing to work for the regionals. In the future, they may actually be a real pilot shortage. Once good companies are trying to hire pilots at $100k for the first year, and no one applies, then there is a shortage.

Once we start hitting 3000+ retirements a year, for several years, there is a possibility that there will be a real shortage.

Foodstamps

AMEN! Someone needs to get these guys to quit saying the word shortage!! Pay appropriately, you will ALWAYS have employees.

Has there EVER been a long term doctor shortage? Engineer shortage? Tech industry worker shortage? Hell no. Why might that be? Could it be simple economics? PAY APPROPRIATELY for the level of school, training, responsibility and proficiency required to do the job and you will NEVER be short of qualified, skilled labor. Never!

RemoveB4Flight

Not sure what was incorrect about what I said.
I said it is a pilot pay shortage but anyone who thinks a shortage of a skilled position can be solved overnight is sorely mistaken. You can't flip a switch and fix all the problems that the industry has created for itself. The truth is that the low pay has not made a pilot a very desirable career option for young people.
If they increase pay today it will be the start of the solution but it will take time to see the return on that investment.

Also, not sure if you know how getting loans works, but it seems that you aren't aware. A bank isn't going to give you a loan amount based on what your career option is or what you could possibly make in that career. They will give you a loan based on your financial status (or many cases your parents). So you are incorrect in saying a bank will loan you more if pilots are better compensated. That compensation doesn't even enter the calculation.

atpcliff

there's a HUGE shortage of high-end assembly line and blue collar tech workers right now...because of the baby boomer retirements. Also a shortage of renewable energy workers. All the above need a decent amount of tech training, and they can't find anyone right now...

Banks will NOT lend money for flight training. And, many flight schools have no open student pilot slots, because they are all being filled by non-American/non-green card holders.

Foodstamps

Hmm, removeb4flight and your comments seem to run contrary to the $35,000 loan I received for all my flight training. (yes, SPECIFICALLY for flight training) Underwriters will underwrite a loan if they think you have the ability to pay it back. That is their job. If they know you will make $hit wages for a decade, yes, no loan.

If you are to make a livable age, whether you're an engineer, diesel mechanic, nurse, whatever, you CAN secure a loan for just about anything. Perfect terms? Probably not, it's not a secured loan. But if your industry doesn't pay garbage, the loan is at least somewhat secure in and of your career ambitions. Otherwise NOBODY would get loans for ANYTHING. There are tons of CFI's, 135 guys, pt91 guys etc that would LOVE to go to even a regional, but will not/can not handle making garbage wages, they have mouths to feed. If the wage was right, starting, 75-95K+, OVERNIGHT you would see an absolute GLUT of pilots willing to go to their first 121 gig. Get real.

Nevada

I agree with Foodstamps. I guarantee that if you were to make starting regional FO pay $75,000 and give regional pilots a defined career path all of the shortage concerns would be fixed. Instead the RAA and others blame things like the 1500 rule, lack of training financing, etc. If you pay them they will come.