Express pilot

VOTE “NO”


For those on the fence, procrastinators in the group and the few that are willing to change their votes, here is some food for thought.

Vote NO and here is why. It’s not EQUAL. Isn’t that what are representatives want from this contract. Well it is not. Take these 3 areas.

NWA’s sick leave bank, which some have accumulated up to 1700 hrs., according to a union rep I talked to, will be applied at a reduced rate to their DPMA premiums for as long as they have a credit. In some cases this will be their entire career at Delta.
NWA’s pension will need to be contributed to by Delta Air Lines Inc. Again our union reps have given a figure between $9 and $25 MILLION dollars a year to fund this at it’s present state for the first couple years. After that it is all speculation and we know how that works. How does $50,000,000 to $100,000,000 a year sound if all speculative and planned returns don’t come to pass? Are we willing to take majors pay cuts to fund something we DON”T get? It could and probably will happen in this rollercoaster industry.
NWA’s uniform allowance. How much did you get when you came to Delta? I sure could use a new HAT or maybe a flight kit that is kept together with speed tape and stickers. I could use an allowance.

This is only three areas that jump out at me that a dollar amount can be determined and has been negotiated with Delta INC and NWA Pilots. Why don’t we get EQUAL value for this contract? In 2012, NWA pilots will get EVERYTHING we get plus at least these extras. Why aren’t we given credit for any of this? A reduced DPMA premium that they are getting, an accumulated amount of money that they are getting equal to their pension costs divided up between ONLY former Delta pilots and a nice check for some new uniforms or accessories of my choosing that they are getting.

I’m tired of hearing let’s all have the same contract when we don’t. We get the new contract. NWA pilots get the new contract PLUS. So much for a fair and equal contract. The only solution is to vote NO and make it happen.

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Parrot Head

NuGuy

Heyas,

The NWA guys are giving up MANY, MANY quality of life items from their PWA that will be difficult or impossible to replace down the road.

Cash is the least expensive part of any PWA, and is easy to fix. Cheap cash is what we're trading for our VALUABLE QoL items. Even the cash isn't close to parity. The DC contributions don't even kick in until 2012 (a HUGE savings).

It's no windfall. Get over yourself.

Nu

Nopac

Agreed. The pay raise is nice, but it could disappear very quickly when the new Super Delta finds itself in financial straits down the road. There are a number of nice things that the NW guys are losing. Too bad they didn't cherry-pick the best from both contracts...



btw, Express, a friend of mine at DAL cut/pasted a post from the DAL web board and sent it to me a two days ago asking what I thought. It is the same post that you just put up here. If you're the original author, hey, more power to ya bro; spread your message. If you're not, then you should give proper attribution.

DAL4EVER

I really have to question your sanity right now? What does a NO vote offer? What benefit does a NO vote give other than to throw in peril what could be better job security through a healthy company, increased wages, a global route structure, etc. Your right, I would like a new hat, maybe even the NWA leather jacket when I'm doing a frozen walk around at JFK, but so what. Look at the benefits of the total merger. What information, other than conjecture or opinion do you have to offer that would support the benefits of voting NO to voting YES. At least you know most of the beast by voting YES, voting NO and you have no idea what the new beast will be.

I voted YES and encourage EVERY DAL and NWA pilot to do the same. Let's get on with this merger and become America's global airline.

slowplay

Nice platitude, but not true. Depending on airline, cash makes up 70-80% of the value of a contract. NWA is no exception. You can verify with Form 41 data if you'd like.

That's not close to true. The VALUABLE QoL items that you lose are more than easily offset by the payraises that merged pilots receive, and your DC contributions, while phased in, are substantially above what you have standing alone.

It'll be nice when your "premium" widebody flying actually pays a premium!

caddis

I usually stay away from the flame type posts but I feel the need to answer this one.

Express pilot what do you hope to gain by a no vote? Do you really think that there is a better contract out there for you? And do you want it at the expense of the NWA pilots?

You do know that there are step backwards in this contract for the NWA side.

Also the NWA side is most likely going to give on the SLI. I will give up my sick leave and pension for DOH, but it ain't gonna happen.

Express, in the end both pilot groups are going to give up some things. It is in the interest of both groups to get this deal and the SLI completed and move forward in a unified front.

DAL4EVER

Exactly. As a youngster in the sandbox, I might have gotten mad if you took my dumptruck. However, my mom would then teach me that its okay if you took my dumptruck because now I get to play with a shovel. We all learned that to play along there is always compromise. Its life. At the end, the compromises may sting but hopefully we will all be stronger and better off for them.

Express pilot

Ya bro I put it on the DAL web board so more power to me. I wanted to see what you guys would say, even though I knew ya'll were a bunch of yes guys. I don't get it, I have not found one guy at Delta thats says they are voting yes except for this board and a check airmen a ran into.

Everything I posted were facts, you guys shoot from the hip (like Superpilot says) why would you want to vote yes if you are not NW. And the guy at NW that says they are giving up some much on other terms, give me some facts and lets not say your contract is set up to be an instructor pilot like NuGuy was giving us facts on some other thread.

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Parrot Head

slowplay

Really? Here you are an Express guy calling himself an MD-88FO and over there you are a 767ER Captain with 20 years. Which is it?

Anonymous web integrity....

Rotorhead

I don't post all too often, however I can promise one thing. A nay on this contract will result in the following:

DAL synergies as the biggest, best airline will be lost.

NWA will maintain ALL the Asian routes until it's next bk and those governments will then allow all airlines, foreign and domestic to make bids on them; DAL will only end up with a fraction of that structure, AMR and the rest of the world the rest.

CAL and/or AMR will again become the king on the street, the 600 pound gorilla (and you know which one I am referring to) will punish DAL. Last time I checked, AMR has paid down their debt to less than two billion of what DAL has. I am sorry, but the airline that bears the country's name will not fail. It may bk, but it will come out the back end something fierce.

Don't be a fool. We have an opportunity to succeed, to each is their own decision.