New UAX carrier.
12-06-2012, 01:50 PM
#1
New Hire
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Joined APC: Aug 2011
Position: Cape Air Cessna 402 Captain
Posts: 7
New UAX carrier.
Per 1-C-1-c. United can create, control, acquire.... their own UAX carrier and it WONT be considered company flying!
I read that to say they can hire a whole set of separate pilots to fly them.
How about that!??
I read that to say they can hire a whole set of separate pilots to fly them.
How about that!??
12-06-2012, 03:43 PM
#3
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Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,639
Originally Posted by Justin Turco
Per 1-C-1-c. United can create, control, acquire.... their own UAX carrier and it WONT be considered company flying!
I read that to say they can hire a whole set of separate pilots to fly them.
How about that!??
I read that to say they can hire a whole set of separate pilots to fly them.
How about that!??
Otherwise if UAL bought a UAX carrier they would be required by the other sections of the TA to merge the UAX seniority list with the mainline list and the mainline pilots don't want that happening. The UAL owned UAX carrier would still be subject to the normal scope limits for seating capacity and gross weight.
12-06-2012, 03:53 PM
#4
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Joined APC: May 2009
Position: The GF of FUPM
Posts: 3,073
The last two trips both caps were chiding me for my vote. They wanted to know why I was voting no. When I appraised them of some of the hidden bombs and concessionary language in the contract they were skeptical. It turned out that neither had actually read the TA, only the overview! You know, the two page list of things long on goodies and virtually silent about the hidden BS and give backs.
This is the reality of airline pilot labor today. Its pathetic!
This is the reality of airline pilot labor today. Its pathetic!
12-06-2012, 03:54 PM
#5
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Joined APC: Sep 2010
Position: EWR 777 Captain
Posts: 1,715
1-C-1-c The Company or a Company Affiliate may create, acquire, Control, manage, take an
Equity interest in, enter into Code Share Agreements with, or sell, lease or transfer aircraft
to United Express Carriers that comply with the provisions of Section 1-C-1, without the
flight operations of such air carrier being considered Company Flying or the aircraft of such
air carrier being considered Company Aircraft.
Equity interest in, enter into Code Share Agreements with, or sell, lease or transfer aircraft
to United Express Carriers that comply with the provisions of Section 1-C-1, without the
flight operations of such air carrier being considered Company Flying or the aircraft of such
air carrier being considered Company Aircraft.
Take a deep breath and repeat after me. ALPA is not an idiot . . .
You're grasping at straws here, and if you seriously read that and thought there was some magic loop hole, then I'm sorry to disappoint you. This means UAX carriers are NOT UAL pilots BUT they still have to follow ALL the UAX rules.
12-06-2012, 07:51 PM
#6
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Position: Skeptical
Posts: 378
1-C-1-c The Company or a Company Affiliate may create, acquire, Control, manage, take an Equity interest in, enter into Code Share Agreements with, or sell, lease or transfer aircraft to United Express Carriers that comply with the provisions of Section 1-C-1, without the flight operations of such air carrier being considered Company Flying or the aircraft of such air carrier being considered Company Aircraft.
12-06-2012, 07:55 PM
#7
I'm a man of my word.
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: Devil's Advocate
Posts: 2,883
Originally Posted by Golden Bear
Just a thought, but if the above read "may not" rather than "may", wouldn't that be a huge win for UAL pilots, UAX pilots, the deterrence of lift outsourcing, and our entire industry in general?
12-06-2012, 08:06 PM
#8
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Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: 737 CA
Posts: 2,750
UAL has never been one to own their feed anyway. THey didn't follow AMR and DAL down that road. THey would rather farm it out to the lowest bidder. Pit 6 or 7 carriers against each other...lowest bid wins. DAL would have been smart to do the same....as they are now. How much did they pay for Comair? ASA? How did that work out for them? This section allows UAL to buy a feeder without the flying being considered "company flying". Meaning UNITED flying. It says right in the paragraph that the flying will have to comply with 1.C.1 - our scope section covering UAX. It is amazing how all us forum experts think we are smarter than SMEs and lawyers Alpa pays good money for.
Sled
Sled
12-06-2012, 08:26 PM
#9
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Posts: 4,603
Originally Posted by Golden Bear
Just a thought, but if the above read "may not" rather than "may", wouldn't that be a huge win for UAL pilots, UAX pilots, the deterrence of lift outsourcing, and our entire industry in general?
12-06-2012, 08:43 PM
#10
I'm a man of my word.
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: Devil's Advocate
Posts: 2,883
Originally Posted by jsled
UAL has never been one to own their feed anyway. THey didn't follow AMR and DAL down that road. THey would rather farm it out to the lowest bidder. Pit 6 or 7 carriers against each other...lowest bid wins. DAL would have been smart to do the same....as they are now. How much did they pay for Comair? ASA? How did that work out for them? This section allows UAL to buy a feeder without the flying being considered "company flying". Meaning UNITED flying. It says right in the paragraph that the flying will have to comply with 1.C.1 - our scope section covering UAX. It is amazing how all us forum experts think we are smarter than SMEs and lawyers Alpa pays good money for.
Sled
Sled
But you got yours, right?
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