Originally Posted by
Swakid8
There’s a time and place for long supplemental ops and long duty days like going into places where staying isn’t a option John. The shock isn’t about a long duty day to be honest but it’s trying to normalize a long duty for flights like ORD-ICN-ANC where WGA has the option of laying a crew over in ICN.
I am looking at what the industry is doing and comparing it to what WGA is doing.
The company did lay a crew over in Incheon. Fresh crew, operates Incheon to Chicago. Crew then operates to Anchorage. The poster did not stipulate the number of crew, or whether one, or both legs were conducted under Part 91. Thus, it would incorrect to point a finger and suggest wrong doing on the part of the company, or crew.
Most likely the second leg was a Part 91 leg, but we don't know.
As you're intimately familiar with the regulation, then you know that a crew must voluntarily agree to make the second leg under Part 91, as the company cannot assign it. If the company assigns a flight, it's duty. The duty can end, however, and the Pat 91 flight be conducted after duty has ended, and it not considered duty.
That does not preclude an operator from conducting a strictly Part 91 day, such as repositioning an empty aircraft with no revenue cargo or passengers on board. Barring contractual obligations (eg, a union contract), the company employs the crew and may use crew to move an airplane the same as a corporate airplane, without legal requirement of rest interval prior, or after the flight, or duty limitations. Such flying is still commercial in nature and counts toward cumulative flight time limitations, but is not otherwise regulated by flight, duty, or rest requirements under Part 121.
As for "a time and a place," for long supplemental flights, that would be every flight a supplemental operator makes, which is why the regulation exists. To suggest that utilizing the flight, duty, and rest limitations imposed by the regulation is somehow reserved for extraordinary circumstances is ridiculous. If the regulation states that 20 hours is the duty day, then 20 hours area available for the duty day. It's that simple.
Nor shocking.
I don't now (nor do I care) what part of the industry you've experienced, but I've certainly flown and operated long 30 hour days, for years, in the "industry." Frequently, and regularly. I don't believe that WGA does such long days with regularity, but others do.
As for the operator that suggested the duration of the leg from Incheon to Chicago was rare and unusual, that's because he's on the 747 fleet. Dubai to Incheon, Los Angeles to Incheon, and Chicago to Incheon are regular features for the MD11 crew, who do not enjoy on board crew rest.