LAX is 320/I. You can always do Out of Base Makeup (as a line holder) in CLT, which is also 320/I. LGA is only 320/D and you won't be International qualified (because it takes 3 days of training to learn to fly to Cancun). So keep that in mind. Also, for Mutual Base Exchange, it's a lot harder to do it cross-division.

I think you just cinched the deal for me.

But not Mexico City

Depends.

As a "D" pilot you can fly to MEX via PHL, CLT, DFW, PHX and LAX, but not MIA. You need to be "I" qualified to talk to Merida. If it makes no sense to you, ask the schoolhouse. They probably don't know either, but it has always been that way...

I have not gotten a clear answer on cross division pick up. Neither from the union nor the company. I always get a different answer.

I couldn’t even get the schoolhouse to explain why all the Mexico info in the FOM is in the South America chapter. I really thought as a worldwide airline we’d be a little better at geography.

Try to add an Intl phone number or a foreign address to your personal info! That's fun (not). This is just a big regional airline.

Maybe the other Spanish speaking countries in Latin America get filed under Mexican countries in the next revision.
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Just remember, AA only RECENTLY stopped using QFE!

as an airways guy I have no idea what qfe is

It’s when they used to set their altimeter so it would read “zero” on landing, regardless of altitude

How recently is “RECENTLY”?

Apparently 30 years ago is "recently".

Considering the practice generally went away in the 60s (with the exception of Russia), and AA kept it well into the 90s, I'd say that's fairly recent.

95+ years of tradition, unheeded by progress.

Don't forget the hand motion that was involved with the gear up call. Been there since the DC2, only taken out of the training manual recently.

I don’t see it too much in CLT, but occasionally I do.

When I was in Miami, it was everyone.

Its nearly 100% with LAA guys, I don’t let it bug me, but try not to add any frivolous callouts or hand motions my self

Same....its a muscle memory thing more than anything else so I try to not let it bother me. Most guys try not to do it now, but I am sure there is something I do that has driven someone bonkers but I hope not!

You can pick up cross division in DOTC for PM/PR (premium makeup/premium reserve) Not sure about MU (makeup, basically straight time) but at this point why would you since everything is going premium. You cannot pickup cross division in TTS.

Agree. In terms of “silly/annoying things captains do” the gear gesture doesn’t even move the needle.

You can pick up cross division in base via P2P.

1) I’d love to know what this “gear hand gesture” y’all are talking about, as I have been here 21 years (LAA) and have never seen the hand gesture, nor heard it mentioned/taught during training. If it indeed happens it would be amusing to see, but I have never seen it.

2) QFE went away sometime in 1997 I believe, after the BDL tree trimmer. As I recall, the only two US airlines that used QFE into “modern” times were AA and Eastern. Back in the day before radio altimeters it was often praised as a safe procedure to indicate height above the ground at all times, as every ILS would be flown to 200’ on the main altimeters, and they would always read 0’ on the ground. With the advent of the radio altimeter it became a dated practice.

You’ve been here 21 years and don’t know what the gear handle gesture is?! I could care less that some captains do it, but yeah it’s definitely a quirk unique to LAA pilots.

No. I don’t know what it is because we have never trained any kind of “hand gesture” in my 21 years here. I’ve been on the 727, 75/76, MD80 and 737… nobody ever said a word about any hand gestures.. the only change I remember at one point is that the PF called out “positive rate gear up” but that was short lived. I’ve ridden countless jumpseats with LAA crews over the years and have yet to see it.
The only time I hear about it is here, on APC.

I would record it for you, but I'm pretty sure that would go over poorly. *Right hand appears in front of fo*. *thumb goes up* *entire hand goes up*. Sometimes this happens without a verbal "gear up" but that's not typical. I'm sure it's leftover from the dc3.

I’m thinking what you saw was an isolated thing (as weird as it sounds) and not necessarily reflective of any kind of training we ever received at LAA, because I never remember being taught anything like that. It was ALWAYS Positive Rate Gear Up and the PM raised the gear… period end of story. But can’t say I’m surprised to read about it here on APC as anything LAA whether real or fabricated is immediately subject to all kinds of ridicule. (and in this case it would be justified…)

Guard those auto throttles!!!!!

Imagine if that Asiana crew had that procedure…..


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aa73 I normally agree with you but on this you're crazy. I see the hand gesture from ~50% of LAA Captains I fly with.

imagine if that Asiana crew listened to the FO in the Jumpseat or had any scan what-so-ever

This posts shows a lack of understanding of multiple things.

OK then. See ya

I can also attest that it is not an “isolated” thing and it is 100% only done by legacy AA pilots…again it’s not a big deal, but it is definitely not fabricated either.

Basic questions about QOL at AA
 

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Whoever thought that was safe was an idiot. Probably the same guy who came up with F16 maneuvers to control a passenger jet in wake turbulence.

F16 maneuvers? No, that’s not what that was.

The "gear up/down" hand gesture was a fairly common practice amongst USAF heavy drivers back in the day, and in the T-37 if I remember correctly. That practice has steadily died away, though. Some things, when drilled into someone's head, just can't be removed. In the C-130 world, it used to be standard practice but it was taken out of the regs many years ago...but there were a number of old guys who just wouldn't let it go.

Seen it plenty on the line. Different ways also; open hand I dream of Jeannie style, thumbs up, to just a hand out and point at the handle.

C130s it’s still common practice for verbal&visual due to crew coordination since depending on the variant of aircraft it’s not a 2 person cockpit.

Big picture… does it matter?

I’ve never flown an aircraft with AT so perhaps you’re right.

At the same time a hand very close to or on the thrust levers might’ve been a good clue to the two guys in the pilot seats that something was amiss. AYB makes some good points too.


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Like monitoring guard while on the taxiway or ramp? I had ask one skipper (with a certain guard rep) one day, if he'd monitored guard on his way to the airport. He didn't get it. Otherwise, nice guy to fly with.