Advice to American applicants...
10-12-2016, 05:24 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2015
Posts: 233
never flew for a regional, so I have no comparison. My flight time at AA has been (MIA I 320):
MAY 25.26
JUN 45.20
JUL 32.13
AUG 60.28
SEP 39.55
OCT 24.38
I wouldn't count May, as it was IOE and I started the last week or so of May. August was long call, as well as October. In August I had two LC days converted to RAPS; I think I was second from the bottom on the LC list. October so far they tried once, but gave me a trip instead. Had I chose to live in base, I'd have a much better QOL. On LC, even the JR dude things have been pretty good. So far this month I have gotten two extra days at home, and proffered for a trip that gave me a lay over where I live (so three extra nights at home total); I think I had 4 extra days at home on August, maybe three. The only day I have had moved was at my request, so I could be home on a Sunday. No contract violations. I've had several premium trips. Short call commute sucks, period. But I don't think we are the only ones that do it and it is my choice to not live in base. When I get the kids out of school I will live in base and bid SC on the highest paying A/C I can hold. I chose AA specifically for the rapid growth in seniority that is coming, WB opportunities, and I want to live in Texas for the rest of my time on earth. I was called by everyone on your list + one more but not UAL, and turned them all down once I was in indoc at AA. I know there is room for improvement, hell the contract was right after bankruptcy, if I am not mistaken. There are some things, like calendar day, that I'd say we must have. But in the grand scheme of things I think it is alright. On the day my last trip started, I took my kids to school, went to the gun range to practice my run and gun, studied some Spanish and for the LSAT on my commute, and then spent the night in an all inclusive hotel in Cuba, and then the next night in one of my favorite counties (in Cali, Columbia). I am glad folks are energized and want to improve things; I agree there is much room for improvement. However, I would say if AA has a domicile where you want to live, they should not be at the bottom of the list.
MAY 25.26
JUN 45.20
JUL 32.13
AUG 60.28
SEP 39.55
OCT 24.38
I wouldn't count May, as it was IOE and I started the last week or so of May. August was long call, as well as October. In August I had two LC days converted to RAPS; I think I was second from the bottom on the LC list. October so far they tried once, but gave me a trip instead. Had I chose to live in base, I'd have a much better QOL. On LC, even the JR dude things have been pretty good. So far this month I have gotten two extra days at home, and proffered for a trip that gave me a lay over where I live (so three extra nights at home total); I think I had 4 extra days at home on August, maybe three. The only day I have had moved was at my request, so I could be home on a Sunday. No contract violations. I've had several premium trips. Short call commute sucks, period. But I don't think we are the only ones that do it and it is my choice to not live in base. When I get the kids out of school I will live in base and bid SC on the highest paying A/C I can hold. I chose AA specifically for the rapid growth in seniority that is coming, WB opportunities, and I want to live in Texas for the rest of my time on earth. I was called by everyone on your list + one more but not UAL, and turned them all down once I was in indoc at AA. I know there is room for improvement, hell the contract was right after bankruptcy, if I am not mistaken. There are some things, like calendar day, that I'd say we must have. But in the grand scheme of things I think it is alright. On the day my last trip started, I took my kids to school, went to the gun range to practice my run and gun, studied some Spanish and for the LSAT on my commute, and then spent the night in an all inclusive hotel in Cuba, and then the next night in one of my favorite counties (in Cali, Columbia). I am glad folks are energized and want to improve things; I agree there is much room for improvement. However, I would say if AA has a domicile where you want to live, they should not be at the bottom of the list.
10-12-2016, 05:38 PM
#22
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: A330
Posts: 1,043
Flew once in August and zero in September, cannot complain.
Chief pilot stiffed me out of 8.5 hours, called APA contracts, next morning, the thief tells me they'll pay.
Not all that bad and I ain't no cheerleader.
Need to replace people, not the union name, it would be stupid if you put the same smucks in office.
Chief pilot stiffed me out of 8.5 hours, called APA contracts, next morning, the thief tells me they'll pay.
Not all that bad and I ain't no cheerleader.
Need to replace people, not the union name, it would be stupid if you put the same smucks in office.
10-12-2016, 06:03 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Window seat
Posts: 5,196
If you're going to say your regional contract was better you need to post it. The regional guys I fly with get ****ed at these posts "it diminishes how bad it was when they say this."
Always the worst major airline work rules is laughable. If you're going to say that you need to tell us when you started flying and when you started airline flying. UPS in the late 1980's? UA in the early 2000's? Anyone remember the DL/NW bankruptcy era? The guys at the peak weren't born there.
1972/1978.
Always the worst major airline work rules is laughable. If you're going to say that you need to tell us when you started flying and when you started airline flying. UPS in the late 1980's? UA in the early 2000's? Anyone remember the DL/NW bankruptcy era? The guys at the peak weren't born there.
1972/1978.
Last edited by Sliceback; 10-12-2016 at 06:09 PM. Reason: Typo
10-12-2016, 06:15 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Window seat
Posts: 5,196
There are two moveable days a month. Two. Not all of them.
Golden days they have to get you home before midnight(?). What about hurricanes? Airport closures that night? They charter a jet and fly you home.
Regular reserve days they can fly you until noon of the first day off. If they do your 48/72/96 hrs off starts at noon and ends at noon on your first day back.
Golden days they have to get you home before midnight(?). What about hurricanes? Airport closures that night? They charter a jet and fly you home.
Regular reserve days they can fly you until noon of the first day off. If they do your 48/72/96 hrs off starts at noon and ends at noon on your first day back.
10-12-2016, 06:22 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,889
This place is nowhere near how bad the OP states.
Sure we have room to improve but it's WAY better than any regional. Yes, even QOL. Let's put it this way, if QOL was truly better at the regionals then why are they quitting to come here?
Let's also not forget that DAL and UAL didn't exactly have stellar contracts when in/exiting BK. Keep in mind we were the last ones to go thru the car wash while the other 2 are in their 3rd contract since then. We are only on our first.
Things will improve. The sky is not falling. And a career as an AA pilot is right up there with the other Big 2.
Sure we have room to improve but it's WAY better than any regional. Yes, even QOL. Let's put it this way, if QOL was truly better at the regionals then why are they quitting to come here?
Let's also not forget that DAL and UAL didn't exactly have stellar contracts when in/exiting BK. Keep in mind we were the last ones to go thru the car wash while the other 2 are in their 3rd contract since then. We are only on our first.
Things will improve. The sky is not falling. And a career as an AA pilot is right up there with the other Big 2.
10-12-2016, 06:47 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,533
No kidding, guys. I read the OP's post, and a couple of the guys who wholeheartedly supported his, and thought to myself "is this the same airline I work for?", because I've never been as abused as they say they are continually. The contract I worked under at my previous regional may have had some INDIVIDUAL items that were better than the comparable provisos in our contract, but in no way, shape, or form would I say the contract was better.
I asked around. I asked guys I know at UA and Envoy, and know a few guys at Skywest. The Skywesy guys will tell you that Reserve there is a "special kind of hell", the Envoy guys I asked say that they have two RAPS - 0400 and 1000 - and you WILL start at 0400 on day one. Those folks are OWNED by the company once a trip starts and a frequently extended ad nauseam until their last day - and often too late to commute home if they're commuters. They are guaranteed 11 days off. They have a hard 2 hour callout. They have Airport Standby (yuck). And on and on.
The UA guy basically described the same provisos WE have in our contract. Similar enough to be a wash.
I love these all-encompassing blasts of how awful it is here. They're so overreaching as to be almost comical.
The point has been made that we CERTAINLY need to improve the contract here, but to say our contract here is the worst in the airline business is bull. By a long shot.
Provide the proof behind your statement, otherwise it's just a bunch of hyperbole.
I asked around. I asked guys I know at UA and Envoy, and know a few guys at Skywest. The Skywesy guys will tell you that Reserve there is a "special kind of hell", the Envoy guys I asked say that they have two RAPS - 0400 and 1000 - and you WILL start at 0400 on day one. Those folks are OWNED by the company once a trip starts and a frequently extended ad nauseam until their last day - and often too late to commute home if they're commuters. They are guaranteed 11 days off. They have a hard 2 hour callout. They have Airport Standby (yuck). And on and on.
The UA guy basically described the same provisos WE have in our contract. Similar enough to be a wash.
I love these all-encompassing blasts of how awful it is here. They're so overreaching as to be almost comical.
The point has been made that we CERTAINLY need to improve the contract here, but to say our contract here is the worst in the airline business is bull. By a long shot.
Provide the proof behind your statement, otherwise it's just a bunch of hyperbole.
10-12-2016, 06:55 PM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2011
Posts: 713
Advice to American applicants...
What aa73 and Slice said.
Again, we are coming out of BK with the highest pay rates of any post BK contract. Most of the work rules suck, but again, post BK. As far as the contract goes, get involved in your union - make it better.
The good news is a lot of the new hires will be 50% in the company in less than 10 years. It'll be around 7-8 years for me, a mid 2014 hire.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Again, we are coming out of BK with the highest pay rates of any post BK contract. Most of the work rules suck, but again, post BK. As far as the contract goes, get involved in your union - make it better.
The good news is a lot of the new hires will be 50% in the company in less than 10 years. It'll be around 7-8 years for me, a mid 2014 hire.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
10-12-2016, 06:58 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Window seat
Posts: 5,196
I'm thinking only LA and NY have all crew bases for all of the Big 3. If you live near there and all three call you've got some tough stuff to figure out. The biggest is probably which side of the Hudson do you plan on living?
ORD is an AA/UA base. Don't know UA's flying there but I'd guess UA might be the better choice.
BOS? AA
PHL? AA, except EWR and NYC provide UA and DL options.
MIA? AA
DFW? AA
PHX? AA
CLT? AA
DCA? UA, except PHL is an option for guys that live north, east, or NE of DCA.
LA and NY aren't black and white. Where do you fit into their seniority list as a new hire? And the rest of your career?
SFO? SEA? ATL? DEN? SLC? Why would anyone choose AA when they can drive to work with DL or UA???
ORD is an AA/UA base. Don't know UA's flying there but I'd guess UA might be the better choice.
BOS? AA
PHL? AA, except EWR and NYC provide UA and DL options.
MIA? AA
DFW? AA
PHX? AA
CLT? AA
DCA? UA, except PHL is an option for guys that live north, east, or NE of DCA.
LA and NY aren't black and white. Where do you fit into their seniority list as a new hire? And the rest of your career?
SFO? SEA? ATL? DEN? SLC? Why would anyone choose AA when they can drive to work with DL or UA???
10-12-2016, 07:00 PM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Window seat
Posts: 5,196
I'm thinking only LA and NY have all crew bases for all of the Big 3. If you live near there and all three call you've got some tough stuff to figure out. The biggest is probably which side of the Hudson do you plan on living?
ORD is an AA/UA base. Don't know UA's flying there but I'd guess UA might be the better choice.
BOS? AA
PHL? AA, except EWR and NYC provide UA and DL options.
MIA? AA
DFW? AA
PHX? AA
CLT? AA
DCA? UA, except PHL is an option for guys that live north, east, or NE of DCA.
LA and NY aren't black and white. Where do you fit into their seniority list as a new hire? And the rest of your career?
SFO? SEA? ATL? DEN? SLC? Why would anyone choose AA when they can drive to work with DL or UA???
ORD is an AA/UA base. Don't know UA's flying there but I'd guess UA might be the better choice.
BOS? AA
PHL? AA, except EWR and NYC provide UA and DL options.
MIA? AA
DFW? AA
PHX? AA
CLT? AA
DCA? UA, except PHL is an option for guys that live north, east, or NE of DCA.
LA and NY aren't black and white. Where do you fit into their seniority list as a new hire? And the rest of your career?
SFO? SEA? ATL? DEN? SLC? Why would anyone choose AA when they can drive to work with DL or UA???
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