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View Full Version : Time Required at the Regionals?


VMFA187
06-05-2017, 01:39 PM
I'm an F/A-18 Instructor Pilot with the below qualifications and flight hours. I know I am probably not quite competitive for the Majors at this point, but do you think I'd have to spend more than a year at a regional to get picked up?

763 F/A-18 Hours / MEL
150 T-45 Hours / SEL
90 T-34C Hours / SEL
25 C-172 Hours / SEL

1,003 TT total
Aviation Safety Officer
NATOPS Instrument Checker
Post-Maintenance Check Flight Pilot

I have an app on arlineapps but not pilotcredentials.

Anyone else in a similar situation or care to venture a guess at how long it may take before a Major might be interested?

Thank you for taking the time to review this post.


Otterbox
06-05-2017, 02:15 PM
I'm an F/A-18 Instructor Pilot with the below qualifications and flight hours. I know I am probably not quite competitive for the Majors at this point, but do you think I'd have to spend more than a year at a regional to get picked up?

763 F/A-18 Hours / MEL
150 T-45 Hours / SEL
90 T-34C Hours / SEL
25 C-172 Hours / SEL

1,003 TT total
Aviation Safety Officer
NATOPS Instrument Checker
Post-Maintenance Check Flight Pilot

I have an app on arlineapps but not pilotcredentials.

Anyone else in a similar situation or care to venture a guess at how long it may take before a Major might be interested?

Thank you for taking the time to review this post.

Depends on a myriad of different things things that are applicant dependent. Who are you targeting? When do you get out? Are you flight current? Have your apps been reviewed professionally etc.?

I've seen Hornet guys get picked up on terminal leave and also go as long as 18 months at a regional before making it to a legacy. YMMV. I know a guy who was flight current and retiring from the military and had interviews as Delta and Southwest left both thinking he did well and ended up getting a TBNT from both. There's not one rule of thumb for all applicants.

If you're having this discussion, plan on doing upto 24 months (probably less but possibly more) at a regional so look at going to on with a quick upgrade and low reserve time so you can continue to beef up your resume with things like 1000 part 121 time, part 121 CA upgrade etc and get you out the door faster.

Sliceback
06-05-2017, 05:08 PM
^ x2

You can look at the 'who's been hired' thread and see if there are any 1,000 fighter guys that got hired. The lowest time I recall was around 1,600 TT (1300-1400 fighter + SUPT).

I'd plan on at least a year, two as perhaps the sweet spot, and perhaps three to get hired.

The reality is no one knows. We're just watching who gets hired to see if we can sense what the floor might be. Apply and take your shots. Get 121 qual'd, learn some new ropes, and keep improving your resume.

Good luck.


fiftyone
06-10-2017, 12:26 PM
I'm an F/A-18 Instructor Pilot with the below qualifications and flight hours. I know I am probably not quite competitive for the Majors at this point, but do you think I'd have to spend more than a year at a regional to get picked up?

763 F/A-18 Hours / MEL
150 T-45 Hours / SEL
90 T-34C Hours / SEL
25 C-172 Hours / SEL

1,003 TT total
Aviation Safety Officer
NATOPS Instrument Checker
Post-Maintenance Check Flight Pilot

I have an app on arlineapps but not pilotcredentials.

Anyone else in a similar situation or care to venture a guess at how long it may take before a Major might be interested?

Thank you for taking the time to review this post.

I will approach this from a mostly different, yet similar situation.

First of all, if you have not already been told, you need to have the "center-line thrust" restriction removed from your certificate. I am unaware if that requires nothing more than proficiency and checkride or if you will need the minimum 25 ME hours to apply at a regional.

I am a rotor guy with a little over 1,000 TT. If you do end up at a regional, most carriers require 1,000 121 hours before being eligible for upgrade to captain in addition to the 1,500 ATP requirement. Meaning that, unless I am totally mistaking, you and I would need more than 1,000 121 hours to meet the minimum 2,500 TT (ATP mins plus 121 mins) for upgrade to captain. I have noticed that many legacy and cargo carriers removed their requirement for turbine PIC but it is too early to determine if turbine SIC can be competitive. At least most of your time is turboprop/turbine. You could potentially get hired by a legacy carrier as a mid-high time regional FO. Only you know your situation, but I think 1-2 years at a regional is worth the opportunity to advance. Like Otterbox said, it depends on your goals and situation.

VMFA187
06-11-2017, 06:06 AM
I will approach this from a mostly different, yet similar situation.

First of all, if you have not already been told, you need to have the "center-line thrust" restriction removed from your certificate. I am unaware if that requires nothing more than proficiency and checkride or if you will need the minimum 25 ME hours to apply at a regional.

I am a rotor guy with a little over 1,000 TT. If you do end up at a regional, most carriers require 1,000 121 hours before being eligible for upgrade to captain in addition to the 1,500 ATP requirement. Meaning that, unless I am totally mistaking, you and I would need more than 1,000 121 hours to meet the minimum 2,500 TT (ATP mins plus 121 mins) for upgrade to captain. I have noticed that many legacy and cargo carriers removed their requirement for turbine PIC but it is too early to determine if turbine SIC can be competitive. At least most of your time is turboprop/turbine. You could potentially get hired by a legacy carrier as a mid-high time regional FO. Only you know your situation, but I think 1-2 years at a regional is worth the opportunity to advance. Like Otterbox said, it depends on your goals and situation.

I've been told by a few individuals recently hired that they anticipate as soon as a military fighter guy has the flight hours to remove the "Restricted" aspect of the ATP, that they should be in the mix. So I'm hoping that, like you said, with enough 121 time to get an unrestricted ATP, and 121 experience with my other quals, will be enough to get me hired as a regional FO.

Hacker15e
06-11-2017, 06:06 AM
First of all, if you have not already been told, you need to have the "center-line thrust" restriction removed from your certificate. I am unaware if that requires nothing more than proficiency and checkride or if you will need the minimum 25 ME hours to apply at a regional.

At least one regional (ExpressJet) and possibly others have added the necessary maneuvers to their training syllabus (and approved by the FAA, of course) for a former military pilot with a centerline thrust restriction to be able to enter their training program and finish with an ATP. Someone with the restricted ticket looking to go to the regionals should specifically ask the company if this is part of their training program.

Second, there's no such thing as "centerline thrust multiengine time". All 700 of his Hornet hours are just plain "multiengine time".

Hacker15e
06-11-2017, 06:10 AM
I've been told by a few individuals recently hired that they anticipate as soon as a military fighter guy has the flight hours to remove the "Restricted" aspect of the ATP, that they should be in the mix. So I'm hoping that, like you said, with enough 121 time to get an unrestricted ATP, and 121 experience with my other quals, will be enough to get me hired as a regional FO.

Given the duration of the training cycle at a regional (3-4 months, depending on the shop) and how much you'll probably fly at a correctly-staffed regional (80-ish hours/month), you're looking a ballpark 12-month stay at the regional level before you'll get much in the way of serious calls from the majors.

It will be longer at regionals with less seniority list movement where guys spend longer on reserve and get less flying time. I was at a regional with pretty fast progression (spent 1 month on reserve and from then on had a line) and I got about 700 hours of flying my first 12 months.

In my opinion, prepare for 2 years, and be happily surprised when/if it isn't.

VMFA187
06-11-2017, 06:16 AM
Given the duration of the training cycle at a regional (3-4 months, depending on the shop) and how much you'll probably fly at a correctly-staffed regional (80-ish hours/month), you're looking a ballpark 12-month stay at the regional level before you'll get much in the way of serious calls from the majors. It will be longer at regionals with less seniority list movement where guys spend longer on reserve and get less flying time. I was at a regional with pretty fast progression (spent 1 month on reserve and from then on had a line) and I got about 700 hours of flying my first 12 months.

In my opinion, prepare for 2 years, and be happily surprised when/if it isn't.

Awesome. Thanks for the information Hacker. Just trying to manage my expectation levels.

SpringLanding
01-07-2018, 09:07 AM
Rather than starting a new thread, I thought I'd ask for some career advice here. Please offer your opinion on some or all of my questions. My goal is to get hired at a legacy, SWA, or FedEx. Thank you in advance.

Hours:
900 hrs FW multi engine tac-air
200 hrs T-45
50 hrs T-34
80 hrs gen aviation
1230 TT, ~900 PIC.

Ratings: FAA Commercial + Instrument rating.

Timeline: Getting out in 12-18 months, expecting less than 60 more hours military PIC time by then.

Questions:

1. Am I competitive for a regional?
2. Should I consider regionals with fast upgrade times, or would I likely get the call before qualifying for upgrade?
3. Should I use interview prep companies (Cage, ECIC, RST, Career Takeoff) prior to applying for a regional, or are those better done closer to the major interview?

I'm considering ways to make myself more marketable for a major airline.

4. Is earning a CFI, CFII, and MEI rating worth the time, effort, and money in the next 12 months?

Studying and working for a CFI rating would help sharpen FAA knowledge, build hours and experience, but I'm unaware if it would really help on a major airline application. Any better ways to make myself marketable?

bababouey
01-07-2018, 09:18 AM
Yes, yes, wait till major calls, no. Find a regional close to where you want to live, upgrade ASAP, you’ll be called eventually.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sliceback
01-07-2018, 09:21 AM
1. Yes

2. Yes.
2. You might get called before upgrade. No perfect answer.

3. Majors. Not required for regionals.

4. 100 hrs currency in the last year can be a help for the Big3/4. Maybe a deal breaker, maybe not. No perfect clarity in that answer. I know a couple of staff guys that retired who’d had flown GA a/c 100hrs in the previous year to meet the 100hr trigger.

4. MEL might be a hiring requirement.
4. Additional ratings might be a GI bill way to get 100 hrs currency in previous the 12 months. That’s a major airline requirement and not an issue for a regional job(they’re hiring guys who haven’t flown in years).

155mm
01-07-2018, 09:23 AM
Rather than starting a new thread, I thought I'd ask for some career advice here. Please offer your opinion on some or all of my questions. My goal is to get hired at a legacy, SWA, or FedEx. Thank you in advance.

Hours:
900 hrs FW multi engine tac-air
200 hrs T-45
50 hrs T-34
80 hrs gen aviation
1230 TT, ~900 PIC.

Ratings: FAA Commercial + Instrument rating.

Timeline: Getting out in 12-18 months, expecting less than 60 more hours military PIC time by then.

Questions:

1. Am I competitive for a regional?
2. Should I consider regionals with fast upgrade times, or would I likely get the call before qualifying for upgrade?
3. Should I use interview prep companies (Cage, ECIC, RST, Career Takeoff) prior to applying for a regional, or are those better done closer to the major interview?

I'm considering ways to make myself more marketable for a major airline.

4. Is earning a CFI, CFII, and MEI rating worth the time, effort, and money in the next 12 months?

Studying and working for a CFI rating would help sharpen FAA knowledge, build hours and experience, but I'm unaware if it would really help on a major airline application. Any better ways to make myself marketable?

My take:
1. Skip the CFI and go for a Regional (Restricted ATP for military pilots).
2. You are going to need 1000 hours (some mil time may count) at a regional to upgrade anyway so pick a regional with great equipment, good pay, good domicile, pays for ATP-CTP program, and even a flow through program.
3. Regionals want warm bodies so interview prep is okay but I would save my money by finding the gouge. Buy a FAR/AIM and a GLEIM ATP written exam study book. https://www.gleimaviation.com/shop/atp/

SpringLanding
01-07-2018, 09:41 AM
Baba, Sliceback, 155mm--

Thanks. It sounds like the cost and effort to get a CFI may help with min hour requirements, but will not be a game-changer on a major application once I'm hired at a regional.

Any others with an opinion?

155mm
01-07-2018, 09:52 AM
Baba, Sliceback, 155mm--

Thanks. It sounds like the cost and effort to get a CFI may help with min hour requirements, but will not be a game-changer on a major application once I'm hired at a regional.

Any others with an opinion?

If you were an IP, there is a mil comp exam (MCI) a little paperwork and bingo you're a CFI!
Sheppard Air Flight Test 5.0 Prep Software ATP, Flight Engineer, Mil Comp - FAA Airline Transport Pilot (http://www.sheppardair.com/flight-instructor.htm)

SpringLanding
01-07-2018, 09:54 AM
If you were an IP, there is a mil comp exam (MCI) a little paperwork and bingo you're a CFI!
Sheppard Air Flight Test 5.0 Prep Software ATP, Flight Engineer, Mil Comp - FAA Airline Transport Pilot (http://www.sheppardair.com/flight-instructor.htm)

Thank you, but unfortunately I was not. That would make getting a CFII much easier.

bennet00
01-08-2018, 06:34 AM
Thank you, but unfortunately I was not. That would make getting a CFII much easier.
CFI, CFII, and MEI are all extra points when your app is scored. May make the difference in a crunch to get to the interview. I would work towards anything (within reason) that would make me more competitive. It seems for transitioning military folks, getting the 121 time with a regional shows dedication and motivation to the career, and is valued by the majors. YMMV. Good luck.

rickair7777
01-08-2018, 07:00 PM
Second, there's no such thing as "centerline thrust multiengine time". All 700 of his Hornet hours are just plain "multiengine time".

Correct. Centerline thrust is only applicable to a pilot rating.

Chillpill
01-08-2018, 09:06 PM
If you were an IP, there is a mil comp exam (MCI) a little paperwork and bingo you're a CFI!
Sheppard Air Flight Test 5.0 Prep Software ATP, Flight Engineer, Mil Comp - FAA Airline Transport Pilot (http://www.sheppardair.com/flight-instructor.htm)

Can you get an MCI even if you were not a schoolhouse IP? Do airlines ask how much instructor time you logged?

Hacker15e
01-09-2018, 04:45 AM
Can you get an MCI even if you were not a schoolhouse IP? Do airlines ask how much instructor time you logged?

Yes, all that's required is the instructor qualification paperwork (e.g. Form 8), which squadron IPs get, too.

All the airline apps I know of ask for IP/Dual given somewhere on the app.

pony172
01-10-2018, 03:25 AM
Can you get an MCI even if you were not a schoolhouse IP? Do airlines ask how much instructor time you logged?

For you Naval types, you should be able to get an MCI if you have a NATOPS Instructor or Instrument Evaluator in your jacket. Call your FSDO first to see what they want. If there is a former MIL inspector there they can help tremendously. Opinions can vary greatly between FSDO's. This is one of the best good deals out there.