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View Full Version : Air Wisconsin or Republic ?


ChrisPilot1
09-16-2017, 05:02 PM
All,

I have been offered positions at both Republic and Air Wisconsin and was looking for some input. Sorry to create a new thread here, but this is an important decision and I wanted to hear feedback before making my choice.

Pro's - Financially, Air Wisconsin seems to be the front runner here. The bonuses clearly outweigh RJET with their compensation package. I will also be a commuter and Chicago would be ideal for me which I would easily get with Air Wisconsin. Not being for months on reserve is also a bonus. I could take Columbus but New York would be tough.

Con's - Smaller company? RJET just felt more like a real company to me, they also took great care of us during the interview process. Air Wisconsin pretty much emailed me and said your on your ow n see you at the interview, although I appreciated the Gift card they mailed. Impressed with Republics training facility. I dint get to see Air Wisconsin's facility. The ERJ is also a big pull factor for me. But then again I don't want to take a job just to fly a shiny jet. Republic seems to have a better route network as well, longer flight times versus 4-5 a day short legs on the 200. I'm not lazy by any means , young in my 20's and will work for anything, but I'd like to have a job that I actually enjoy and don't dread going to.

Question - How long is upgrade time at Wisconsin? For a guy entering now. They told us 18-24 months, but I don't trust HR.
How long is reserve time on average?

I realize a lot of these questions cannot be answered because everything is up in the air, but i'm just torn between the two and wanted some feedback. Any Air Wisconsin guys that went to RJET or Vice versa?

Chris


flightlevel
09-17-2017, 03:03 PM
I'd say Air Wisconsin, they have been so good to me, helped me out with almost everything I have asked and are really helpful and upfront I found.

I have learned don't chase the carrot (in regards to money) but follow a stable path to the left seat.

It's your call I guess, but I think the smaller company would be suitable to get stable and upgrade quickly.

toolowterrain
09-18-2017, 03:32 AM
We are definitely not a real airline...no, but seriously nothing in your post even remotely mentioned the important stuff.

Engines under the wings, long flights, nice training facility?!? Who cares?

Focus in work rules and what the contract will offer you. For example: if you have a 13 hour duty day but only fly 3, do you only get paid 3 hrs for the day or are there further pay protections for you (its called rig)? If your trip has a lot of deadheads where you reposition from place to place as passenger a lot, do you get your full hourly rate? Etc.

I know nothing about Republic but I do know their contract is not bad at all. However, I just wanted to point out that there are far deeper reasons for choosing your place to work than the stuff at the surface. And my words come from someone who back in his 20's just picked a random airline called Air Wisconsin. Luckily for me, many winters I sat in a hotel during northeast blizzards getting fully paid for ALL my cancelled flights when many at the time, including Republic, where not paid a dime but were still at 'work'. Can you imagine if I would have ended up at a place like that at the time?

So yeah, do your homework, its a big decision. Air Wis worked for me. But you are not me. Only you can make that decision. I am often weary of places that make everything look pretty and dreamy. Are they hiding something? Why did they go bankrupt? Talk to people that work on both places and see how they like it there.

I will leave you with some advice:

1. Make the best decision at the time and live life knowing that at the time you made the best decision possible. People that live with regret are those who 6 regionals later and 10 years later are still on the right seat in a RJ with 2yrs seniority.

2. Here comes the irony: Don't take advice from strangers on the internet.


T28driver
09-18-2017, 04:16 AM
I'd follow on to that with take a look at our health insurance compared to Republic.

This is a good regional. So is Republic. And definitely don't take advice from strangers on the internet.

prex8390
09-18-2017, 05:27 AM
If you're in it for how nice the training facility is, I think you'd end up quitting awac on the spot. It's in Appleton airports basement. Literally. Most of this criteria sounds like shiney jet syndrome, want the CEO to come give me some personalized face time etc. when you will never see these people again. Find an airline that fits your life needs not your work needs. If you're not happy at home you won't be at work.

ChrisPilot1
09-18-2017, 06:55 AM
Thanks for the replies guys! I am by no means in it for Shiney jets or fancy training facilities :p I think my initial decision was to go with republic because of this and I realized that thats not what is important. Although I do want to fly and work with a team that is happy in their environment and gets treated well by their employer. Some people on here seem very disgruntled by management at air Wisconsin.

Realistically can I expect to upgrade within 3 years for someone starting training next month?

Guys at Republic are saying it takes up to 8 months to get IOE done here? I cannot afford to sit at home for 8 months and get paid min reserve. Is this the case currently.

T28driver
09-18-2017, 07:36 AM
First off, the 8 months for completion of IOE should not be an issue here. I started the ATP-CTP course the last week of July, I'm on track to be off of IOE towards the end of October. Longest break I've had in training was a week between the end of systems and the start of CPT/Sims. 3-3.5 months from start of training to the line is a realistic expectation here.

Upgrades are anybody's guess, and that's true at every regional. I would be surprised if you make it past 36 months in the right seat anywhere in the current market. My personal projections based on attrition and hiring here place it well below 36 months for the current crop of new hires, but those projections are just numbers on a spreadsheet and may not reflect reality.

You will find people that are disgruntled anywhere. Everyone I have interacted with face to face has been very professional and genuinely great to work with. I've been extremely happy with my choice to come here. I made that choice after talking with pilots that work here or have worked here before moving on. I did this at all of the regionals I was considering. You should do this as well if possible.

ChrisPilot1
09-20-2017, 01:59 PM
I don't know anyone else working there personally and everyone on here it pretty bias. Is the company well respected in terms of reputation for the majors? Im not trying to be a dick, but everytime I tell my other pilot buddies I'm thinking of Air Whisky, they all laugh saying you are just above Mesa?:( I dont give a crap about their thoughts, but genuinely wanted to know how the company is viewed in the industry.

Also what is training pay? Min Reserve? Single occupancy ?

OT35
09-20-2017, 02:41 PM
Min is 75 hours, you probably wouldnt be on reserve for more than 2-3 months. Hotel is single occupancy, dont know the training pay since its changed since ive gone through. As far as the respect thing man who knows, we're all regional guys trying to put in our time and get out. I can tell you we're a solid company and youll make a ton of money if you want. I bid max days off and im fairly junior and for the most part i get what i want.

T28driver
09-20-2017, 06:47 PM
I don't know anyone else working there personally and everyone on here it pretty bias. Is the company well respected in terms of reputation for the majors? Im not trying to be a dick, but everytime I tell my other pilot buddies I'm thinking of Air Whisky, they all laugh saying you are just above Mesa?:( I dont give a crap about their thoughts, but genuinely wanted to know how the company is viewed in the industry.

Complete shocker to me that people on the internet have extremely biased opinions. Totally did not see that one coming. Also chemtrails are real and the first moon landing was faked. But not the later ones, we needed those to put the fake evidence of the first moon landing up there.

Chris, choosing a regional is a big decision and should not be taken lightly. Different companies have different strengths and weaknesses, Air Wisconsin included. The general advice you will be given on this forum is actually pretty good. Namely:

1) if you live in a base that is only served by one regional, and you have a realistic expectation of holding that base, go there.
2) PIC time (and pay) is better than SIC time.
3) benefits, specifically health insurance, matter.

Use those criteria and make an informed decision as best you can. In my case, Air Wisconsin was a good choice. It may be a good choice for you, it may not be. Don't make opinions on an internet message board your primary criteria.

pitchtrim
09-21-2017, 02:32 AM
Just above mesa? That's funny.

Swakid8
09-21-2017, 02:57 AM
Lol Air Wiskey above Mesa, that's funny.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

mpet
09-21-2017, 05:39 AM
I don't know anyone else working there personally and everyone on here it pretty bias. Is the company well respected in terms of reputation for the majors? Im not trying to be a dick, but everytime I tell my other pilot buddies I'm thinking of Air Whisky, they all laugh saying you are just above Mesa?:( I dont give a crap about their thoughts, but genuinely wanted to know how the company is viewed in the industry.

Also what is training pay? Min Reserve? Single occupancy ?

.... Air Wisconsin is and has historically been regarded as one of the best regional airlines to work for. Their minimums were higher than everyone's, their pay was higher than everyones, their insurance, their contract, their training has been better or as good as any other. They are the exact opposite of a bottom feeder, and your CFI buddies said they're a Mesa? Your CFI buddies are retarded.

chrisreedrules
09-21-2017, 07:48 AM
.... Air Wisconsin is and has historically been regarded as one of the best regional airlines to work for. Their minimums were higher than everyone's, their pay was higher than everyones, their insurance, their contract, their training has been better or as good as any other. They are the exact opposite of a bottom feeder, and your CFI buddies said they're a Mesa? Your CFI buddies are retarded.

This... Sounds like people are trying to make themselves feel better about working for Mesa.

ChrisPilot1
09-21-2017, 08:51 AM
One more question, thanks everyone for the responses. Are these bonuses taxed at a compounded or flat rate of 25%?

WhiskeyDelta
09-21-2017, 08:56 AM
One more question, thanks everyone for the responses. Are these bonuses taxed at a compounded or flat rate of 25%?


It doesnít matter what regional you work for. If itís paid as a bonus, they are all taxed as a bonus at 25%. If your effective tax rate ends up being lower when you file you get some back.

ChrisPilot1
09-22-2017, 11:24 AM
I had chosen Wisconsin and got scheduled for a ground school but honestly reading through the last 100 or so pages of the main thread here im having second doubts.

1) Alot of people are saying the company is pretty much BS'ing the upgrade times and 18-24 months is simply projeted right now. How is this looking for a guy entering ground school next month?

2) Reserve times , I was told that reserve would be 2-3 months in ORD at the most. Still holding true?

3) ALOT of complaints over management over working pilots, not caring and schedules constantly changing?

mcat
09-22-2017, 12:10 PM
I had chosen Wisconsin and got scheduled for a ground school but honestly reading through the last 100 or so pages of the main thread here im having second doubts.

1) Alot of people are saying the company is pretty much BS'ing the upgrade times and 18-24 months is simply projeted right now. How is this looking for a guy entering ground school next month?

2) Reserve times , I was told that reserve would be 2-3 months in ORD at the most. Still holding true?

3) ALOT of complaints over management over working pilots, not caring and schedules constantly changing?

1. & 2.) We shall see what they end up being. We are still short on pilots and we need to just about double our pilot group in size to be properly staffed. So new hires will move up in seniority fast. Running classes of 15-25 every two weeks. We have about 50 pilots right now either in ground school, CPT, sim, or on IOE.

3.) It is true. But once we get more pilots here, that will go away for the most part.

pitchtrim
09-22-2017, 12:47 PM
When I got hired they said reserve was 6 months to a year. I sat reserve for 2 weeks. Upgrade time was 6 years. I upgraded in 4. Point is there's no way to predict all this stuff perfectly but fact is they need to hire a few hundred guys like yesterday. If you get in on the front end of that wave, regardless what the bitter online people say, odds are you will upgrade in a short period of time. Not everyone is exactly cut out to upgrade in 18 months anyways. If it takes 2 or 3 years that's still very quick. They even pay you 8k if you don't upgrade!

toolowterrain
09-22-2017, 04:21 PM
I had chosen Wisconsin and got scheduled for a ground school but honestly reading through the last 100 or so pages of the main thread here im having second doubts.

1) Alot of people are saying the company is pretty much BS'ing the upgrade times and 18-24 months is simply projeted right now. How is this looking for a guy entering ground school next month?

2) Reserve times , I was told that reserve would be 2-3 months in ORD at the most. Still holding true?

3) ALOT of complaints over management over working pilots, not caring and schedules constantly changing?

Better than PSA saying saying flow to American in 6. Ha!

squib
09-22-2017, 05:31 PM
The 18-24 month upgrade is never going to happen.

That advertisement first came out about 6 months ago. So anyone hired under that assumption will obviously be behind everyone on property 6 months ago. So that means they have 12 months to upgrade 250+ FO's that were already on property to hit the 18 month number before the first guy hired being told that, sees an upgrade. They would need to start upgrading 20 a month now for that to happen, and guess what, not happening.

Everyone keeps saying there's 20+ per month in new hire classes yet the pay day hotline from ALPO clearly shows that half of them are forced to resign.

Junior mans everyday. For everyone. Help out or get an unavailable. "If you don't do this the flight will cancel, blah blah"

pitchtrim
09-22-2017, 05:38 PM
Not happening till it does happen. The big bonus money is actually attracting much higher quality applicants. This straight from someone who does interviews. They also have 26k reasons to pass ioe. You'll begin seeing less washouts. If 40 a month get through and a dozen flat out quit, you're still up.

Jet Jockey 00
09-22-2017, 05:47 PM
How is Republic going to grow in the future all 175 carrier and every major scoped out. Awac has the cash to buy more planes within scope limits and high bonus will attract the crews.

squib
09-22-2017, 07:54 PM
Not happening till it does happen.


Except you missed the point. It's not currently happening and won't happen for anyone hired this month or even in the next few months. There's 250+ FO's ahead of everyone hired now. A lot going on 3+ years as an FO.

squib
09-22-2017, 07:57 PM
Awac has the cash to buy more planes within scope limits and high bonus will attract the crews.

They are going to fly their -200s until the wings fall off and find a company in some middle of nowhere town to put new ones back on and sign the plane off for another decade.

pitchtrim
09-22-2017, 08:03 PM
Except you missed the point. It's not currently happening and won't happen for anyone hired this month or even in the next few months. There's 250+ FO's ahead of everyone hired now. A lot going on 3+ years as an FO.

Fact is some will likely get lucky enough to be hired and upgrade in or around the 18 to 24 month mark. Just cause it's been stagnant for the past 2 years doesn't mean that trend will continue.

Theaveragejoker
09-23-2017, 07:20 AM
Piedmont went from 8 year upgrade to 5 to 2 to street captains in the span of a year. AWAC is a famously good place to work for, and I'd go there twice before anyone else (at the regional level) if I wasn't at a wholly owned.

chrisreedrules
09-24-2017, 02:56 PM
Better than PSA saying saying flow to American in 6. Ha!

Union projections concur with this mostly. Our attrition (except for last month) is very high. I think a new hire could expect roughly a 7-8 year flow. Or they can upgrade here in less than a year (if they have the required times) and apply everywhere else they want and get to a legacy a lot faster. In the meantime pilots can enjoy every holiday and important family event off and build their schedule any way they want.

itsmytime
09-24-2017, 03:26 PM
Union projections concur with this mostly. Our attrition (except for last month) is very high. I think a new hire could expect roughly a 7-8 year flow. Or they can upgrade here in less than a year (if they have the required times) and apply everywhere else they want and get to a legacy a lot faster. In the meantime pilots can enjoy every holiday and important family event off and build their schedule any way they want.

What is the normal monthly attrition?

chrisreedrules
09-25-2017, 04:51 AM
What is the normal monthly attrition?

It varies month by month...

In 2016 we lost a little over 220 total pilots from our seniority list. And we lost over 100 active pilots from the seniority list. Active pilots are those who actively bid and fly lines. That was when we were about a 1,000 pilot airline. So roughly 20% turnover in a year.

2017 looks to be about the same if not a little more. So we do hire about 40-50 /month but the high attrition PSA experiences leads to fairly rapid movement up the seniority list.

whooooooocares
09-25-2017, 08:19 AM
Do not come here. I will repeat, DO NOT COME HERE. At every turn the company will do the right thing by them, and only what benefits them the most. You, your family, your sanity will not be taken into consideration what so ever. They will lie, 18-24month upgrades, maybe in a fantasy world. ORF is closing.

We have no real future to offer you here. Do yourself a favor, do not even consider AWAC. Go anywhere else. You will never upgrade in ORD. This means any midwest individual that is applying here thinking they will commute to ORD for 2 years and then upgrade will quickly figure out they will commute to ORD for 3-4 years then possibly upgrade to IAD. This place is a 3rd rate clown show, and an embarrassment compared to what they used to be and still claim to be.

toolowterrain
09-25-2017, 06:26 PM
Do not come here. I will repeat, DO NOT COME HERE. At every turn the company will do the right thing by them, and only what benefits them the most. You, your family, your sanity will not be taken into consideration what so ever. They will lie, 18-24month upgrades, maybe in a fantasy world. ORF is closing.

We have no real future to offer you here. Do yourself a favor, do not even consider AWAC. Go anywhere else. You will never upgrade in ORD. This means any midwest individual that is applying here thinking they will commute to ORD for 2 years and then upgrade will quickly figure out they will commute to ORD for 3-4 years then possibly upgrade to IAD. This place is a 3rd rate clown show, and an embarrassment compared to what they used to be and still claim to be.

Ahh what the heck. Where are you going? PSA?

sweetholyjesus
09-26-2017, 02:32 AM
Fact is some will likely...This is where I stopped listening. Just more recruiter jargon. I don't see the data to support any 18 month upgrade for anyone anytime soon. Being short on FOs doesn't lead to faster upgrades, and the fleet is not growing. But of course our recruiters will BS and say we will likely maybe someday probably offer 18 month upgrades, because everyone else already does!

Heck I think there are a couple guys that have been waiting 18 months just for their upgrade class :rolleyes:

pitchtrim
09-26-2017, 04:26 AM
I'm not a recruiter. I'm just not jaded and blinded by discouragement like some of you. If it's so bad you really should be working elsewhere.

Grumbletrousers
09-26-2017, 05:16 AM
I'm not a recruiter. I'm just not jaded and blinded by discouragement like some of you. If it's so bad you really should be working elsewhere.

This. People on here need to lighten the **** up.

sweetholyjesus
09-26-2017, 06:00 AM
I'm not a recruiter. I'm just not jaded and blinded by discouragement like some of you. If it's so bad you really should be working elsewhere.I didn't say anything was bad, I'm just not buying or selling the recruiter BS like you are. Drink all the kool-aid you want but I will call the BS and recruiter jargon when I see it. Explain one thing that I said that isn't true.

StrykerB21
09-26-2017, 06:47 AM
At this point everyone is arguing conjecture which isn't helpful to anyone. The 18 to 24 month upgrade was announced in February. That means every FO on property will have upgraded by February 2019 the latest. Will that happen? Doubtful, but my opinion is just conjecture as well. Lets try not to get so worked up over incomplete information. When all is said and done Air Whiskey is still a decent place to be. It could be much worse, we could all be working for Mesa.

pitchtrim
09-26-2017, 07:16 AM
I didn't say anything was bad, I'm just not buying or selling the recruiter BS like you are. Drink all the kool-aid you want but I will call the BS and recruiter jargon when I see it. Explain one thing that I said that isn't true.

"This is where I stopped listening"
You keep reading

"Just more recruiter jargon"
My opinion based off numbers

"Don't see any numbers to support 18 month upgrades"
I do.

"Being short fo's doesn't lead to faster upgrades"
It does when they are literally hiring 40-50 per month to become properly staffed again. Guess what, upgrades will resume as they were pre exodus.

"Fleet is not growing"
Yes and no. We shrunk a lot this past year. Retired planes and parked planes for both paint and reduced schedules by AA. The overworked fo's may not have noticed this while semi properly staffed captains were barely flying for a few months. As United becomes fully implemented there will be a growth from where we were this past year. As I understand it we can add more flying for United as well.

"Because everyone else already does"
No one has said that.

billyho
09-26-2017, 07:25 AM
It could be much worse, we could all be working for Mesa.

Careful what you say. CCAir pilots thought the same thing.:eek:

DarkSideMoon
09-26-2017, 07:41 AM
The 18-24 month upgrade is never going to happen.

That advertisement first came out about 6 months ago. So anyone hired under that assumption will obviously be behind everyone on property 6 months ago. So that means they have 12 months to upgrade 250+ FO's that were already on property to hit the 18 month number before the first guy hired being told that, sees an upgrade. They would need to start upgrading 20 a month now for that to happen, and guess what, not happening.

Everyone keeps saying there's 20+ per month in new hire classes yet the pay day hotline from ALPO clearly shows that half of them are forced to resign.

Junior mans everyday. For everyone. Help out or get an unavailable. "If you don't do this the flight will cancel, blah blah"

Any word as to why there's only a 50% pass rate for the new hires? I have an October class date and anything I can brush up on early would be appreciated. I've done a 135 type before so it won't be my first rodeo but I don't want to end up looking for another job in two months.

pitchtrim
09-26-2017, 08:04 AM
Any word as to why there's only a 50% pass rate for the new hires? I have an October class date and anything I can brush up on early would be appreciated. I've done a 135 type before so it won't be my first rodeo but I don't want to end up looking for another job in two months.

Squib was exaggerating for dramatic effect. We did have a high 35-40% fail rate when all we were scraping were bottom of the barrel guys. There were 11 fo resignations on the last fastread and approximately half were new hires.

Grumbletrousers
09-26-2017, 08:18 AM
Any word as to why there's only a 50% pass rate for the new hires? I have an October class date and anything I can brush up on early would be appreciated. I've done a 135 type before so it won't be my first rodeo but I don't want to end up looking for another job in two months.

Donít spend every night at the bars.

Make a study group and exchange ideas and notes.

Itís really not that hard to pass, but when you have people expecting the company to throw money and ratings at them, you get failures.

In short, study and donít **** around. When you hit the line then hit the booze.



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