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View Full Version : Real earnings?


tm602
02-19-2018, 10:29 PM
Really now, not recruiter numbers. What should one expect first and second year, assuming having the times for the upgrade at hire date, and willing to be based in ATL?
Maybe I'm going from past life, but this seems too good to be true, instant upgrade, etc.


Casualinterest
02-20-2018, 01:04 AM
Really now, not recruiter numbers. What should one expect first and second year, assuming having the times for the upgrade at hire date, and willing to be based in ATL?
Maybe I'm going from past life, but this seems too good to be true, instant upgrade, etc.So you could ask 10 people and get 10 different answers. However, since I just did my taxes I can tell you exactly what mine looks like.

Preface, I bid Max days off and avoid pairings. I want to be home with my family as much as possible.

Second preface, I took the (virtually) entire month of October off for FMLA when my child was born. Still managed 44 hours of credit with some creative pickups.

2017

Jan 80
Feb 77
Mar 75
Apr 75
May 75
Jun 76
Jul 92
Aug 93
Sep 90
Oct 44
Nov 85
Dec 77

Tot 939 credit
Flt 560 flight

Duty days 132
Days off 233

2018

Jan - 100 credit 20 days off
Feb - 130 credit 12 days off
Mar - 90 credit 13 days off (screwed up my bid [emoji52])


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UNDGUY
02-20-2018, 03:00 AM
So you could ask 10 people and get 10 different answers. However, since I just did my taxes I can tell you exactly what mine looks like.

Preface, I bid Max days off and avoid pairings. I want to be home with my family as much as possible.

Second preface, I took the (virtually) entire month of October off for FMLA when my child was born. Still managed 44 hours of credit with some creative pickups.

2017

Jan 80
Feb 77
Mar 75
Apr 75
May 75
Jun 76
Jul 92
Aug 93
Sep 90
Oct 44
Nov 85
Dec 77

Tot 939 credit
Flt 560 flight

Duty days 132
Days off 233

2018

Jan - 100 credit 20 days off
Feb - 130 credit 12 days off
Mar - 90 credit 13 days off (screwed up my bid [emoji52])


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And your earnings were?


Casualinterest
02-20-2018, 04:05 AM
And your earnings were?Little under 60. Would've been higher with the new rates. That was with year two old FO pay plus the 23k per year bonuses.

I can't speak to what year one FO's did last year. Maybe one of them can chime in.

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Punkah Louvre
02-20-2018, 05:18 AM
As a new hire with 121.436 time you will upgrade immediately -after FO OE. The pay rates are public; youíll fly as much as you want to; and probably more. Iíve credited 200h as a captain under the new rates, at 98hrs credit today with 7 working days left.
Itís not too good to be true. Everyone here has worked hard to be in the position where weíre growing at the rate we are. We have also benefitted from luck and timing and I recognize others may be on the other side of the coin. That said; morale here is very good indeed and it appears the company has every intent to make life better for all. Pm me if you want to talk about it.
PL

teddy3412
02-20-2018, 05:20 AM
Little under 60. Would've been higher with the new rates. That was with year two old FO pay plus the 23k per year bonuses.

I can't speak to what year one FO's did last year. Maybe one of them can chime in.

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I donít have exact numbers. I started in late feb and did $49k taxable gross was 43k. a couple 90+ credit months, a couple 85 credit months. The rest were 75 or less. Got on the line in may. 3 months of reserve. So that's 10 months.

The last 2 months I've done 75 credit (21 and 22 off) and taken "vacation". Next month I'm at 87 credit 13 off.

flydiamond
02-20-2018, 06:18 AM
May not match what the OP is looking for but maybe someone else.

First year 900 NYC FO here, *aggressively* chasing credit hours and flying. Since completion of IOE I have averaged 130 pay credits a month through numerous IROPs, diversions, reserve drops/trip pickups, reserve adds, brought off trips...just about everything under the sun (joys of being NYC based). All open time is paid at minimum of 150%...company is very liberal with escalating it to 200%, 8 days of that offered so far this month on my seat. I live in base so it’s not too bad. Only about 60 flying hours a month. Tons and tons of deadheading and home reserve. Only sat ready reserve for 2 hours before getting called.

On top of the 130 hours I have averaged about $500 of Per Diem a month. Additionally, you can expect to make $75 a month (paid quarterly) for us hitting 3/4 of our performance goals. You do the math with 130 hours of pay a month... it’s a lot. Nearing $100k including per diem at second year pay. First year is more difficult to calculate since some of it was at old pay rates, some of it is at minimum guarantee, and you’ve got the hiring and retention bonuses from last year in there, but I’m forecasting about $80k.

Now as far as averages, union has said average credit hours per month is 89. I believe this is weighed down by guys taking mil leave, FMLA, etc. At that rate you could expect $64,300 first year including the hiring and performance bonuses and about $65,000 second year pay. That first year pay requires a bit of hustling to dig yourself out of 75 hour a month training hole...

HighFlight
02-20-2018, 06:32 AM
Have you visited this link? https://www.airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/regional/endeavor_air

If not, that is the “really now” numbers to use. No one knows your specific tax rates, so no one can give you an accurate answer based on your situation. But if you multiply those rates X 75 X 12, you will get your base pay for the year. Reality is that you will make more (we typically credit more than 75, even if we TRY to only fly 75), and then there’s per diem (M&IE, technically). Add to that that anyone wanting to work more than 75 hours typically can. 100-130 hours of credit is pretty common, at least once you have a line.

Taxes are lower this year than last, so that will help you take more home, but that’s true at ANY job, not just EDV.


And don’t forget your $10K bonus first year. So that’s $45K + $10K + say $3K M&IE, or $58K. Figure 65-70% after taxes, depending on your situation, and you will bring home around $37,700~$40,600.

Personally, I do not tell people that they can make “big bucks” because there is no way to predict the future. In the examples above, one can see that much larger numbers than mine are possible. But mine are the MINIMUM you will make, basically what you can count on if you are sick, the music stops here, no extra flying, etc. If you get here and want to make more, it is currently very possible to do so.

HTH

Really now, not recruiter numbers. What should one expect first and second year, assuming having the times for the upgrade at hire date, and willing to be based in ATL?
Maybe I'm going from past life, but this seems too good to be true, instant upgrade, etc.

flydiamond
02-20-2018, 06:47 AM
HighFlight has good advice. I’d always make sure to *budget* on the 75 hours a month so as to not over extend yourself should things turn bad. Always anticipate and save up for a rainy day. However, when comparing one airline to another there is no reason to not look at our rates versus theirs in the context of 100 or 110 credit hours a month. Super easy to get there with 11-13 days off a month here as a line holder. Just make sure the airline makes sense for you from other perspectives. Do the bases work?

aviatorpr
02-20-2018, 07:06 AM
if you upgrade immediately you will be on Reserve quite a while. Unless you pick up and reduce your days off down to comply 30 hours in 7 days, I donít think you will be crediting 100+ like many of the line holders here have mentioned they have.

tm602
02-20-2018, 07:50 AM
Hey UNDGUY congratulations on the baby, and maximizing time with your family: good choice.

tm602
02-20-2018, 07:53 AM
Thanks for the responses guys. What about EDV medical plans? Assuming family coverage, wife and 2 kids. I heard AWAC has a great plan, but the pay kind of negates that over there.

flydiamond
02-20-2018, 08:54 AM
Thanks for the responses guys. What about EDV medical plans? Assuming family coverage, wife and 2 kids. I heard AWAC has a great plan, but the pay kind of negates that over there.

$411 or $909 a month for a family depending on the plan you choose (HSA or PPO). Worst case scenario (were talking catostphic illness) with the HSA you pay a $6000 out of pocket maximum and $5000 in premiums for the year, less $1350 in company contributions. That about equals the premium for our PPO plan which is very expensive.

UNDGUY
02-20-2018, 09:00 AM
Hey UNDGUY congratulations on the baby, and maximizing time with your family: good choice.

You are talking about "Casualinterest" I was really confused for a minute. I'll be bidding max credit and trying to maximize time away from my family. My "baby" is 14 now. lol

Casualinterest
02-20-2018, 12:51 PM
You are talking about "Casualinterest" I was really confused for a minute. I'll be bidding max credit and trying to maximize time away from my family. My "baby" is 14 now. lolLol when my daughter is 14 I'm guessing I'll do the same haha.



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bc980
02-20-2018, 12:53 PM
Lol when my daughter is 14 I'm guessing I'll do the same haha.



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When she is 14, you NEED to be home with the shotgun!

Casualinterest
02-20-2018, 12:54 PM
$411 or $909 a month for a family depending on the plan you choose (HSA or PPO). Worst case scenario (were talking catostphic illness) with the HSA you pay a $6000 out of pocket maximum and $5000 in premiums for the year, less $1350 in company contributions. That about equals the premium for our PPO plan which is very expensive.Yes, our insurance leaves much to be desired. Awac has the best insurance in the industry. It's great, but you have to weigh the cost of lesser pay and slower upgrade. They're kinda the gold standard for regional insurance, but that's really about it. Even with that and the bonuses, I could not in all honesty recommend them to friends and family. I think you'll see 2018 is going to be a really big year for Endeavor.

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FODhopper
02-20-2018, 01:12 PM
if you upgrade immediately you will be on Reserve quite a while. Unless you pick up and reduce your days off down to comply 30 hours in 7 days, I donít think you will be crediting 100+ like many of the line holders here have mentioned they have.

I agree with this. As a very junior captain I have to sacrifice days off to make over guarantee and because I have a young family it's a balancing act. You need to budget for 75 hours because it's so hit or miss whether they actually fly you when you are sitting reserve. I am sitting evening reserve for all of March and so if I fly once maybe twice that will be a miracle.

Flogger
02-20-2018, 01:23 PM
I agree with this. As a very junior captain I have to sacrifice days off to make over guarantee and because I have a young family it's a balancing act. You need to budget for 75 hours because it's so hit or miss whether they actually fly you when you are sitting reserve. I am sitting evening reserve for all of March and so if I fly once maybe twice that will be a miracle.

First year pay requires a dead chicken and nine-sided dice to figure out as there are way too many variables. For instance, I am a new-hire FO and will be making Captain without ever doing FO OE (initial Operating Experince). Due to broken sims and missed flights to training events, it will be nearly six months since my hire date before Captain pay kicks in. Take away the training delays and it could possibly have been 4.5 ish months.

And by all means, budget for only guarantee of 75 hours.

Mustang62
02-20-2018, 02:34 PM
For instance, I am a new-hire FO and will be making Captain without ever doing FO OE (initial Operating Experince).

Is that something new? I was told that you had to complete the OE as an FO before they would send you back to upgrade.

tm602
02-20-2018, 06:53 PM
You are talking about "Casualinterest" I was really confused for a minute. I'll be bidding max credit and trying to maximize time away from my family. My "baby" is 14 now. lol

Haha! That's what happens when I try to answer posts between flights!

Flogger
02-21-2018, 02:49 AM
Is that something new? I was told that you had to complete the OE as an FO before they would send you back to upgrade.

It's schedule based hit and miss, which is why I said you need a chicken and dice. The main point here is you have no idea exactly how long you will be on FO pay, even if you are eligible for and get awarded an "instant Captain" upgrade. Way too many variables to nail it down such as the two month cycle for the vacancy awards etc etc.

Everyone who may be eligible for an "instant upgrade" will benefit if they come here with the mindset that they will train and sit as an FO for at least a month or two.

PotatoChip
02-23-2018, 04:41 AM
Is that something new? I was told that you had to complete the OE as an FO before they would send you back to upgrade.

It appears that they are doing the same with me.

DL31082
02-25-2018, 05:16 AM
Is that something new? I was told that you had to complete the OE as an FO before they would send you back to upgrade.

They are doing the same thing with me. I had 14 days between LOE completion and upgrade class. After the 5 days off and one travel day to MSP that would give them 8 days to do my OE. I emailed them and they said they werent going to even try to do my OE.

My original sim partner finished his LOE in mid Feb and was told he probably wouldnít start OE until mid March.