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View Full Version : Army Aviation Officer Vs Warrant?


Zach7177
03-07-2018, 05:36 AM
Morning,

I am currently 2 months away from graduating with my Bachelors in Aviation Management. I have around 350 fixed wing hours. Holding my Private, Instrument, Single-Engine Comm and Multi-Engine Comm. I will be up for my flight instructor check ride in the next month or two.

I am interested in going the military route to fly. However, I am confused as to which route is better for my career in the military, as well as my civilian career after. Warrant or an Aviation Officer in the Army? I know my chances of Rotary is high, but what is the possibility of getting the C12 at some point in the army?

I understand the Warrant will get more stick time, and Aviation officer does more of the management duties.

If someone can just fill the holes here, and any Ex Army guys, would be much appreciated to hear your stories.

Thank you,

Zach


Gundriver64
03-07-2018, 05:57 AM
Morning,

I am currently 2 months away from graduating with my Bachelors in Aviation Management. I have around 350 fixed wing hours. Holding my Private, Instrument, Single-Engine Comm and Multi-Engine Comm. I will be up for my flight instructor check ride in the next month or two.

I am interested in going the military route to fly. However, I am confused as to which route is better for my career in the military, as well as my civilian career after. Warrant or an Aviation Officer in the Army? I know my chances of Rotary is high, but what is the possibility of getting the C12 at some point in the army?

I understand the Warrant will get more stick time, and Aviation officer does more of the management duties.

If someone can just fill the holes here, and any Ex Army guys, would be much appreciated to hear your stories.

Thank you,

Zach
Go the warrant route. This will get you the follow on specialized training such as instructor pilot course(s), aviation safety, etc. These are additional feathers in your cap that look good on the CV. As far as airframe goes itís needs of the Army first. You could get the Grob120/C-12 in flight school, but not likely.

Cheers,
G

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 06:07 AM
Much appreciated. Yeah it seems as though the Warrant route is the most desired for stick time.

I just wasn't sure if there was a fixed-wing transition course is offered at some point. Or, if someone as my self is coming in with a large chunk of fixed-wing time has a greater advantage of getting the C12 etc..

Thank you


USMCFLYR
03-07-2018, 06:46 AM
Large chunk of fixed wing time = 350 hours? :confused::D

Gundriver64
03-07-2018, 06:53 AM
Much appreciated. Yeah it seems as though the Warrant route is the most desired for stick time.

I just wasn't sure if there was a fixed-wing transition course is offered at some point. Or, if someone as my self is coming in with a large chunk of fixed-wing time has a greater advantage of getting the C12 etc..

Thank you
Your previous fixed-wing time will have no bearing on airframe selection. Not even a little bit.

rickair7777
03-07-2018, 07:07 AM
Depends on if your priority is fun, or the size of the retirement check. If you stay in much beyond 20, the difference between WO and O5/O6 pay will start to add up. If you only do 20 it won't be as big of a difference.

Worth noting, *some* legacies might give more consideration to a commissioned officer vice a WO. Mostly a cultural thing, but it's out there.

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 07:30 AM
Large chunk of time with regards to being in college, and my time only being for training , and not with a commercial gig etc...

Sounds good I was just curious as to whether or not my time will have any effect.

An ultimately I’m looking to make this a career versus just for fun.

rickair7777
03-07-2018, 07:37 AM
Large chunk of time with regards to being in college, and my time only being for training , and not with a commercial gig etc...

Sounds good I was just curious as to whether or not my time will have any effect.

An ultimately Iím looking to make this a career versus just for fun.

As a commissioned officer, you'll have opportunities to do things other then flying and related support activities. That may or may not be a good thing, depends on your interests.

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 07:45 AM
Yeah ultimately I want to do more flying than other activities. An my understanding warrant will be the best route for that.

However, just want to get everyone’s view on it, pros and cons.

Thank you for your input.

BeatNavy
03-07-2018, 08:35 AM
Go ANG/AFRES instead. Youíll thank me later.

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 08:59 AM
Just curious as to why not go army?

OuterMarker
03-07-2018, 09:09 AM
if someone as my self is coming in with a large chunk of fixed-wing time has a greater advantage of getting the C12 etc..
Thank you

Don't worry, they will beat that fixed-wing stuff out of you in the first week. The Army has almost 4000 helicopters and a few airplanes. If you're looking for airplanes, you'll find them in the Air Force.

And if you primarily want to be a "pilot, get 1500 hours and go to a Regional. The military (especially) the Army, is not looking for pilots, they want Officers who can do 40 other things with flying being just one of them. There are plenty of 20-year Army Aviators walking around the Pentagon with less than 1000 hours of flight time, but they have probably checked most of the right blocks for War College and 06 selection.

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 09:17 AM
I donít have a preferance Iíd fixed-wing or rotary. I was just curious if Iíll get fixed wing just due to my hours.

But thank you for the input!

BeatNavy
03-07-2018, 09:19 AM
Just curious as to why not go army?

When I was in college one of my professors, an Apache guy, said that army Aviation is the armpit of military flying. And after flying for 8+ years it is absolutely true. As a commissioned guy, I was scoffed by my bosses for trying to fly a lot. Itís a tertiary duty. Sure commanding troops is a great responsibility, but if you are interested in flying, being commissioned isnít the way to go. I had almost as much flight time as my warrant peers, because I made myself an asset and forced my way onto flight schedules. And I got lucky with deployments while in flying positions (lucky Bc I got to fly a lot, not lucky I spent a ton of time getting shot at). Many of my commissioned peers got out at 8 years with 400-500 total hours. Unless deployed, and unless an IP, even warrants donít fly that much. We always had nonflying crap going on. As a warrant, there are still additional duties. Itís a lot better as a flyer, but you have to answer to some snot nosed 23 year old LT and 29 year old captain, and you will make significantly less money than commissioned guys. The bonuses are a joke compared to AF bonuses.

Now letís talk optempo. 9-12 month deployments. When not deployed, you get to spend time pretending and sleeping out in the field, in tents, or at miserable training centers, often times simulating deployment with no cell phones or internet. Contrast that with ANG/AFRES pilots who fly, considerably more, have shorter deployments to much better locations, and are sought after by airlines. Airlines (minus JetBlue) scoff helo time. Lots of army guys in the regionals and JetBlue. Not a lot of AF dudes have to go to regionals.

I know lots of us Army folks who transitioned to the ANG/AFRES, but I know zero ANG/AFRES guys who went Army. Thereís probably more I could think of but thatís the quick stuff in the front of my mind.

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 09:28 AM
Thank you for this great input. I’m going to assume making a mistake going the army route to fly?

Thank you for this reply and your perspective. Greatly appreciated. I took the Astb with the marines a year ago , 5-7-5 48. However, my recruiter was adamant about me putting college on hold to head to ocs. So in the meantime I’m weighing my options in other branches.

USMCFLYR
03-07-2018, 09:41 AM
Thank you for this great input. Iím going to assume making a mistake going the army route to fly?

Thank you for this reply and your perspective. Greatly appreciated. I took the Astb with the marines a year ago , 5-7-5 48. However, my recruiter was adamant about me putting college on hold to head to ocs. So in the meantime Iím weighing my options in other branches.
This doesn't sound right.

You either do PLC during summers between college, or OCS after college.

Were you talking to a RECRUITER or to an Officer Selection Officer (OSO)?

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 09:44 AM
OSO, he wanted me to go over summer. I just was not ready to make the commitment too early, and wanted to make sure I chose the right branch, and utilized the time I had till graduation to weight all my options.

USMCFLYR
03-07-2018, 12:20 PM
OSO, he wanted me to go over summer. I just was not ready to make the commitment too early, and wanted to make sure I chose the right branch, and utilized the time I had till graduation to weight all my options.
Yeah - you wouldn't have had to put college on hold.
That program is designed for the summer between college semesters.

I didn't go to OCS until 9 months after graduation - so there is still time for you to look into all options.

Certainly DO NOT make your decision based on an internet forum.

I fly with numerous former Army guys - all of which ended up with lots of time fixed wing.
It was very competitive to get into the fixed wing program back then - I'd imagine it still is though like was said earlier - I heard they were even sending some people directly to fixed wing.

Good luck in your decisions.

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 12:31 PM
Very informative response. Exactly what I am looking for. Thank you for taking the time to respond.

Yeah it seems that everyone has a different route to bribe me with. Just try to gather as much input to make an informative decision.

Thank you

Gundriver64
03-07-2018, 02:31 PM
When I was in college one of my professors, an Apache guy, said that army Aviation is the armpit of military flying. And after flying for 8+ years it is absolutely true. As a commissioned guy, I was scoffed by my bosses for trying to fly a lot. Itís a tertiary duty. Sure commanding troops is a great responsibility, but if you are interested in flying, being commissioned isnít the way to go. I had almost as much flight time as my warrant peers, because I made myself an asset and forced my way onto flight schedules. And I got lucky with deployments while in flying positions (lucky Bc I got to fly a lot, not lucky I spent a ton of time getting shot at). Many of my commissioned peers got out at 8 years with 400-500 total hours. Unless deployed, and unless an IP, even warrants donít fly that much. We always had nonflying crap going on. As a warrant, there are still additional duties. Itís a lot better as a flyer, but you have to answer to some snot nosed 23 year old LT and 29 year old captain, and you will make significantly less money than commissioned guys. The bonuses are a joke compared to AF bonuses.

Now letís talk optempo. 9-12 month deployments. When not deployed, you get to spend time pretending and sleeping out in the field, in tents, or at miserable training centers, often times simulating deployment with no cell phones or internet. Contrast that with ANG/AFRES pilots who fly, considerably more, have shorter deployments to much better locations, and are sought after by airlines. Airlines (minus JetBlue) scoff helo time. Lots of army guys in the regionals and JetBlue. Not a lot of AF dudes have to go to regionals.

I know lots of us Army folks who transitioned to the ANG/AFRES, but I know zero ANG/AFRES guys who went Army. Thereís probably more I could think of but thatís the quick stuff in the front of my mind.

To the OP: this is good G2. I flew the 64D for most of my Army career. It's an amazing machine and a battlefield shaper. However, the amount of BS creep is at epic levels out in the field. Yes, you'll get great training in state of the art equipment, but the Army way of doing things (leadership, priorities, political correctness) will make you want to bang your head against the wall.

Zach7177
03-07-2018, 02:42 PM
So I guess my question for you 64, and btw appreciate your service. Would you do it over again if you could?

Gundriver64
03-07-2018, 03:05 PM
So I guess my question for you 64, and btw appreciate your service. Would you do it over again if you could?

The military? Wouldn't change it for the world! ;)

OuterMarker
03-07-2018, 03:06 PM
the amount of BS creep is at epic levels out in the field. Yes, you'll get great training in state of the art equipment, but the Army way of doing things (leadership, priorities, political correctness) will make you want to bang your head against the wall.

Spot on! It has gotten way beyond ridiculous.

USMCFLYR
03-07-2018, 03:30 PM
The military? Wouldn't change it for the world! ;)
Exactly.

Spot on! It has gotten way beyond ridiculous.
In line with the civilian/corporate world.

Taco280AI
03-07-2018, 07:16 PM
Warrant or an Aviation Officer

What is a Warrant and an Aviation officer? Warrants are officers. Can be field warrants or aviation warrants. There are also commissioned officers, some happen to go the aviation route.

Commissioned vs Warrant...

Warrants don't just fly, I wish that were the case. They get stuck with a lot of additional duties to the point that your additional duties are what you do in reality, and sometimes you'll go fly if you're lucky. In the long run, warrants will have more flight time compared to commissioned.

Commissioned gets more money, but more desk work and death by PowerPoint.

Can you get a C12 down the road? No. You can get it at Rucker and only at Rucker since it is now a selection, just like 60s or 64s. Your fixed wing time doesn't mean anything, airframe selection is based off the OML. The higher you rank in your class based off academics, checkrides, PT test, etc... the higher you are on the OML. Top of class gets first pick, bottom of class gets whatever is left.

Definite advantage, you can apply to be an aviation warrant straight through your recruiter without having to commit to the Army. Street to seat is one of the names they call it. If you go commissioned, you may or may not get aviation, who knows.

The Army needs pilots, if that's what you want go for it

Gundriver64
03-08-2018, 02:34 AM
What is a Warrant and an Aviation officer? Warrants are officers. Can be field warrants or aviation warrants. There are also commissioned officers, some happen to go the aviation route.

Commissioned vs Warrant...

Warrants don't just fly, I wish that were the case. They get stuck with a lot of additional duties to the point that your additional duties are what you do in reality, and sometimes you'll go fly if you're lucky. In the long run, warrants will have more flight time compared to commissioned.

Commissioned gets more money, but more desk work and death by PowerPoint.

Can you get a C12 down the road? No. You can get it at Rucker and only at Rucker since it is now a selection, just like 60s or 64s. Your fixed wing time doesn't mean anything, airframe selection is based off the OML. The higher you rank in your class based off academics, checkrides, PT test, etc... the higher you are on the OML. Top of class gets first pick, bottom of class gets whatever is left.

Definite advantage, you can apply to be an aviation warrant straight through your recruiter without having to commit to the Army. Street to seat is one of the names they call it. If you go commissioned, you may or may not get aviation, who knows.

The Army needs pilots, if that's what you want go for it

Yes, you can still get the fixed-wing course down the road. The AQC will still be offered as a process. However, with an initial course being offered there will be less chance of doing so. It's still needs of the Army FIRST, merit qualifications second.

Taco280AI
03-08-2018, 01:28 PM
Not from what we were briefed at some WOPD and told through emails. Didn't even care who we were or what we've been doing. Flat out told if you're not FW, you won't be and that it is only a selection at Rucker. And those who go FW will be for their career.



However, the Army will always change their minds as they please so who really knows.

Gundriver64
03-08-2018, 03:45 PM
Not from what we were briefed at some WOPD and told through emails. Didn't even care who we were or what we've been doing. Flat out told if you're not FW, you won't be and that it is only a selection at Rucker. And those who go FW will be for their career.



However, the Army will always change their minds as they please so who really knows.

True. Wasn't long ago I was at CAE. They said FWMEQC would roll on for all three compos.

Voski
03-08-2018, 08:01 PM
Don't fly Army. Go ANG/USAF Reserve. You'll think me later.

Source: I am a 1,500 hour Army instructor pilot leaving the service for the airlines.

GeorgeAmthor
03-08-2018, 08:55 PM
I graduated college in 1996 and (due to then President Clintonís downsizing of the military) lost my Marine Corps flight slot. I enlisted in the Army as an E-4 (because I had a 4 year degree) under the college loan repayment program (LRP). This program was only for enlisted soldiers at that time. I was able to pay off all of my student loans in three years. I got Air Traffic Control (93C) as my MOS. I earned my FAA Control Tower Certificate. (Similar to earning an FAA Commercial Pilot License, the green FAA cards are identical.) Being an Air Traffic Control (Both Radar and Non Radar) made me a much better pilot because I learned so much about what happens ďbehind the scenes.Ē

As soon as my student loans were paid off, I applied and was accepted to Warrant Officer Candidate School (WOCS). I ranked high in my class and earned the CH47 slot to Fort Campbell, KY. (My first choice)
At that time, the CH47 was the only helicopter that was being flown commercially in the private sector that weighed more than 12,500 lbs. So, I was able to get an FAA Type Rating on it.

Every decision that I made, career wise, was to make my resume better for when I got out. I was wounded in combat on January 28th, 2002.

My military career was cut short, but because of my military training, I was able to find work quickly. I recommend the Warrant Officer Corps over becoming a Commissioned Officer especially since you will have a 4 year degree. You will most likely get promoted quicker than your peers because of your degree (All commissioned officers have 4 year degrees or higher. Not all Warrant Officers have 4 year degrees. So, this will work to your advantage.)

There are less politics involved when getting promoted to CW2 and CW3. It starts to get a little political when trying to make CW4 and CW5.

A lot of the Chinook pilots ended up in the fixed wing program. My guess is that CH47ís, at that time were ďCorps AssetsĒ meaning that they were assigned at the Division Level (Normally rubbing elbows with high ranking decision makers.)

One last thing. If I were you, I would build more fixed wing time on the weekends. Every Army base that I was assigned to always had a skydive drop zone that needed fixed wing pilots. So, when I was enlisted, I worked in the ATC tower during the week and flew skydivers on the weekends. When I became a Warrant Officer, I flew Chinooks during the week and skydivers on the weekends.

I was able to build a ton of flight time this way. Being a helicopter pilot makes you a much better airplane pilot because you have to learn how to use your feet. Most airplane drivers that have never flown a helicopter have ďsloppy feetĒ. Especially, during an engine failure. Helicopter pilots have no problems with fixed wing engine failures.

If I had to do it all over again. I would do nothing different. I loved serving my country as a US Army Aviation Warrant Officer. I made many life long friends. The hardest part of being a soldier is when someone that you have become so close to doesnít make it home from battle. I have lost so many dear friends this way. I will never forget them... ever.

Best of luck.

Airbum
03-09-2018, 04:13 AM
I can not envision wanting to a flying a King Air over an Apache and yet it seems many try to get fixed wing time in the Army. Can someone tell me why that is?


My friends who where O2 Officers and above rarely flew in Army and I remember them saying many had wished they were Warrant Officers.

I always wanted to fly attack helicopters, I ended up in fighters in the Air Force but would have loved a exchange tour with Army.

rickair7777
03-09-2018, 05:09 AM
I can not envision wanting to a flying a King Air over an Apache and yet it seems many try to get fixed wing time in the Army. Can someone tell me why that is?


So they can apply to the airlines with military FW turbine time?

Maybe better QOL with some FW gigs. I don't recall seeing any kingairs operating out of FOBs in the middle of swamps, but plenty of RW doing that.

BeatNavy
03-09-2018, 05:44 AM
I can not envision wanting to a flying a King Air over an Apache and yet it seems many try to get fixed wing time in the Army. Can someone tell me why that is?


I always wanted to fly attack helicopters, I ended up in fighters in the Air Force but would have loved a exchange tour with Army.

Attack helos are fun. Killing stuff is fun. But at some point it becomes a job, and the army BS is much worse than the other services (going to the field, longer deployments, formation/unit PT every morning, etc.). There is less of that in the army FW world, and towards the end of oneís career it traditionally has been competitive to go to the fixed wing world where thereís less BS, more career opportunity on the backside, and itís a chance to do something different and have more options upon retirement. FW guys tend to fly more as well and have a more flying focused life than the helo units, with less Army BS involved when not flying. I was never Army FW, so all that is word of mouth from my buddies who did it.

trip
03-09-2018, 06:01 AM
If your goal is legacy airlines then go any service but Army. If you want Army for other reasons then by all means do it but plan on a stint in the regionals before a legacy airline.

Airbum
03-09-2018, 06:28 AM
Thanks for the valid reasons. If ones goals from the start are airlines then I wouldnít suggest the army but I see that later on like rickair suggests it opens up more job opportunity.

Oh and yes the armyís fob always made me glad I was in the Air Force

Hobbit64
03-09-2018, 08:07 AM
Attack helos are fun. Killing stuff is fun. But at some point it becomes a job, and the army BS is much worse than the other services (going to the field, longer deployments, formation/unit PT every morning, etc.). There is less of that in the army FW world, and towards the end of oneís career it traditionally has been competitive to go to the fixed wing world where thereís less BS, more career opportunity on the backside, and itís a chance to do something different and have more options upon retirement. FW guys tend to fly more as well and have a more flying focused life than the helo units, with less Army BS involved when not flying. I was never Army FW, so all that is word of mouth from my buddies who did it.
You're Spot On here.

Gundriver64
03-09-2018, 08:20 AM
I can not envision wanting to a flying a King Air over an Apache and yet it seems many try to get fixed wing time in the Army. Can someone tell me why that is?


My friends who where O2 Officers and above rarely flew in Army and I remember them saying many had wished they were Warrant Officers.

I always wanted to fly attack helicopters, I ended up in fighters in the Air Force but would have loved a exchange tour with Army.

King Air flying is BORING compared to Apache flying. But that shouldn't come as a surprise to anybody. In my last Apache unit we had a Air Force guy leave the AF and join the Army to specifically fly the AH-64. Later we had a Navy guy (P3s) show up doing the same thing. The aircraft is a beast and is very challenging to fly at night (PNVS flying). However, the King Air is the obvious ticket for those aspiring to do the airline thing later on.

Cheers,
G

DC2Airmail
03-09-2018, 12:23 PM
Go ANG/AFRES instead. Youíll thank me later.
I have friends that flew ARES C-17's, and other heavies, and then went to Majors from there. May be a better route.

ArmyFW
03-09-2018, 04:28 PM
Itís not that far off to get a fixed wing slot in the army now. The last couple of selections at rucker had more fixed wing slots than everything but Blackhawks. The very last one I heard about had more fixed wing than anything. This may just be a push for now but it is a very large one. I like my job so far, and love being a WO instead of an RLO. That may fade soon but itís better than the infantry where I came from. We donít sleep in tents, go TDY and sleep in decent hotels, get rental cars and whatnot. We have the opportunity to fly UC-35ís (Cessna Citations) and Gulfstreams as well. I donít think itís a bad way to get your ratings, serve your country, meet good people, and get a decent paycheck while really learning the instrument flying because thatís our bread and butter because the tactical side isnít very strenuous on the flying side. We also donít typically deploy for 9-12 months either, the norm is 2-6 months right now but changes based on what the army needs. Some of us have been out of flight school for maybe 5 months and already have 150 hours. Army fixed wing is not the retirement home it used to be. The army saw the problem with this and is actually changing it. There are a lot of WO1ís and 2LTís coming through which helps the motivation and unit pride. Hope this helps to let other services know whatís going on over here in army fixed wing now.

Zach7177
03-10-2018, 04:43 AM
Thank you everyone for the informative post. An ArmyFW that is great to hear the Army is doing something about it.

ArmyFW
03-12-2018, 08:50 AM
Glad to help

tattooguy21
03-14-2018, 07:17 PM
Thank you everyone for the informative post. An ArmyFW that is great to hear the Army is doing something about it.

Ok man, here's a hard truth that no one's spoken on here....and I know because I'm about to leave Rucker having worked on the inside.

Right now the only way to get FW course is if you select is. By only way I mean other than having a REALLY good connection REALLY high up that will hook you up one day. You'll come here as either a warrant or officer, do some pre-flying flight school classes, then based on your class rank, select aircraft. HERE'S THE THING NO ONE'S SPOKEN ON....

So lets say it's selection time. Well, that day of selection, the army may say "we need 2 apaches, 5 chinooks, and 1 blackhawk" and 2 weeks later at the next selection class they may say "we need 15 FW pilots and 15 apache pilots."

Which selection group will you be in? Regardless of your class rank, the day you select aircraft guess what might not be an option. ANY ONE OF AIRCRAFT THE ARMY HAS. I've seen over 100 selections during the last 3 years and the ONLY aircraft that was always listed as a selection was the AH-64. EVERY....SINGLE.....TIME.

Dude, how would bad would that suck to break your back to be #1 and then not even get the opportunity to pick the aircraft you wanted to fly most. POSSIBLY even the second most depending on what they have that day.

For me the army aviation world has been an awesome sh*tshow. I love it as much as I hate it. I have a lot of AF buddies I kept up with from our time co-stationed at Osan and Humphreys in Korea. Make no mistake, grass isn't always greener. None of them stayed past the 12 year mark due to the fact that they said they attend more, "rape is bad, don't sell humans" briefs in a single month than they got flight time. So much so that one started an excel tracker of briefing hours vs flight hours. For 9 months out of the year, his flight hours lost to the briefing hours.

Point is, it's an issue in the services like it is the airlines, especially now that regionals are reaching out the RW guys like me, giving thousands an opportunity they never had.

IF you are looking to fly for the majors one day, anyone here that says go army is lying to you. Go airforce, go cargo/transport, and enjoy your transition to the majors 5-10 years before any of these other jokers. How do I know? Watching many a friend do just that. Walk out of the airforce and into the majors vs my RW buds that are playing regional games.

BeatNavy
03-14-2018, 10:09 PM
While I mostly agree with what tattoo said, I spent 8 years flying helos in the army and a little over a year at a regional before I got on with a major. That’s still earlier than my active duty Air Force counterparts who had a 12 year service commitment. That said, I’m still in the “fly anywhere but the army” camp. I’ll caveat that with the fact that all my bro’s who got out when I did with the same army experience are still in the regionals, so ymmv.

Spike from flyi
03-15-2018, 02:51 AM
While I mostly agree with what tattoo said, I spent 8 years flying helos in the army and a little over a year at a regional before I got on with a major. Thatís still earlier than my active duty Air Force counterparts who had a 12 year service commitment. That said, Iím still in the ďfly anywhere but the armyĒ camp. Iíll caveat that with the fact that all my broís who got out when I did with the same army experience are still in the regionals, so ymmv.

BeatNavy,

Your callsign is great, but who in the Army ever uses the term, "helo"? I'm just sayin'.

Spike

Gundriver64
03-15-2018, 03:04 AM
To the OP,

I have 30 years in the Army (combination of AD, Reserve, and AGR time). All of it has been in Aviation branch. Army Aviation of today isn't the same as it was in the late 80s when I joined. There's way too much political correctness, block checking-sans proficiency, and a terrible loss of accountability (did I mention political correctness?).

I still recommend the military whole-heartedly. That being said, I suggest military service in this order:

1. Air Force Guard or Reserve
2. Navy or Marine Reserve
3. Army Reserve
4. Army Guard
5. Active Service (other than the Army)
6. Army Active Duty

Notice 1-4 is all Reserve/Guard recommendations. You're not likely to get fixed-wing in the Army Guard and especially the Reserves, but that's ok. Most of the Regionals have some kind of pure rotary wing to fixed-wing transition programs. SkyWest just announced a very sweet program for military helo drivers. Instead of incurring a 8 year full time headache on active duty somewhere (or greater), why not sign-up for some Guard/Reserve flying while simultaneously building valuable part 121 time?

Cheers,
GG

Gundriver64
03-15-2018, 03:12 AM
BeatNavy,

Your callsign is great, but who in the Army ever uses the term, "helo"? I'm just sayin'.

Spike

Oh, plenty use the moniker. FYI, I like the avatar. Former ACA/Indy myself :D.

USMCFLYR
03-15-2018, 04:20 AM
IIRC (or if it has changed), you have to already been a rated aviator to get into Navy/Marine Reserve squadron as a pilot.

rickair7777
03-15-2018, 06:52 AM
While I mostly agree with what tattoo said, I spent 8 years flying helos in the army and a little over a year at a regional before I got on with a major. Thatís still earlier than my active duty Air Force counterparts who had a 12 year service commitment. That said, Iím still in the ďfly anywhere but the armyĒ camp. Iíll caveat that with the fact that all my broís who got out when I did with the same army experience are still in the regionals, so ymmv.

I see a lot of Navy helo guys make it to good majors after a year-ish at the regionals... but they all had FW IP time from AD.

rickair7777
03-15-2018, 06:58 AM
IIRC (or if it has changed), you have to already been a rated aviator to get into Navy/Marine Reserve squadron as a pilot.

True. In years past you could hire off the street just like the other services (for sure as an NFO, I know one), but that went away a long time ago. Due to the small number of Navy reserve squadrons today, you'll pretty much need to be current in type and even then it's still competitive. I'm not sure about the C-40 squadrons, they obviously hire folks from other airframes, but I'm pretty sure that's competitive too. But even C-40's might eventually all go to ex- P-8 pilots

BeatNavy
03-15-2018, 07:10 AM
BeatNavy,

Your callsign is great, but who in the Army ever uses the term, "helo"? I'm just sayin'.

Spike

Never used it in the army, but after switching services and being in the airlines for the last few years I have dropped a lot of my army lingo and replaced it with what everyone else tends to use.



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