Airline Pilot Forums

Airline Pilot Forums was designed to be a community where working airline pilots can share ideas and information about the aviation field. In the forum you will find information about major and regional airline carriers, career training, interview and job seeker help, finance, and living the airline pilot lifestyle.




Archa3opt3ryx
03-25-2018, 12:04 PM
Hi all, I'm prior military with about 800 TT, about 650 of which are turbine (T-6, T-38, F-16). I have an FAA ATP with the "holder doesn't meet ICAO requirements" restriction. Is there any way for me to get an FO job at a European regional/low-cost airline without getting another 700 hours to hit 1500 TT and remove the ICAO restriction? What about private/corporate gigs like NetJets or whatever the European equivalent is, where I might only need a Commercial certificate and not an ATP? I don't mind taking certification tests if I need to.

I don't plan on working for the airlines long-term...I'm thinking about doing a sort of "gap year" after I get out of the military somewhere in Europe where I'm living somewhere fun, getting paid a (barely) livable wage, and have lots of time to travel, before settling down into a proper job. I just wanted to see if spending that year flying commercially would be feasible with my experience or not. I'm happy to consider "time building" jobs like aerial sightseeing, instructing, etc if they pay OK. Thank you!


dera
03-25-2018, 02:07 PM
I don't think any European airlines will accept an FAA ATP?

ZippyNH
03-25-2018, 02:46 PM
Turkish airlines, mainline, was the only Euro carrier I recall with an FAA certificate being ok...but that had a time limit to convert, and was for heavy jets...
Think you are out if luck...
And have you ever met a commuter Pilot with TIME to travel? Lol
Think you need to Honestly look at what you think the job will entail...
Most companies will laugh at you wanting to work a year after doing 2 months if training, then IOE for another month (or more depending on assignments)....1/3 of your year is already gone....
Sorry to be the voice if reason...


Archa3opt3ryx
03-25-2018, 03:20 PM
Turkish airlines, mainline, was the only Euro carrier I recall with an FAA certificate being ok...but that had a time limit to convert, and was for heavy jets...
Think you are out if luck...
And have you ever met a commuter Pilot with TIME to travel? Lol
Think you need to Honestly look at what you think the job will entail...
Most companies will laugh at you wanting to work a year after doing 2 months if training, then IOE for another month (or more depending on assignments)....1/3 of your year is already gone....
Sorry to be the voice if reason...
No worries, Iím looking for a reasonable answer! Like I said, it was just an idea I had, just wanted to see if itís feasable.

I donít mind spending a couple thousand $ on testing for a euro certificate if I need to, but I canít really justify a $30+k full euro ATP course when I already have an FAA ATP.

And I figure I donít have to tell them Iím planning on leaving in a yearís time, right? Do most commuter jobs usually have contracts where youíre obligated to stay for x number of years? If yes, then yeah, seems like Iím out of luck, but if not then I figure I can just leave the job whenever I want, right?

dera
03-25-2018, 03:36 PM
No worries, Iím looking for a reasonable answer! Like I said, it was just an idea I had, just wanted to see if itís feasable.

I donít mind spending a couple thousand $ on testing for a euro certificate if I need to, but I canít really justify a $30+k full euro ATP course when I already have an FAA ATP.

And I figure I donít have to tell them Iím planning on leaving in a yearís time, right? Do most commuter jobs usually have contracts where youíre obligated to stay for x number of years? If yes, then yeah, seems like Iím out of luck, but if not then I figure I can just leave the job whenever I want, right?

FAA ATP is a mickey mouse ATP. EASA ATPL is a bloated monster. Those two cannot be compared. Expect 6-8 months of full time study to pass the 14 exams.

trip
03-25-2018, 09:54 PM
https://jobs.flightglobal.com/jobs/aviation-and-airlines/europe/#browsing

If you have the right to live and work in EU then something should turn up.

NEDude
03-26-2018, 01:16 AM
Right now I believe the only option to fly for a European airline on an FAA certificate is with Norwegian. The only bases available for that are Stateside, FLL for the 787 or PVD/SWF for the 737.

If you wish to fly in Europe, you will need an "unlimited right to live and work in Europe", which means citizenship* in an EU/EEA country or Switzerland, plus an EASA license. On top of that, most European carriers expect you to have a type rating in an aircraft which they operate, and they do not provide that type rating without some sort of training bond.

*- I say citizenship because for all intents and purposes, that is the only way to have unlimited right to live and work all throughout EU/EEA/CH. A temporary or permanent residence permit only allows for the right to live and work in one specific country, not all of Europe.

B757
03-26-2018, 10:56 PM
Right now I believe the only option to fly for a European airline on an FAA certificate is with Norwegian. The only bases available for that are Stateside, FLL for the 787 or PVD/SWF for the 737.

If you wish to fly in Europe, you will need an "unlimited right to live and work in Europe", which means citizenship* in an EU/EEA country or Switzerland, plus an EASA license. On top of that, most European carriers expect you to have a type rating in an aircraft which they operate, and they do not provide that type rating without some sort of training bond.

*- I say citizenship because for all intents and purposes, that is the only way to have unlimited right to live and work all throughout EU/EEA/CH. A temporary or permanent residence permit only allows for the right to live and work in one specific country, not all of Europe.
..Marriage to an EU-citizen will give you the same work rights as having the passport..At least this was the case in my family, correct me if I am wrong..

Fly safe,
B757

NEDude
03-27-2018, 08:35 AM
..Marriage to an EU-citizen will give you the same work rights as having the passport..At least this was the case in my family, correct me if I am wrong..

Fly safe,
B757

It gives you the same right to live and work anywhere your EU citizen spouse resides, but it does not give you "unlimited" rights to live and work. For example if you and your spouse live in Ireland, you do not have the right to live and work in Germany unless your spouse lives there with you. If your residence permit is not a permanent one, and you get divorced, you will lose your residence rights. If it is permanent, and get divorced, you cannot transfer your permanent residence rights from one country to another. Many of the European countries will cancel your "permanent" residency if you establish yourself in another European country for an extended period of time. Denmark, for one, will do that. If you have permanent residency in Denmark, but move to Belgium (for example), after two years in Belgium Denmark will void your "permanent" residency.

Every company can define what they will accept, and there may be some companies that accept a residence permit. But generally speaking, if a company requires you to have "unlimited" right to live and work in the EU/EEA/CH, they mean a right that is not limited by time, by marriage, or to a specific country.

If you need to know specifics regarding your own situation, you can look at this website which is run by the European Commission. They can give you a proper and official answer:

http://ec.europa.eu/citizensrights/front_end/index_en.htm

zondaracer
03-27-2018, 10:57 PM
1. You need right to work
2. If you have #1, you need an EASA commercial license, or more commonly a ďfrozen ATPLĒ which means having passed the 14 ATPL exams and getting your commercial license. (Europe does not have the same requirement to have an ATP for the airlines). In Europe, a 200 hour wet-ink commercial pilot can fly an A320 or 737. Heck, Iíve got a friend and the only jet she has flown in her career is an A330.
3. If you want to work in the US, all regionals will take you with the restricted ATP and will remove the restriction once you meet 1500.

zondaracer
03-27-2018, 11:03 PM
FAA ATP is a mickey mouse ATP. EASA ATPL is a bloated monster. Those two cannot be compared. Expect 6-8 months of full time study to pass the 14 exams.

It took me 6 full months of study. I was studying from wake up till 2am almost daily.

zondaracer
03-27-2018, 11:07 PM
No worries, Iím looking for a reasonable answer! Like I said, it was just an idea I had, just wanted to see if itís feasable.

I donít mind spending a couple thousand $ on testing for a euro certificate if I need to, but I canít really justify a $30+k full euro ATP course when I already have an FAA ATP.

And I figure I donít have to tell them Iím planning on leaving in a yearís time, right? Do most commuter jobs usually have contracts where youíre obligated to stay for x number of years? If yes, then yeah, seems like Iím out of luck, but if not then I figure I can just leave the job whenever I want, right?

Quite a few jobs in Europe (especially FO jobs) having what they call a ďbondĒ or ďtype rating bondĒ which is essentially a training contract. Iíve seen anywhere from 1-5 years.

dera
03-28-2018, 04:39 AM
It took me 6 full months of study. I was studying from wake up till 2am almost daily.

Yep. And you learn useful knowledge like where exactly in the world is Dakar, and you remember every ICAO Annex number etc :D

zondaracer
03-28-2018, 06:28 AM
Yep. And you learn useful knowledge like where exactly in the world is Dakar, and you remember every ICAO Annex number etc :D

Lol, or max theoretical range of a VHF transmitter.

Sniper66
04-05-2018, 11:40 AM
It took me 6 full months of study. I was studying from wake up till 2am almost daily.



Wake up to 2am
Really

Why

Learning disability



Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1