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SonicFlyer
05-21-2018, 04:05 PM
WASHINGTON – A federal appeals panel upheld Friday the Transportation Department’s approval for Norwegian Air International to serve the U.S.

Four unions representing 135,000 aviation workers had challenged the decision by arguing that Norwegian was avoiding labor laws through its unusual corporate structure.

But a three-judge panel of the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that neither federal law nor international agreement allowed the department to reject an airline application, if the carrier satisfied the requirements. The department decided it did, in December 2016 after three years of internal debate.

The concern among U.S. airline unions was that Norwegian, a low-cost carrier, represented unfair competition because it could hire crews for lower wages. But the airline insisted the criticism was unfair because it was buying Boeing jets and hiring U.S. workers.

The unions challenging Norwegian’s permit were the Air Line Pilots Association, the Association of Flight Attendants-CWA, the Allied Pilots Association and the Southwest Airlines Pilots Association.


https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/todayinthesky/2018/05/11/norwegian-air-wins-court-challenge-pilots-flight-attendants/603613002/


50SeatsofGrey
05-21-2018, 05:04 PM
Yupppppppppppppp. We are following the Maritime industry off of a cliff.

This nice wave the industry has been riding the past couple years? At some point, the trend has to reverse.

CAirBear
05-21-2018, 05:07 PM
Yupppppppppppppp. We are following the Maritime industry off of a cliff.

This nice wave the industry has been riding the past couple years? At some point, the trend has to reverse.

I’m literally 99% positive they just had some BS in the news about reducing service in PVD and SWF. Something about not making much money and/or demand. Hmm...

They have been operating over a year now. What’s changed?


dawgdriver
05-21-2018, 06:14 PM
I’m literally 99% positive they just had some BS in the news about reducing service in PVD and SWF. Something about not making much money and/or demand. Hmm...

They have been operating over a year now. What’s changed?

Yep.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.ft.com/content/c2e417b0-1249-11e8-8cb6-b9ccc4c4dbbb

Andy
05-22-2018, 03:30 AM
I’m literally 99% positive they just had some BS in the news about reducing service in PVD and SWF. Something about not making much money and/or demand. Hmm...

They have been operating over a year now. What’s changed?

Their load factors have been fine; mid-80s. But they're losing money and getting close to hitting bond covenants.

Their outcome is likely binary: liquidate or be acquired by IAG (British Airways' parent company)

jcountry
05-22-2018, 08:58 AM
Their load factors have been fine; mid-80s. But they're losing money and getting close to hitting bond covenants.

Their outcome is likely binary: liquidate or be acquired by IAG (British Airways' parent company)

I’m cool with either.....

And good luck to any MFs who worked for them ever getting a job here. They were warned.

awax
05-22-2018, 09:22 AM
Yupppppppppppppp. We are following the Maritime industry off of a cliff.

This nice wave the industry has been riding the past couple years? At some point, the trend has to reverse.

Quiz time:
Who is the current Secretary of Transportation? Who is her husband? Who is her father?

Connect those dots and NONE of this is a mystery.

full of luv
05-22-2018, 09:58 AM
Quiz time:
Who is the current Secretary of Transportation? Who is her husband? Who is her father?

Connect those dots and NONE of this is a mystery.


I actually don't know who any of those people are, but are you insinuating that they have some power over the DC court of appeals?


All this does is codify the fact that the "open skies" treaties were agreed to by the past administrations with gaping holes in them (either by design or negligence) which will allow a subversion of labor laws of both the US and/or EU and maybe even some of the safety standards.

CBreezy
05-22-2018, 11:39 AM
Seriously? You have no idea who the Sec of Transportation is? Or her husband? Or her father? Just do a wikipedia search. It's not hard

captjns
05-22-2018, 11:44 AM
Chao is married to U.S. Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elaine_Chao


There... Mystery solved.

awax
05-22-2018, 12:01 PM
I actually don't know who any of those people are, but are you insinuating that they have some power over the DC court of appeals?


All this does is codify the fact that the "open skies" treaties were agreed to by the past administrations with gaping holes in them (either by design or negligence) which will allow a subversion of labor laws of both the US and/or EU and maybe even some of the safety standards.

Here are some names:

Mitch McConnell - Current Speaker of the House
Elaine Chao - Secretary of Transportation, and Mitch's wife.
James S. C. Chao - Elaine's dad, and the architect of the Flag of Convenience scheme that decimated the US maritime industry.


I'd hope that they wouldn't be able to bias the courts, but these days anything is possible, huh?. What's clear is that they have an intimate knowledge of the regulations, and an effective path around them in both the legislative and regulatory environments. Add to this the ethics concerns surrounding both McConnell and Chao on this issue and you have MAGA for US labor! or not.

Packrat
05-22-2018, 02:09 PM
And good luck to any MFs who worked for them ever getting a job here. They were warned.

Do you do the hiring? So you're opinion means exactly squat.

sailingfun
05-22-2018, 02:27 PM
Do you do the hiring? So you're opinion means exactly squat.

A active pilot sits on most hiring panels at the major airlines. He may or may not have a bias.

captjns
05-22-2018, 03:56 PM
I’m cool with either.....

And good luck to any MFs who worked for them ever getting a job here. They were warned.

Another empty threat. :rolleyes:

captjns
05-22-2018, 03:56 PM
Do you do the hiring? So you're opinion means exactly squat.

Nah miscreants ala JC are generally the company’s chief turd hearse drivers hoping to become a Microsoft Pilot to say the least.

captjns
05-22-2018, 03:59 PM
A active pilot sits on most hiring panels at the major airlines. He may or may not have a bias.

Gotta tell you sailingfun... many friends and colleagues, also fellow expats, have been picked up by DAL, AA, UAL, and other major carriers.

echelon
05-22-2018, 05:04 PM
Here are some names:

Mitch McConnell - Current Speaker of the House
Elaine Chao - Secretary of Transportation, and Mitch's wife.
James S. C. Chao - Elaine's dad, and the architect of the Flag of Convenience scheme that decimated the US maritime industry.


Not that it changes anything about the point you're making but just a quick correction, McConnell is the Senate Majority Leader.

SactisbonesBJ
05-22-2018, 08:10 PM
Another example for the long list of republicans effing labor. A pilot who votes right votes against their own self interest.

Here are some names:

Mitch McConnell - Current Speaker of the House
Elaine Chao - Secretary of Transportation, and Mitch's wife.
James S. C. Chao - Elaine's dad, and the architect of the Flag of Convenience scheme that decimated the US maritime industry.


I'd hope that they wouldn't be able to bias the courts, but these days anything is possible, huh?. What's clear is that they have an intimate knowledge of the regulations, and an effective path around them in both the legislative and regulatory environments. Add to this the ethics concerns surrounding both McConnell and Chao on this issue and you have MAGA for US labor! or not.

Al Czervik
05-23-2018, 03:23 AM
Gotta tell you sailingfun... many friends and colleagues, also fellow expats, have been picked up by DAL, AA, UAL, and other major carriers.

I’m guessing they found work stateside before getting picked up at AA.

captjns
05-23-2018, 05:22 AM
I’m guessing they found work stateside before getting picked up at AA.

You’d be guessing wrong. Got a call, last night, from a friend at EK... Got the “Welcome Aboard Letter” from one of the BIG 3.

Packrat
05-23-2018, 07:39 AM
A active pilot sits on most hiring panels at the major airlines. He may or may not have a bias.

Perhaps, but he isn't making the final hiring decision. Most of the pilots who sit on hiring panels are management oriented anyway. They would look more favorably on pilots without Union backgrounds. That's exactly why AS has a preference for SkyWest pilots.

Unfortunately for them, most of the SkyWest pilots who wind up on the AS seniority list become the most rabid Union supporters. :D

Sniper66
05-24-2018, 11:05 AM
Gotta tell you sailingfun... many friends and colleagues, also fellow expats, have been picked up by DAL, AA, UAL, and other major carriers.





You keep singing the same song over and over
MANY

Here at delta 23 out of 4500 or so new hires since 2012

Is that many ?

awax
05-24-2018, 11:28 AM
Not that it changes anything about the point you're making but just a quick correction, McConnell is the Senate Majority Leader.

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor!

PowderFinger
05-24-2018, 12:24 PM
Damned Obama ... Screws us again.

PowderFinger
05-24-2018, 02:48 PM
You keep singing the same song over and over
MANY

Here at delta 23 out of 4500 or so new hires since 2012

Is that many ?

How many EAL SCABs did you hire? How many EAL strikers?

Sniper66
05-24-2018, 05:07 PM
How many EAL SCABs did you hire? How many EAL strikers?





None

You?

PowderFinger
05-25-2018, 03:14 AM
None

You?

None? As in none of the strikers.
You did hire SCABs.

It amazes me how you post on various threads about how great DALPA is and how they would kick arse in various situations.

I know you were beating on your chest about no SCABs during the NWA strike ( an airline with a true Union/backbone) and I'm curious as to how long you were at NWA before the merger?

PowderFinger
05-25-2018, 03:23 AM
None

You?

United hired a few of the strikers.

6 SCABs were hired by accident ... They were hired on before the court document came out that revealed the names of those who had signed up to go back to work. They were on the list and treated accordingly.

C130driver
05-25-2018, 08:17 PM
Do you do the hiring? So you're opinion means exactly squat.

Ever heard of the bro network? It exists

Packrat
05-26-2018, 05:49 AM
Ever heard of the bro network? It exists

Management does the hiring not the “bro” network.

Sniper66
05-27-2018, 10:48 AM
None? As in none of the strikers.
You did hire SCABs.

It amazes me how you post on various threads about how great DALPA is and how they would kick arse in various situations.

I know you were beating on your chest about no SCABs during the NWA strike ( an airline with a true Union/backbone) and I'm curious as to how long you were at NWA before the merger?





A lot longer than you have been at Cal
Unless you were At express

PowderFinger
05-27-2018, 06:20 PM
A lot longer than you have been at Cal
Unless you were At express

Yes ... You were there a lot longer than I was at CAL or Express ... Considering I haven't spent a day at either ... Lol.

Soooo ... Were you at NW during that last strike?

Sniper66
05-28-2018, 11:22 AM
Yes ... You were there a lot longer than I was at CAL or Express ... Considering I haven't spent a day at either ... Lol.

Soooo ... Were you at NW during that last strike?





Before summer 1998

My name is Randy and yours?

SUX4U
05-28-2018, 12:11 PM
Management does the hiring not the “bro” network.

Especially true at United. I have no doubt in my mind Norwegian pilots would get hired on at United just as easily as pilots from Emirates have.

Don’t forget we hired that “fashionista” that was the face of Emirates. That right there screams “we don’t care who you flew for before us”.

flaps 9
05-29-2018, 11:30 AM
Damned Obama ... Screws us again.

Nice try :rolleyes:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EU%E2%80%93US_Open_Skies_Agreement

To make it easier for you to comprehend

The initial agreement was signed in Washington, D.C., on 30 April 2007. The agreement became effective 30 March 2008.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama

44th President of the United States from January 20, 2009 to January 20, 2017.

Roundup
05-31-2018, 12:20 PM
How many EAL SCABs did you hire? How many EAL strikers?

EAL strikers? After ALPA leadership scabbed the striking PATCO members, there was no one left to scab and the pilots at EAL should have taken the Braniff pilots with the routes and aircraft. You really can’t scab a scab.



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