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View Full Version : Sign on Bonus


Arthur27
07-03-2018, 04:14 PM
Hello, could someone enlighten me about the $22100. sign on bonus? I understand that it is a two year commitment but what other stipulations might come with it? Let’s say you have to resign after 12 months for whatever reason, how much would you have to pay back? Thanks for the info!


Alexey
07-04-2018, 10:49 AM
Hi, if you resign within the first 12 month you pay everything back. Month 13-24 - 50%

GoesTo11
07-13-2018, 06:38 AM
Civil Court Case Information - Case History (http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/CivilCourtCases/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CV2018-007451)

Civil Court Case Information - Case History (http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/CivilCourtCases/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CV2018-007468)

Discuss... looks like they collect....


PosRateGearUp
07-13-2018, 07:08 AM
Civil Court Case Information - Case History (http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/CivilCourtCases/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CV2018-007451)

Civil Court Case Information - Case History (http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/CivilCourtCases/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CV2018-007468)

Discuss... looks like they collect....

This is no secret, it’s been brought up before. What is there to discuss? Read the contract before signing.

GoesTo11
07-13-2018, 08:14 AM
This is no secret, it’s been brought up before. What is there to discuss? Read the contract before signing.

Ok don't discuss. Just some folks think companies won't come after them for these types of things. The can and they will. I agree people need to understand what they are signing up for.

StickPig
03-04-2019, 07:56 AM
Do you receive it day one, or is it at benchmark dates like end of OE?

Chemtrail1
03-04-2019, 08:55 AM
Do you receive it day one, or is it at benchmark dates like end of OE?


You get the check via FedEx Express a few days before you start class.


Things to drill down on would be if you have to pay it back if you lose your medical or other related matters. The contract merely states that you would be free from repayment if you are FULLY disabled or die. So I think you have to pay it back even if you lose your 1st class medical...

Chemtrail1
03-04-2019, 09:01 AM
Civil Court Case Information - Case History (http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/CivilCourtCases/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CV2018-007451)

Civil Court Case Information - Case History (http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/CivilCourtCases/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CV2018-007468)

Discuss... looks like they collect....


I guess we could discuss why the defendants are paying back less than the amount of the bonus. Did the court pro-rate the amount by other than 50%?

DreamCatcher
04-22-2019, 09:36 AM
Gonna bump the post if anyone has an idea when this sign on bonus is given? After training? And in installments or all at once?

StickPig
04-22-2019, 09:48 AM
Gonna bump the post if anyone has an idea when this sign on bonus is given? After training? And in installments or all at once?

All at once, you’ll get an overnight package from FedEx a few days before training.

CRJDriver900
06-12-2019, 07:24 PM
Went to court in the case where Commutair came after defendant for $7000. Judge ruled in defendant’s favor.

YLpilot
06-13-2019, 03:42 AM
Went to court in the case where Commutair came after defendant for $7000. Judge ruled in defendant’s favor.

What state? Ohio?

CRJDriver900
06-13-2019, 01:25 PM
It was in the state of Maryland

YLpilot
06-13-2019, 05:33 PM
It was in the state of Maryland

Ok as a new hire part of the "onboarding" paperwork for pilots states you can only litigate with C5 in OH. My lawyer said a very pro business state. Hard to win that lawsuit. I wonder how he got it to a MD court.

CRJDriver900
06-13-2019, 10:25 PM
Not quite shore.

Knobcrk1
08-14-2019, 05:28 PM
What about the 50k DEC signing bonus?

DirkDiggler
08-14-2019, 06:08 PM
Am I reading this correctly? That's pretty good for a United Express regional.
Captain Eligible Pilots - Home Page (http://www.flycommutair.com/captain-eligible-pilots/)

I wonder what the contract duration is.

Workhard
08-14-2019, 06:09 PM
2 years I believe.

Am I reading this correctly? That's pretty good for a United Express regional.
Captain Eligible Pilots - Home Page (http://www.flycommutair.com/captain-eligible-pilots/)

I wonder what the contract duration is.

round2
08-14-2019, 06:35 PM
What about the 50k DEC signing bonus?

What about it?

round2
08-14-2019, 06:36 PM
Prorated at 25k a year

Jmacs
08-15-2019, 10:36 AM
Prorated at 25k a year

My understanding was they cut you a check for the full amount before your class date

corporategypsy
08-15-2019, 12:07 PM
My understanding was they cut you a check for the full amount before your class date

Full amount of bonus is given right away. If you quit at 1 yr you owe half back. Quit before a year you owe it all back. You might be able to settle for a prorated amount in court.

jacburn
08-15-2019, 04:48 PM
I will add a little information to this thread since it keeps coming up.

The bonus money (22,100 - 50,000 depending on the hours you have) has to be paid out before you start class at C5. It is not in the current Pilot Contract so this money is paid to you before you are an employee. No money is withheld for taxes either, so you get the full check of 22,100 / 50,000 delivered to your mailing address right before the first day of school.

Excargodog
08-15-2019, 06:38 PM
Not quite shore.

If that’s a pun about Maryland it was awful...:cool:

round2
08-16-2019, 07:32 PM
I will add a little information to this thread since it keeps coming up.

The bonus money (22,100 - 50,000 depending on the hours you have) has to be paid out before you start class at C5. It is not in the current Pilot Contract so this money is paid to you before you are an employee. No money is withheld for taxes either, so you get the full check of 22,100 / 50,000 delivered to your mailing address right before the first day of school.


Put it in a high yield savings account... laughable but you can make about 2,300 bucks on a 50k DEC check over two years with no risk. That’s what I’m doing... dream job might call me before the warden lets me out

McGpilot
08-17-2019, 08:09 AM
Put it in a high yield savings account... laughable but you can make about 2,300 bucks on a 50k DEC check over two years with no risk. That’s what I’m doing... dream job might call me before the warden lets me out

Is that after you pay 20k in taxes on it?

njd1
08-17-2019, 08:38 AM
Is that after you pay 20k in taxes on it?

The last time it made sense to put money in a savings account was the mid 80s when interest rates were 8%+. Most "high yield" savings accounts are in the 0.25-0.5% range at the moment. At that rate you might as well stuff it in your mattress.

The bottom line is the money should be put somewhere liquid yet remain untouched for the appropriate duration. Half the money isn't yours until the end of the first year (the clock starts after you complete IOE, not DOH) and the remainder is yours after two years. Until then, you're on the hook for the taxes and repaying the appropriate amount and chasing down the tax man for a refund on the amount returned should you decide to leave early.

Alternatively, you could have a business with accrued expenses and write those off against the bonus income (one of the perks of getting this bonus prior to becoming an employee as a 1099 vs a W2) to reduce your tax liability but most pilots don't have that option.

ninerdriver
08-17-2019, 11:01 AM
The last time it made sense to put money in a savings account was the mid 80s when interest rates were 8%+. Most "high yield" savings accounts are in the 0.25-0.5% range at the moment. At that rate you might as well stuff it in your mattress.

If your savings account is yielding that low, then you're doing savings accounts wrong.

JayD
08-19-2019, 04:47 PM
The last time it made sense to put money in a savings account was the mid 80s when interest rates were 8%+. Most "high yield" savings accounts are in the 0.25-0.5% range at the moment. At that rate you might as well stuff it in your mattress.

Wrong... high yield savings accounts are 2.15-2.55%. Google it and you will see.

Wdr357
08-20-2019, 10:04 AM
The last time it made sense to put money in a savings account was the mid 80s when interest rates were 8%+. Most "high yield" savings accounts are in the 0.25-0.5% range at the moment. At that rate you might as well stuff it in your mattress.

The bottom line is the money should be put somewhere liquid yet remain untouched for the appropriate duration. Half the money isn't yours until the end of the first year (the clock starts after you complete IOE, not DOH) and the remainder is yours after two years. Until then, you're on the hook for the taxes and repaying the appropriate amount and chasing down the tax man for a refund on the amount returned should you decide to leave early.

Alternatively, you could have a business with accrued expenses and write those off against the bonus income (one of the perks of getting this bonus prior to becoming an employee as a 1099 vs a W2) to reduce your tax liability but most pilots don't have that option.
Wrong! Sorry, but in the eyes of the IRS the “bonus” is a loan until at least your one year mark and the clock starts ticking at your hire date. Subsequent to the one year mark, if it accrues at one month intervals, then each month becomes taxable as income. Whether you pay estimated taxes on it quarterly after the one year mark is something a tax accountant should answer for you.

Kenny10
08-20-2019, 12:06 PM
I will add a little information to this thread since it keeps coming up.

The bonus money (22,100 - 50,000 depending on the hours you have) has to be paid out before you start class at C5. It is not in the current Pilot Contract so this money is paid to you before you are an employee. No money is withheld for taxes either, so you get the full check of 22,100 / 50,000 delivered to your mailing address right before the first day of school.

Do you know what happens if you leave before a year and don’t have the 22k to pay upfront? Will they put you on a payment plan? I had to spend the money to pay prior bills and just have been offered better opportunities.

round2
08-20-2019, 06:21 PM
Do you know what happens if you leave before a year and don’t have the 22k to pay upfront? Will they put you on a payment plan? I had to spend the money to pay prior bills and just have been offered better opportunities.

I think you have 30 days

Purpleanga
08-21-2019, 04:56 AM
Do you know what happens if you leave before a year and don’t have the 22k to pay upfront? Will they put you on a payment plan? I had to spend the money to pay prior bills and just have been offered better opportunities.

This is exactly why that bonus money is meaningless unless you find yourself still at commutair after 2 years. It’s inevitable you’re going to try to leave. They might as well make it 80k. It’s real pain dealing with it because even if you pay it back you have to find tax pros that can help you recover some of the taxes you had to pay for getting a “bonus”. If you’re stuck, you can set up a personal loan from a lender but you’re going to be paying like 500 a month for the convenience of being able to leave commutair. Pretty terrible position. Just don’t touch the money at all until you can.

corporategypsy
08-21-2019, 07:57 AM
The court will set up a convenient repayment plan called Wage Garnishment. you will be taken to court, you can try and fight it, but if you lose you will be paying up to 25% of your paycheck toward paying back the bonus. So hopefully this new opportunity pays that much better otherwise factor in losing all of that money per paycheck. Of course if it comes to it you can try and declare bankruptcy. Not trying to be a downer but thats the reality of it.

Kenny10
08-22-2019, 09:05 AM
The court will set up a convenient repayment plan called Wage Garnishment. you will be taken to court, you can try and fight it, but if you lose you will be paying up to 25% of your paycheck toward paying back the bonus. So hopefully this new opportunity pays that much better otherwise factor in losing all of that money per paycheck. Of course if it comes to it you can try and declare bankruptcy. Not trying to be a downer but thats the reality of it.

The whole bonus thing is a rip off especially considering the fact we might loose the second year pay LOA. Thanks for the answer

Excargodog
08-22-2019, 02:19 PM
The whole bonus thing is a rip off especially considering the fact we might loose the second year pay LOA. Thanks for the answer

How is it a “rip-off” if you TOOK THEIR MONEY AND USED IT TO PAY OFF YOUR OTHER BILLS?

You gave THEM a commitment to hang around in exchange for the money and you have now changed your mind because you ‘have just been offered better opportunities’ and now apparently believe they should just forget their $22,000 like you are forgetting your commitment to them?

And you are making a big mistake to leave before successfully completing probation. Unless that ‘better opportunity’ is your forever job, that could come back to haunt you. And if this is the SECOND aviation job you are doing this at, as your prior posts would indicate, this will likely blow your chances of EVER getting hired at a truly competitive job.

Kenny10
08-22-2019, 06:27 PM
How is it a “rip-off” if you TOOK THEIR MONEY AND USED IT TO PAY OFF YOUR OTHER BILLS?

You gave THEM a commitment to hang around in exchange for the money and you have now changed your mind because you ‘have just been offered better opportunities’ and now apparently believe they should just forget their $22,000 like you are forgetting your commitment to them?

And you are making a big mistake to leave before successfully completing probation. Unless that ‘better opportunity’ is your forever job, that could come back to haunt you. And if this is the SECOND aviation job you are doing this at, as your prior posts would indicate, this will likely blow your chances of EVER getting hired at a truly competitive job.

It’s a rip off because bonus is a screwed up system. They pay you nothing which forces you to use the money and hence trapping you for two years. This is why most respectable jobs with descent pay won’t offer huge bonuses. You will want to stay two years so there is no reason to trap you. And since you are so big on commitment, why don’t you ask the company where their commitment went when they promise you $55 dollars second year pay and now they tell you that it’s going away?

And to your other point, where did I say anything about wanting them to forget the bonus? I asked here to clarify what terms the bonus was under to make an informed decision and see IF I CAN AFFORD TO PAY IT BACK, IF I WERE TO LEAVE. If I can not pay it back I won’t leave. Simply asked to acquire information. Is that too much to ask?

Excargodog
08-22-2019, 08:15 PM
It’s a rip off because bonus is a screwed up system.

And yet you signed up for it anyway. More fool you then.



They pay you nothing which forces you to use the money and hence trapping you for two years.

They pay you....NOTHING? That seems unlikely.

This is why most respectable jobs with descent pay won’t offer huge bonuses. You will want to stay two years so there is no reason to trap you.

So you KNOWINGLY signed up to a non-‘respectable’ job? Where they ‘trapped’ you? After doing the same thing less than a year ago? You are certainly a slow learner.

And since you are so big on commitment, why don’t you ask the company where their commitment went when they promise you $55 dollars second year pay and now they tell you that it’s going away?

The payscale posted is $39.00 a year for 145 FO. What aircraft are you flying? And who told you the pay was going to be higher?

And to your other point, where did I say anything about wanting them to forget the bonus? I asked here to clarify what terms the bonus was under to make an informed decision and see IF I CAN AFFORD TO PAY IT BACK, IF I WERE TO LEAVE. If I can not pay it back I won’t leave. Simply asked to acquire information. Is that too much to ask?

So you are asking WHAT THE TERMS ARE ipof a contract that you ALREADY signed AFTER having spent the money? After having signed a contract that you didn’t understand in your previous job and walking away from that?

Either you are the poster child for slow learning or the poster child for most entitled. Which is it?

StickPig
08-22-2019, 08:40 PM
Why is this still being argued over? Stay, or don’t. If you didn’t know the terms when you signed for the check you shouldn’t have signed. That’s basic. Why would you sign ANYTHING without understanding the full agreement?

Kenny10
08-22-2019, 10:54 PM
And yet you signed up for it anyway. More fool you then.





They pay you....NOTHING? That seems unlikely.



So you KNOWINGLY signed up to a non-‘respectable’ job? Where they ‘trapped’ you? After doing the same thing less than a year ago? You are certainly a slow learner.



The payscale posted is $39.00 a year for 145 FO. What aircraft are you flying? And who told you the pay was going to be higher?



So you are asking WHAT THE TERMS ARE ipof a contract that you ALREADY signed AFTER having spent the money? After having signed a contract that you didn’t understand in your previous job and walking away from that?

Either you are the poster child for slow learning or the poster child for most entitled. Which is it?

You keep on making assumptions and bringing up my previous post. Who told you I broke my contract? Additionally if a contract states that if you leave before a certain time, you must pay back the money given to you, and you do give them back their money, is that breaking a contract? No reason to get butthurt and be so clingy...

It’s clear you are a COMPANY man and have been trickigered by my post so I’m not going to waste my time with this nonsense.

I was inquiring if the company will accept a payment plan, which should of told you, if you were reading instead of assuming, that I am going to honor the contract and pay them back. If I was trying to break the contract, I would not be asking for information on how to pay back. The other two people answered the question by providing information that is useful and could be used to make a decision. They did not get their feelings involved but I get that’s a lot to ask from a COMPANY MAN. After all, it will only take 6 years to reach the current Envoy’s, Endeavor’s and Piedmont’s first year FO pay. “No BIG DEAL. AT LEAST THE COMPANY IS PAYING YOU AND WHAT AN AWFUL PERSON YOU ARE FOR ASKING QUESTIONS ABOUT LEAVING.” -Company man

Kenny10
08-22-2019, 11:10 PM
And yet you signed up for it anyway. More fool you then.





They pay you....NOTHING? That seems unlikely.



So you KNOWINGLY signed up to a non-‘respectable’ job? Where they ‘trapped’ you? After doing the same thing less than a year ago? You are certainly a slow learner.



The payscale posted is $39.00 a year for 145 FO. What aircraft are you flying? And who told you the pay was going to be higher?



So you are asking WHAT THE TERMS ARE ipof a contract that you ALREADY signed AFTER having spent the money? After having signed a contract that you didn’t understand in your previous job and walking away from that?

Either you are the poster child for slow learning or the poster child for most entitled. Which is it?

You keep on making assumptions and bringing up my previous post. Who told you I broke my contract? Additionally if a contract states that if you leave before a certain time, you must pay back the money given to you, and you do give them back their money, is that breaking a contract? No reason to get butthurt and be so clingy...

It’s clear you are a COMPANY man and have been trickigered by my post so I’m not going to waste my time with this nonsense.

I was inquiring if the company will accept a payment plan, which should of told you, if you were reading instead of assuming, that I am going to honor the contract and pay them back. If I was trying to break the contract, I would not be asking for information on how to pay back. The other two people answered the question by providing information that is useful and could be used to make a decision. They did not get their feelings involved but I get that’s a lot to ask from a COMPANY MAN. After all, it will only take 6 years to reach the current Envoy’s, Endeavor’s and Piedmont’s first year FO pay. “No BIG DEAL. AT LEAST THE COMPANY IS PAYING YOU AND WHAT AN AWFUL PERSON YOU ARE FOR ASKING QUESTIONS ABOUT LEAVING.” -Company man

Excargodog
08-23-2019, 07:45 AM
You keep on making assumptions and bringing up my previous post. Who told you I broke my contract?

So you are saying the info you put in your postings a year ago was untrue? Because if you are currently working for Commutair you would have had to have reneged on your previous contract if the prior postings were accurate.


Additionally if a contract states that if you leave before a certain time, you must pay back the money given to you, and you do give them back their money, is that breaking a contract? No reason to get butthurt and be so clingy...


Not butthurt, and certainly not clingy. Just trying to give you a warning since you obviously lack insight that reneging on two contracts in a row will establish a record that may make you unemployable at places you might someday want to work, assuming that you were ever going to be competitive there anyway. It’s clearly ironic, though, to have YOU lecturing me (or anyone else) about contracts. That’s gonna be my laugh of the day.

It’s clear you are a COMPANY man and have been trickigered by my post so I’m not going to waste my time with this nonsense.

Ooooh. He called me a COMPANY man, and believes it trickigered (sic) me. Who is making assumptions now? But in fairness, your time would be better spent by actually ANALYZING your future decisions rather than just merely signing contracts without reading them and then appealing to people on APC to commiserate with you, help you sort out your mistake, and listen to you denigrate your current employer.

I was inquiring if the company will accept a payment plan, which should of told you, if you were reading instead of assuming, that I am going to honor the contract and pay them back. If I was trying to break the contract, I would not be asking for information on how to pay back.

Mea culpa, mea maxima culpa. You were only asking about breaking the contract on your postings of your PREVIOUS employer. You were merely claiming your current one paid you nothing, a criminal violation of the 13th amendment to the constitution if true.

But it was coming across as entitled whining. And ...they pay you NOTHING? I think most people would think that the accuracy of your statements left something to be desired.


The other two people answered the question by providing information that is useful and could be used to make a decision. They did not get their feelings involved but I get that’s a lot to ask from a COMPANY MAN.

I think you missed the sarcasm in some of those replies. Insight does not appear to be your forte.

After all, it will only take 6 years to reach the current Envoy’s, Endeavor’s and Piedmont’s first year FO pay. “No BIG DEAL. AT LEAST THE COMPANY IS PAYING YOU AND WHAT AN AWFUL PERSON YOU ARE FOR ASKING QUESTIONS ABOUT LEAVING.” -Company man

So you are planning on staying an FO for 6 years? And did you not look at the payscales before you signed on? In addition to not reading the bonus contract? Did “the COMPANY” find you drunk in a bar and get you to sign on when you weren’t competent? I doubt the latter, and am unsure about the former.

I would encourage you to do the math though this time and use a little forethought. There are ways you could mitigate the damage and some potential positives.

Going to a different company would have some advantages. You’d likely acquire another type rating which would be a plus for future employment prospects at a major. If you’ve actually managed to acquire 500 hours of 121 time, Envoy might give you a $45k near-DEC bonus that could pay off your remaining Commutair bonus with money left over. If you are anywhere close to 500 hours or a year on property at Commutair you could get a larger bonus and remove the possible taint of leaving employment while on probation by finishing out the year.

But leaving two different aviation employers before your contract is completed (and especially before you are off probation) will be noticed by future prospective employers and likely not in a particularly favorable way. If your career aspirations stop at regional FO, that’s no biggie. If they are something higher it is something you may wish to consider.

It seems like the common denominator in all your actions is that you have gone ready-fire-aim. You have signed (apparently without reading) two employment contracts which you later regretted.
Perhaps you ought to really think through for what’s best for your immediate and distant career BEFORE you take action this time.

Southern Fried
08-23-2019, 07:45 AM
You keep on making assumptions and bringing up my previous post. Who told you I broke my contract? Additionally if a contract states that if you leave before a certain time, you must pay back the money given to you, and you do give them back their money, is that breaking a contract? No reason to get butthurt and be so clingy...

It’s clear you are a COMPANY man and have been trickigered by my post so I’m not going to waste my time with this nonsense.

I was inquiring if the company will accept a payment plan, which should of told you, if you were reading instead of assuming, that I am going to honor the contract and pay them back. If I was trying to break the contract, I would not be asking for information on how to pay back. The other two people answered the question by providing information that is useful and could be used to make a decision. They did not get their feelings involved but I get that’s a lot to ask from a COMPANY MAN. After all, it will only take 6 years to reach the current Envoy’s, Endeavor’s and Piedmont’s first year FO pay. “No BIG DEAL. AT LEAST THE COMPANY IS PAYING YOU AND WHAT AN AWFUL PERSON YOU ARE FOR ASKING QUESTIONS ABOUT LEAVING.” -Company manWhy did you want to fly for a living?
Its obvious you're not happy. Why not do something else?