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View Full Version : Skywest needs a union


Tuffgong
07-07-2018, 04:36 PM
Stop playing the tug of war game that you’re losing.. this TA not passing is not a victory by any means for the pilots. But it’s a victory again for Skywest boardroom.

You have way too many Pilots NOT to take charge of what is going on. Take that same energy and come together and form a strong union. Together You’re the fist in this fight. Vote for a union, trust me it will make a difference in your life (if you can). Sometimes in battle you need to “bloody their nose” to show them how serious you are. What is meant is Band to together as a force to get what you want. Because now you’re really on the losing side of the table.

Some companies have done a sit in so to speak. Nobody went to work for a day and the company felt the economic pain..


domino
07-07-2018, 06:22 PM
Stop playing the tug of war game that you’re losing.. this TA not passing is not a victory by any means for the pilots. But it’s a victory again for Skywest boardroom.

You have way too many Pilots NOT to take charge of what is going on. Take that same energy and come together and form a strong union. Together You’re the fist in this fight. Vote for a union, trust me it will make a difference in your life (if you can). Sometimes in battle you need to “bloody their nose” to show them how serious you are. What is meant is Band to together as a force to get what you want. Because now you’re really on the losing side of the table.

Some companies have done a sit in so to speak. Nobody went to work for a day and the company felt the economic pain..

Too many lifers here.
Too many “skeletons in the closets” pilots here
Too many Apathetic pilots here
Too many “That’s How We’ve always Done it” pilots here
Too many “Unions are evil” pilots here
Too many “It’s all about me” pilots here
Too many “I’m just doing my job and going home” pilots here.
Too many “I just want to get out of here” pilots here.

No union wants to have this pilot group in their midst. They are a lazy bunch which would do no good.

Excargodog
07-07-2018, 06:57 PM
Stop playing the tug of war game that you’re losing.. this TA not passing is not a victory by any means for the pilots. But it’s a victory again for Skywest boardroom.

You have way too many Pilots NOT to take charge of what is going on. Take that same energy and come together and form a strong union. Together You’re the fist in this fight. Vote for a union, trust me it will make a difference in your life (if you can). Sometimes in battle you need to “bloody their nose” to show them how serious you are. What is meant is Band to together as a force to get what you want. Because now you’re really on the losing side of the table.

Some companies have done a sit in so to speak. Nobody went to work for a day and the company felt the economic pain..

While I AGREE with you that Skywest pilots would do better if they had a union, the difficulty is getting one going. Because actually ESTABLISHING a union carries with it a little peril for those doing the establishing, while the benefit will be largely realized by those who come after those who start the union.

Most so-called 'lifers' long ago made their peace with Skywest management doing precisely what Skywest management does making it difficult to count on them to make any efforts to install a union. That sort of makes it the junior people who aren't lifers that have to carry the ball. But that doesn't mean they will.

Most junior non-lifers regard their career at Skywest as transitory. Exactly how many years - and how much TPIC they will have to accumulate - to get the call from SWA or Delta or United, that they may not know, or even if they may have to use Spirit or JetBlue or even Frontier as a stepping stone along the way, but they are reasonably confident that they aren't going to be at Skywest after 2023 when peak Legacy retirements hit. And yeah, they'd love to have better QOL for those five years - and more pay too, you bet, but they also have to look at the downside risk too.

So let's say if they actively campaigned and got in a union, they coukd make another $10-15 an hour, and maybe have a better schedule and commuting options. That's gonna give them what? $15K a year times five years? $75K? Not huge money. DECs are getting damn near that in bonus money at a lot of places. But what is the downside risk?

If the company decides to make an example of them, they can. Especially if they do something like you suggest, like a one day walkout BEFORE the RLA mediators have given permission to strike.

Hey, I'll be the first to admit the RLA is unfair, that management can usually win just by sitting on their hands, and that isn't fair and it isn't right BUT IT IS REALITY.

And all management would really have to do was fire the guys they believe to be the instigators if such a strike. And not only fire them but HAMMER THEM with non recommendations to all the majors for 'participating in an illegal strike in contravention of the RLA.' Woukd that terminate any chance of those guys getting to the majors? I don't know, but I suspect it would set them back at least a few years in their advancement which would ripple down time and deny them a couple years of seniority at a major.

So in the HOPE of gaining another $75 K in the next five years, SOMEBODY has to risk $500,000 (plus 15% for the 401K, that's another $75 K), but it's actually WORSE than that because it costs them two (or more) years of seniority and longevity pay for THEIR ENTIRE CAREER AT THE MAJOR. That's not just QOL, but probably at least $10 K a year.

And don't think for a moment Skywest WOULDN'T take that opportunity 'pour encourager les autres,' as the Frogs say, which really means to DISCOURAGE the others.

So the question isn't SHOULD the Skywest pilots have a union, they certainly should, the question is whether enough of them want to step up and potentially put their careers on the chopping block to establish one. That's a thornier question.


Tuffgong
07-07-2018, 08:33 PM
I was looking from the outside in on the Skywest TA. Being in this game/situation before personally I would have voted yes. Because here is why./

Skywest can drag their feet on the meeting.
Skywest didn’t have to agree to anything—no Union
Skywest wins over all
Meanwhile 37hr is a reality when 45 could hAve been real nice on a check.
To get 45 something has to give. That’s how things work.
The 1% increase is a slap in the face Joke.. Union fixes that

Mercyful Fate
07-08-2018, 07:25 AM
I was looking from the outside in on the Skywest TA. Being in this game/situation before personally I would have voted yes. Because here is why./

Skywest can drag their feet on the meeting.
Skywest didn’t have to agree to anything—no Union
Skywest wins over all
Meanwhile 37hr is a reality when 45 could hAve been real nice on a check.
To get 45 something has to give. That’s how things work.
The 1% increase is a slap in the face Joke.. Union fixes that


And what union group's pole are you polishing?

rickair7777
07-08-2018, 09:43 AM
Too many lifers here.
Too many “skeletons in the closets” pilots here
Too many Apathetic pilots here
Too many “That’s How We’ve always Done it” pilots here
Too many “Unions are evil” pilots here
Too many “It’s all about me” pilots here
Too many “I’m just doing my job and going home” pilots here.
Too many “I just want to get out of here” pilots here.

No union wants to have this pilot group in their midst. They are a lazy bunch which would do no good.

No, you're just tool-ishly venting your own frustration with your own misery and failings.

SKW has no union because of geography and history. Most of it's pilots historically came from the west, which is culturally not union-centric. Folks from the east grew up with unions, everybody's dad was either in a union, the mob, or both.

That combined with the fact that SKW treated folks very well for many decades set the tone of a union not being necessary.

The people at SKW are the same as at any other regional, they are not inherently evil or self-centered, although they do on average have a different cultural outlook.

Also I for one would never have commuted across the country to work for a union regional when I could drive to work at SKW... that would be insanity, no union regional is worth any significant inconvenience, there's just no ROI for that. There were three regionals (two with unions) that fit the bill, one pulled out of the west coast, I tried the other union outfit for a short time and then correctly determined that OO was a better option.

That's how we got to where we are today. Obviously things are different now...

Puck Hawg
07-09-2018, 04:45 AM
The people at SKW are the same as at any other regional, they are not inherently evil or self-centered...

Yeah. The majority of the industry begs to differ.

E6BAV8R
07-09-2018, 05:26 AM
Yeah. The majority of the industry begs to differ.

And what poll did that come from? Just because you may believe what people on APC say, they don't necessarily mirror reality or the majority.

Not nearly as much as certain people here would like you to believe. Or, like some others, just spew random crap and attempt to pass it on like an all-knowing or authoritative source of what this industry needs and believes.

rickair7777
07-09-2018, 06:21 AM
Yeah. The majority of the industry begs to differ.

I've been in the industry a long time, multiple airlines, mostly they like SKW people. A few losers do seem to come one internet forums and blame SKY for their own problems I suppose.

Why has alpa national not pushed for a "alpa first" hiring policies at their majors? Why have the various major MECs not pushed for that at the local level?

OOfff
07-09-2018, 07:33 AM
Yeah. The majority of the industry begs to differ.

Except they don’t. Nobody gives a ****

word302
07-09-2018, 01:59 PM
Yeah. The majority of the industry begs to differ.

Lol. Maybe on APC. Even here it's hard to call a majority. Just a few loud screamers.