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View Full Version : New ABX CBA?


2lowflaps
07-18-2018, 04:46 PM
Who thinks ABX will have a new CBA by the end of August of THIS year?


Jurassic Jet
07-18-2018, 05:49 PM
If they don’t, 4th quarter will be a bigger disaster than 2016.

Industry Strnd
07-18-2018, 06:08 PM
Why would they? The last ATSG earnings call they admitted bargaining in bad faith and stated "not till next year" I wonder if Amazon Prime Air "AMZN" knows that and DHL?

They also said they gave plenty of resumes? Then why can't they fill a class?


Jurassic Jet
07-18-2018, 06:17 PM
The last ATSG earnings call they admitted bargaining in bad faith and stated "not till next year" I wonder if Amazon Prime Air "AMZN" knows that and DHL

Wonder what the NMB would think if they found out the company had a target timeframe in mind and had been wasting everyone’s time delaying?

tiredofjrm
07-19-2018, 02:28 PM
Exactly. They delayed it. Not us. They need to pay full retro. That means everyone that left gets paid as well. If we don’t punish this behavior then they’ll keep doing it.
If I as a manager can save the company 30% in payroll by dragging **** out, why wouldn’t I?

2lowflaps
07-19-2018, 06:01 PM
Wonder what the NMB would think if they found out the company had a target timeframe in mind and had been wasting everyone’s time delaying?

The NMB has been made aware of this.

Jurassic Jet
07-19-2018, 06:48 PM
The NMB has been made aware of this.

Excellent. I would think the company better show up with something substantial then or risk the ire of the mediator.

Getting released under a Republican President is a long shot at best in my opinion, but Trump on the other hand is not very conventional.

Someone remind me....Trump/Bezos/AMZN are good friends right?

nitefr8dog
07-20-2018, 08:26 AM
Excellent. I would think the company better show up with something substantial then or risk the ire of the mediator.

Getting released under a Republican President is a long shot at best in my opinion, but Trump on the other hand is not very conventional.

Someone remind me....Trump/Bezos/AMZN are good friends right?
" the ire of the mediator" that is funny. They have no power at all except to say stop doing what you are doing or not doing.....until the next meeting where the company says .....you where serious about that? The NMB is a toothless dog. They only show up and monitor the company as the they say over and over ....we did not know when you said bring something to the table next time you really wanted us to work on this.

Lockheed
07-20-2018, 11:38 AM
" the ire of the mediator" that is funny. They have no power at all except to say stop doing what you are doing or not doing.....until the next meeting where the company says .....you where serious about that? The NMB is a toothless dog. They only show up and monitor the company as the they say over and over ....we did not know when you said bring something to the table next time you really wanted us to work on this.

You are wrong about the power of the mediator
they are the representative of the NMB in negotiations
If you can get your mediator to recomend to the NMB that a Proffer of Arbitration be accepted by the board - the carrier will likely be released

nitefr8dog
07-20-2018, 12:14 PM
You are wrong about the power of the mediator
they are the representative of the NMB in negotiations
If you can get your mediator to recomend to the NMB that a Proffer of Arbitration be accepted by the board - the carrier will likely be released
I wish I was....but having talked to our negotiating committee members about the mediators power on many occasions.....they are powerless

Lockheed
07-20-2018, 12:42 PM
I wish I was....but having talked to our negotiating committee members about the mediators power on many occasions.....they are powerless

my point is they are quite powerful
if they want to be

nitefr8dog
07-20-2018, 02:34 PM
my point is they are quite powerful
if they want to be
Has not been the case for ABX....as I said toothless dog.

dynap09
07-21-2018, 04:49 AM
Why wouldn't company want to drag it out? ABX pilots are flying for cheap. By the time this amends ATI might be into year 2 of their contact . Even if they have to go up x% - they'll have saved that already by having a few years past amendable date. Wasn't that in 2014? That's going to be 4 years under old rates.

But def going to to have trouble filling classes. Year 1 FO pay something like $5x / hour? To fly a 767? With a not that amazing guarantee? UPS is worse, but their year 2 FO's probably make more than year 10 ABX guys and other contract factors there are better.

NMB should release...

nitefr8dog
07-21-2018, 05:05 AM
Why wouldn't company want to drag it out? ABX pilots are flying for cheap. By the time this amends ATI might be into year 2 of their contact . Even if they have to go up x% - they'll have saved that already by having a few years past amendable date. Wasn't that in 2014? That's going to be 4 years under old rates.

But def going to to have trouble filling classes. Year 1 FO pay something like $5x / hour? To fly a 767? With a not that amazing guarantee? UPS is worse, but their year 2 FO's probably make more than year 10 ABX guys and other contract factors there are better.

NMB should release...
Toothless....

Lockheed
07-21-2018, 05:53 AM
Why wouldn't company want to drag it out? ABX pilots are flying for cheap. By the time this amends ATI might be into year 2 of their contact . Even if they have to go up x% - they'll have saved that already by having a few years past amendable date. Wasn't that in 2014? That's going to be 4 years under old rates.

But def going to to have trouble filling classes. Year 1 FO pay something like $5x / hour? To fly a 767? With a not that amazing guarantee? UPS is worse, but their year 2 FO's probably make more than year 10 ABX guys and other contract factors there are better.

NMB should release...

to my knowledge they have not filled a proffer - cant get released if you don't ask

Keepcalm
07-26-2018, 05:53 PM
to my knowledge they have not filled a proffer - cant get released if you don't ask

No matter what management says or does, a portion of the crews are manning up like proper teamsters to keep the on time performance down to a level eliminating Management's bonus and putting flying contact at risk. Funny thing is that management thinks threatening us will change this. Laughable. We need to be out of a job.... The current environment will insight good companies to pick up all of us. Crush this junk company as fast as possible!!!!

MarkThyme
07-26-2018, 07:33 PM
No matter what management says or does, a portion of the crews are manning up like proper teamsters to keep the on time performance down to a level eliminating Management's bonus and putting flying contact at risk. Funny thing is that management thinks threatening us will change this. Laughable. We need to be out of a job.... The current environment will insight good companies to pick up all of us. Crush this junk company as fast as possible!!!!

Because public bragging about illegal work actions is always a good idea.

You're an idiot.

freighthound
07-27-2018, 08:23 PM
I wish I was....but having talked to our negotiating committee members about the mediators power on many occasions.....they are powerless

You are absolutely correct. The mediator is powerless. The 3 Board members have all the power and 2 of the 3 have been sent there by their political masters to keep labor down, to maximize their donors profits.

Whitesnake
07-28-2018, 12:14 PM
my point is they are quite powerful
if they want to be

The mediator is merely a babysitter that doesn’t have the power to call the company on their bad faith bargaining. Never has.

Will the “A Team” company negotiators finally come to the table ready to participate productively for a change?

No way. It’s impossible, because they are part of
a League of Morons who have peaked professionally and have no respect or appreciation for any of us.

johnny150
07-29-2018, 08:58 AM
Follow @1224ABX on twitter for negotiations updates

sherpster
07-29-2018, 09:11 AM
They want to slowly kill abx. The more people that leave the cheaper the shutdown will be. Plain to see

nitefr8dog
07-29-2018, 03:27 PM
They want to slowly kill abx. The more people that leave the cheaper the shutdown will be. Plain to see
That would make sense except saving money has never been a priority....

Keepcalm
07-29-2018, 07:41 PM
Because public bragging about illegal work actions is always a good idea.

You're an idiot.
You're a company sympathizer. None of the actions are illegal. Just by following all the rules, every one, the on time performance goes to hell because the company and planes are so ill prepared to operate.

Reactivity
07-29-2018, 07:48 PM
They want to slowly kill abx. The more people that leave the cheaper the shutdown will be. Plain to see

Except for the continued hiring.

MarkThyme
07-30-2018, 12:27 AM
You're a company sympathizer. None of the actions are illegal. Just by following all the rules, every one, the on time performance goes to hell because the company and planes are so ill prepared to operate.

"...a portion of the crews are manning up like proper teamsters to keep the on time performance down to a level eliminating Management's bonus and putting flying contact at risk."


Yeah, see -- that's not really the way you worded it. The way you worded it, "crews are manning up...to keep the on time performance down...", it really looks like a work slowdown from where I sit. Atlas sued their pilots for something along those lines, and I don't think any of them were bragging about it in a public forum. I can feel the ABX legal team firing up their word processors for a sternly-worded letter to the union right now. But hey, you do you. I'm just going to sit back here in the peanut gallery while you self-immolate.

I might also ask why you weren't following "all the rules, every one" before this. But one thing at a time.

And did you really call me a "company sympathizer"? Wow - sick burn, dude. Completely wrong, but still, sick burn.

dynap09
08-01-2018, 08:45 AM
Actually, ABX pilots are one of the few groups who I think survived a legal challenge on a non-strike / major dispute job action.

Lots of more current legal rulings have gone against pilots including things like working to rule etc, so not sure if ABX pilots could repeat, but a neat bit of ABX history (and good lawyering at the time).

Keepcalm
08-02-2018, 12:20 AM
Yeah, see -- that's not really the way you worded it. The way you worded it, "crews are manning up...to keep the on time performance down...", it really looks like a work slowdown from where I sit. Atlas sued their pilots for something along those lines, and I don't think any of them were bragging about it in a public forum. I can feel the ABX legal team firing up their word processors for a sternly-worded letter to the union right now. But hey, you do you. I'm just going to sit back here in the peanut gallery while you self-immolate.

I might also ask why you weren't following "all the rules, every one" before this. But one thing at a time.

And did you really call me a "company sympathizer"? Wow - sick burn, dude. Completely wrong, but still, sick burn.

Eat your peanuts and wait for someone to hand you a contract then, snowflake.

nitefr8dog
08-03-2018, 02:58 AM
Eat your peanuts and wait for someone to hand you a contract then, snowflake.
MT's first post was correct...you are an idiot!

Keepcalm
08-12-2018, 06:51 PM
MT's first post was correct...you are an idiot! sorry your girl lost the election

741waskipper
08-15-2018, 02:18 AM
to my knowledge they have not filled a proffer - cant get released if you don't ask

You just do not walk in on any given Tuesday and "ask for a proffer". There are boxes that must be checked, and process to complete.

Lockheed
08-15-2018, 04:39 AM
You just do not walk in on any given Tuesday and "ask for a proffer". There are boxes that must be checked, and process to complete.

well that's true

I must have miss interpreted the prior discussion about the state of negotiations - the only real box that needs to be checked is making a viable argument that that there is no further point to continued negotiations and that arbitration or self help is the only way forward

been there ..done that

nitefr8dog
08-15-2018, 05:46 AM
sorry your girl lost the election
And....you are still an idiot

Keepcalm
08-16-2018, 04:27 AM
And....you are still an idiot
Grab a comfort puppy and a crying room. We'll take care of business for you, snowflake.

nitefr8dog
08-16-2018, 05:05 AM
Grab a comfort puppy and a crying room. We'll take care of business for you, snowflake.
Once again you sound like a 3rd grader....idiot

nitefr8dog
08-16-2018, 05:13 AM
Grab a comfort puppy and a crying room. We'll take care of business for you, snowflake.
I kind of miss your rants about illegal job actions...what happened? No guts no glory. Or is that what you are talking about taking care of business? It would not be the 1st time a crewmember was walked off the property sans his ID for posting on a public message board! Man up!

Idiot!

Keepcalm
08-20-2018, 12:43 PM
I kind of miss your rants about illegal job actions...what happened? No guts no glory. Or is that what you are talking about taking care of business? It would not be the 1st time a crewmember was walked off the property sans his ID for posting on a public message board! Man up!

Idiot! tissue and hot chocolate? Whatcha need snowflake?

motorclutch
08-20-2018, 12:46 PM
Tampon perhaps?

nitefr8dog
08-20-2018, 01:10 PM
tissue and hot chocolate? Whatcha need snowflake?
Come on...grow a pair. Tell us your next bold move! Make it interesting!
Or as I suspect all talk?

Keepcalm
08-21-2018, 07:30 AM
Tampon perhaps?
Hahahaha. Bullseye. another one sucking on the tit while the rest of us take care of business. Pathetic.

nitefr8dog
08-21-2018, 08:43 AM
Hahahaha. Bullseye. another one sucking on the tit while the rest of us take care of business. Pathetic.
Lol..yea, you are a new hire FO taking care of business...now that's funny!

nitefr8dog
08-21-2018, 08:57 AM
Hahahaha. Bullseye. another one sucking on the tit while the rest of us take care of business. Pathetic.
Still waiting......

tiredofjrm
08-21-2018, 12:43 PM
What’s the point? Other than shutting down ABX before Hete does. He’s already stated that he only wants to lease out airplanes. Not operate an airline.

nitefr8dog
08-21-2018, 01:12 PM
What’s the point? Other than shutting down ABX before Hete does. He’s already stated that he only wants to lease out airplanes. Not operate an airline.
Exactly. No matter how much people talk about "taking care of business" which is bs..Hete is going to do what he wants even if it costs ABX all their book of business so he can say..."look at the little man in the corner..I won." While every other ACMI carrier in the world is tripping on bags of money and growing. ...even with operating costs higher than ours.

forrealyall
08-21-2018, 01:52 PM
Tampon perhaps?

Hey, the ladies are just as much in this as you.

We can bring the balls too- no need to denigrate.