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atooraya
08-15-2018, 10:14 AM
fly.faa.gov no longer shows edct times for over a year now. Now a days, with airlines not posting delays until 45 minutes before a flight leaves, in the off chance ATC lightens the edct time, it looks as if all the airlines may have asked the FAA website to take their edct times down.

Definitely adds on to a very stressful day of commuting....


Skittles9E
08-15-2018, 10:18 AM
fly.faa.gov no longer shows edct times for over a year now. Now a days, with airlines not posting delays until 45 minutes before a flight leaves, in the off chance ATC lightens the edct time, it looks as if all the airlines may have asked the FAA website to take their edct times down.

Definitely adds on to a very stressful day of commuting....

Fly.faa.gov/edct has been working for me. Used it yesterday

atooraya
08-15-2018, 10:20 AM
Fly.faa.gov/edct has been working for me. Used it yesterday

I ALWAYS get:

"No EDCT information is available for the values you entered. Please check your input and try again."


echelon
08-15-2018, 01:12 PM
Definitely doesn't work for Alaska flights, at least not that I've been able to figure out. I agree, it's frustrating.

foumanchu
08-15-2018, 02:27 PM
https://www.fly.faa.gov/edct/jsp/edctLookUp.jsp

atooraya
08-15-2018, 02:56 PM
https://www.fly.faa.gov/edct/jsp/edctLookUp.jsp

Thanks man. Now that we've posted the same link in here 3 times, maybe edct times will start appearing like when you say "Beetlejuice" 3 times.

Also, AAL nor UAL flights work.

FAAFlyer
08-15-2018, 06:54 PM
It's the same reason the notam system is broke. The FAA has no incentive or plans to change the status quo.

Bengal
08-16-2018, 02:53 PM
Are you certain that youíre being given an EDCT and not some other form of traffic management initiative? Most of the TMIís on www.fly.faa.gov/ois are NOT EDCT producing TMIís.

m3113n1a1
08-16-2018, 10:15 PM
Works for me...

Name User
08-17-2018, 05:03 AM
The FAA site has never worked for me either. My airline uses SABRE and I can find online EDCTs there. Not sure about offline, but Flightaware generally has been fairly accurate.

TCASTESTOK
08-22-2018, 08:46 AM
But does flightaware take into account any flow controls or EDCTs? I know that it gets its data from the flight strips but idk if it even goes off EDCTs or just by published delays. Also yea the EDCT site is aweful. Tried both tail number, flight number, any combo I could think of and still didn't show up, even when I knew the flight had an EDCT.

grnclvrs
08-22-2018, 10:18 AM
Try using your airline's 3 letter identifier instead of the 2 letter one, or vice versa.

DXer
08-22-2018, 03:35 PM
But does flightaware take into account any flow controls or EDCTs? I know that it gets its data from the flight strips but idk if it even goes off EDCTs or just by published delays. Also yea the EDCT site is aweful. Tried both tail number, flight number, any combo I could think of and still didn't show up, even when I knew the flight had an EDCT.

I believe Flightaware receives data from the FAA SWIM feed (what's another acronym in the mix). EDCTs can be publicly withheld, which airlines likely do, as they have the ability manipulate the times. The FAA does say GA aircraft can pull up EDCTs by reg.

GrassstripflyerZSE
08-22-2018, 04:07 PM
You have to make sure you donít have any extra spaces. Sometimes you accidentally hit space when youíre done with the last item and that will not work.

TCASTESTOK
08-22-2018, 05:48 PM
Try using your airline's 3 letter identifier instead of the 2 letter one, or vice versa.
Even running it vice versa or with an N number as DXer put it, it still gives no EDCT times. You would think the EDCT times would work with at least a N number and city pair at the bare minimum even for an airline flight.

trip
08-23-2018, 07:37 AM
I haven't seen that EDCT lookup page work for some time.
What's so frustrating is the crew will be the last to know. Ops will have one time, dispatch another time, company flow board and internet yet another time. Call clearance and they say- I won't have anything until 30 prior to your proposed time! So we just sit until a pax walks out.

ReadyRsv
08-23-2018, 09:25 AM
The operators own the slots and can move them around at-will. It is in their best interest not to publish these because people will freak when ďtheirĒ slot gets traded to keep a crew legal or get a 773 in to EWR at the expense of the Q-300 from ALB.

DXer
08-23-2018, 05:01 PM
The operators own the slots and can move them around at-will. It is in their best interest not to publish these because people will freak when ďtheirĒ slot gets traded to keep a crew legal or get a 773 in to EWR at the expense of the Q-300 from ALB.

Yes, which makes the times dynamic. From an airline perspective, it is unwise to publish a time to pax, crew, ops, etc., when there is likelihood it will be adjusted.

TCASTESTOK
08-23-2018, 06:14 PM
Yes, which makes the times dynamic. From an airline perspective, it is unwise to publish a time to pax, crew, ops, etc., when there is likelihood it will be adjusted.
I think ops and the crew do need to know about it. DX and sked need to know so they can make adjustments to the release if needed and sked needs to know so that they can make sure a crew is FAR117 legal. Crew need to know also for their 117 check and to prep accordingly for the clearance time changes.

DXer
08-23-2018, 06:53 PM
I think ops and the crew do need to know about it. DX and sked need to know so they can make adjustments to the release if needed and sked needs to know so that they can make sure a crew is FAR117 legal. Crew need to know also for their 117 check and to prep accordingly for the clearance time changes.

Certainly, but we can manipulate EDCTs by hours. Route-outs, cancels, delays, slot swaps... all impact ECTS

I'll inform crews as necessary.

BoilerUP
08-23-2018, 07:17 PM
FlightAware...

4V14T0R
08-24-2018, 05:05 AM
I have only seen it work for Republic flights. Never once for another airline.


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trip
08-24-2018, 11:08 AM
I'll inform crews as necessary.


Before we're boarded or after?

ReadyRsv
08-24-2018, 06:53 PM
Most majors have a computer program to display edct times in house.

TCASTESTOK
08-25-2018, 05:05 PM
Before we're boarded or after?
it would be a prudent move NOT to board pax til we get closer to our EDCT. Rather have customers in the gate than stuck on the plane.

saxman66
08-26-2018, 09:50 AM
it would be a prudent move NOT to board pax til we get closer to our EDCT. Rather have customers in the gate than stuck on the plane.

I think he was referring to that us crew are the last to find out in that we board up not knowing, and then they slap an EDCT on us when we call for push or taxi. Sure, I try to be proactive and ask ahead of time, but sometimes you get busy and don't ask. Then you have to decide if you should wait it out with people on board. It's always opposite too. If you deplane, they move the EDCT up and you miss it. If you sit out there, they go into a ground stop, effectively cancelling the EDCT.

ReadyRsv
08-26-2018, 09:56 AM
Sure, I try to be proactive and ask ahead of time, but sometimes you get busy and don't ask.

Sounds like you need to find out if you have an EDCT before you board.

DECISION TREE:
Should I Board? Y/N [TASK: FIND OUT IF THERE IS AN EDCT]
Is there an EDCT Y=No N=Yes

:)

Honestly, ask the gate agent.

4V14T0R
08-26-2018, 03:31 PM
Sounds like you need to find out if you have an EDCT before you board.



DECISION TREE:

Should I Board? Y/N [TASK: FIND OUT IF THERE IS AN EDCT]

Is there an EDCT Y=No N=Yes



:)



Honestly, ask the gate agent.



The gate agent knows less the we do half the time.


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ReadyRsv
08-27-2018, 09:14 AM
The gate agent knows less the we do half the time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I guess this mystery is too hard to solve. :rolleyes:

If you are flying for a major, someone knows the EDCT times. I'm sure that asking someone in your company (LCA) how it works will yield results. At United the info is located in SHARES or by calling DX. I'm sure AA and DAL have similar systems. Using your company's public facing app or an internet tool would be the last place I would look.

Have you also considered that remaining at the gate could cause issues as well? Some airports have the gates booked to the minute, so even with a 1hr delay they want you off. Lots of variables.

trip
08-27-2018, 09:18 AM
someone knows the EDCT times

The whole point of this thread ;) Someone knows, just not you, also that time "someone" knows will most likely change, you will not know. Just hope pray it's not go home day.

ReadyRsv
08-27-2018, 10:23 AM
The whole point of this thread ;) Someone knows, just not you, also that time "someone" knows will most likely change, you will not know. Just hope pray it's not go home day.

My point is that this is not a mystery. And you CAN be informed and it's quite easy to be informed. Anyone out of the loop on this stuff is by their own volition.

I wanted to know how it works and now I do, it took 5 minutes. At United the ATC desk controls EDCT times. If we want to know first, we tell DX and they ACARS us as soon as the change is made or even when it might get changed. If we want to look it up we can go into SHARES or just ask ANY gate agent to do it.

Mystery solved. Roll credits!

4V14T0R
08-27-2018, 10:49 AM
I guess this mystery is too hard to solve. :rolleyes:




Because thatís what I said. [emoji849]

DX can be very inattentive at times and the gate agents are always or donít care to be in the loop.

Thatís great you have a method of finding the info for yourself on a UA flight. I donít have that.

I commute, it would be nice to be able to check other airlinesí EDCTs.



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ReadyRsv
08-27-2018, 01:33 PM
Because thatís what I said. [emoji849]

DX can be very inattentive at times and the gate agents are always or donít care to be in the loop.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not a chest-thumper at work but if the gate agent won't give me info or the DX doesn't want to share his info then we don't board the aircraft. If you are a Captain (capital C) then you have this authority. I cannot, for the life of me, fathom taking no for an answer when asking a gate agent for information regarding my flight. Be the boss, you earned it.

4V14T0R
08-27-2018, 01:50 PM
I'm not a chest-thumper at work but if the gate agent won't give me info or the DX doesn't want to share his info then we don't board the aircraft. If you are a Captain (capital C) then you have this authority. I cannot, for the life of me, fathom taking no for an answer when asking a gate agent for information regarding my flight. Be the boss, you earned it.



I get what youíre saying. I guess there are just some things I would prefer to monitor myself instead of asking. It would be very easy for me to pull it up on my phone. I can pull up the flights at my airline, thatís not the problem. The problem is other airlines.


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DXer
08-30-2018, 03:24 PM
I'm not a chest-thumper at work but if the gate agent won't give me info or the DX doesn't want to share his info then we don't board the aircraft. If you are a Captain (capital C) then you have this authority. I cannot, for the life of me, fathom taking no for an answer when asking a gate agent for information regarding my flight. Be the boss, you earned it.

Why would your DX not want to share an EDCT? I'm curious and that was not rhetorical.

While we don't publish delays until close to departure due to potential slot swaps, I don't withhold information willingly. Unfortunately for all of us, the ATC world is extremely unpredictable.

TCASTESTOK
08-31-2018, 01:35 PM
Why would your DX not want to share an EDCT? I'm curious and that was not rhetorical.

While we don't publish delays until close to departure due to potential slot swaps, I don't withhold information willingly. Unfortunately for all of us, the ATC world is extremely unpredictable.
Its not that they might not want it, its that they might be too busy to get you an EDCT time at the moment. They might be dealing with an emergency, diversion, mx call, or a myriad of other issues.

DXer
08-31-2018, 06:02 PM
Its not that they might not want it, its that they might be too busy to get you an EDCT time at the moment. They might be dealing with an emergency, diversion, mx call, or a myriad of other issues.

I was asking from the DX side of it, but you're right.

TCASTESTOK
08-31-2018, 07:34 PM
DXer do you guys code and publish your own delays or do your sector/duty managers take care of that for ya? By that I mean if you coded it as an ATC EDCT then the crew could in theory lookup the new flight departure time on a gate or crew room terminal or even on their airlines phone app is the delay is published.

DXer
08-31-2018, 08:00 PM
DXer do you guys code and publish your own delays or do your sector/duty managers take care of that for ya? By that I mean if you coded it as an ATC EDCT then the crew could in theory lookup the new flight departure time on a gate or crew room terminal or even on their airlines phone app is the delay is published.

Neither. We have ATC guys manage all the delay programs, by title they are sector managers, I guess. I can request improvements or delays that will be communicated to ATC through them. The crew can look up the EDCT along with the station, though I stress they are fluid.

I will publish my own delay if I think the times are insufficient.

TCASTESTOK
09-01-2018, 08:56 AM
Neither. We have ATC guys manage all the delay programs, by title they are sector managers, I guess. I can request improvements or delays that will be communicated to ATC through them. The crew can look up the EDCT along with the station, though I stress they are fluid.

I will publish my own delay if I think the times are insufficient.
So you can manage your own Sabre Plotters or whatever you use or are they more read only with edits allowed for managers and sups?

DXer
09-01-2018, 03:41 PM
So you can manage your own Sabre Plotters or whatever you use or are they more read only with edits allowed for managers and sups?

Read only. I will put in requests for improvements or delays as necessary with our ATC folks. It's easier for all of us to maintain a single point of contact than me calling the tower, TRACON, TMU, or adjusting wheels up times. It could be hundreds of flights between mainline and connection carriers caught in a single GDP or AFP and I do not have the system-wide picture.

TCASTESTOK
09-01-2018, 04:21 PM
Read only. I will put in requests for improvements or delays as necessary with our ATC folks. It's easier for all of us to maintain a single point of contact than me calling the tower, TRACON, TMU, or adjusting wheels up times. It could be hundreds of flights between mainline and connection carriers caught in a single GDP or AFP and I do not have the system-wide picture.
Its good that its read only. I know some places the DXers have to work their own plots and code their delays in while also planning/releasing and following flights. If they get busy tho they can usually get a sup to code their plots for them.

DXer
09-01-2018, 05:10 PM
Its good that its read only. I know some places the DXers have to work their own plots and code their delays in while also planning/releasing and following flights. If they get busy tho they can usually get a sup to code their plots for them.

I couldn't imagine doing that on my own. Both for my workload and not having the ability to swap slots when there are potential route-outs, delays, or network cancellations.

I couldn't care less about delay codes. I remind stations to pin the delay on me when necessary

TCASTESTOK
09-01-2018, 06:14 PM
I couldn't imagine doing that on my own. Both for my workload and not having the ability to swap slots when there are potential route-outs, delays, or network cancellations.

I couldn't care less about delay codes. I remind stations to pin the delay on me when necessary
Yea but you dont want too many delays. When your status lights on multiple flights start going to yellow then to red, GET HELP!! Or you will be stuck playing catch up.

DXer
09-01-2018, 06:38 PM
Yea but you dont want too many delays. When your status lights on multiple flights start going to yellow then to red, GET HELP!! Or you will be stuck playing catch up.

Nothing changes here. No colors. I take of flights in the air first.

TCASTESTOK
09-01-2018, 07:12 PM
Nothing changes here. No colors. I take of flights in the air first.
Your software doesn't have status lights?

DXer
09-04-2018, 08:31 AM
Your software doesn't have status lights?

I don't have any software for EDCTs from the dispatch side. I get the times through a rather basic, but effective manner, and request changes if necessary.

TCASTESTOK
09-04-2018, 04:18 PM
By status lights I mean like for keeping up on status of tasks. Sabre runs it this way.
https://i.gyazo.com/f82b993dbb9ff7403e8701756da10ace.png
As for EDCT times you should be able to see the very latest ones for any of your flights in the plotter but it depends how the airline configures it.

TheFly
09-05-2018, 09:23 AM
Using the FAAís Website, what format will it accept? SKW/OO, AA/AAL, WN/SWA, etc?

ReadyRsv
09-05-2018, 09:35 AM
Why would your DX not want to share an EDCT? I'm curious and that was not rhetorical.

While we don't publish delays until close to departure due to potential slot swaps, I don't withhold information willingly. Unfortunately for all of us, the ATC world is extremely unpredictable.

I was asking this same question. The poster in a few posts mentioned being ignored by ATC, DX, gate agents, et al. I feel for his pax.

TCASTESTOK
09-05-2018, 12:05 PM
I was asking this same question. The poster in a few posts mentioned being ignored by ATC, DX, gate agents, et al. I feel for his pax.
Its not that he's being ignored by DX its just that its kinda on the low priority side of things. DXers have to plan, release, and monitor their flights. While there might be a lul in between releases where they have time to get an EDCT, there could be other times where they are pumping out releases and maybe dealing with issues that other flights experience such as MX issues or emergencies/diversions.


Using the FAAís Website, what format will it accept? SKW/OO, AA/AAL, WN/SWA, etc?
Even if you try it either format it will not give a result.

IDIOTPILOT
09-05-2018, 01:07 PM
Using the FAAís Website, what format will it accept? SKW/OO, AA/AAL, WN/SWA, etc?

It has to be 3 letter code. But, as has been covered already, some carriers block the information.

TrojanCMH
09-05-2018, 01:32 PM
I get what youíre saying. I guess there are just some things I would prefer to monitor myself instead of asking. It would be very easy for me to pull it up on my phone. I can pull up the flights at my airline, thatís not the problem. The problem is other airlines.


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I donít know why Republicís always worked. I was ex republic and I used the site all the time. Maybe itís because they didnít have an ATC desk and they never swapped slots. Maybe it was because the mainline partners controlled their slots? At Spirit we need to ask ATC or dispatch. I got to meet the guys at the ATC desk at Spirit and they swap stuff around like crazy when there are delays going. Lots of variables from crews timing out to the number of missed connections go into them swapping slots. They donít want crews staying at the hotel or passengers sitting at their hotels longer because the FAA website said there was an edct time.


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ReadyRsv
09-05-2018, 04:19 PM
Its not that he's being ignored by DX its just that its kinda on the low priority side of things. DXers have to plan, release, and monitor their flights. While there might be a lul in between releases where they have time to get an EDCT, there could be other times where they are pumping out releases and maybe dealing with issues that other flights experience such as MX issues or emergencies/diversions.



Lol.............. No info, no boarding.

TCASTESTOK
09-05-2018, 05:19 PM
Lol.............. No info, no boarding.
Uhh a delays a delay, Im not gonna be looking up EDCT times while dealing with a medical but the DXer that takes your flight while i deal with the emergency maybe will have time. That or call ATC and ask em directly.

IDIOTPILOT
09-05-2018, 05:37 PM
Uhh a delays a delay, Im not gonna be looking up EDCT times while dealing with a medical but the DXer that takes your flight while i deal with the emergency maybe will have time. That or call ATC and ask em directly.

Local controllers donít get the information until 30 prior. Most planes, boarding has to start before that to be on time. Unless you want us all to call the national command center individually.

TCASTESTOK
09-06-2018, 03:11 PM
Local controllers donít get the information until 30 prior. Most planes, boarding has to start before that to be on time. Unless you want us all to call the national command center individually.
No I don't want you to call ATCSCC individually. However if you get an EDCT then technically you will be departing late regardless.

4V14T0R
09-06-2018, 03:23 PM
No I don't want you to call ATCSCC individually. However if you get an EDCT then technically you will be departing late regardless.



So start boarding find out you have a 2 hour EDCT. Deplane. Customer service goes out the window I guess. [emoji57]


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IDIOTPILOT
09-06-2018, 04:08 PM
No I don't want you to call ATCSCC individually. However if you get an EDCT then technically you will be departing late regardless.

If you have passengers needing special assistance like aisle or wheelchairs, you canít just easily deplane them once you find out about the delay.

Pilots donít get paid to sit at the gate with passengers onboard. FA contracts maybe written the same way in a lot of cases.

Connecting passengers and commuting crew members also have options. Itís easier to research and change options from the terminal.

ReadyRsv
09-06-2018, 04:29 PM
TCASTESTOK proving my point for me.

Captain's job is to make the call when to board, until he has his info... The music stops.

(I UNDERSTAND that it may be POSSIBLE for a DX to have an emergency, and will speak with someone else. This scenario happens rarely so I expect to get info when requested)

DXer
09-07-2018, 04:40 PM
By status lights I mean like for keeping up on status of tasks. Sabre runs it this way.
https://i.gyazo.com/f82b993dbb9ff7403e8701756da10ace.png
As for EDCT times you should be able to see the very latest ones for any of your flights in the plotter but it depends how the airline configures it.

I see. We run our own proprietary software to keep track of flights. Delays are incorporated in it, but we will receive EDCTs through a variety of other means. The only 'task' that appears is when all payload information is in and you should push the button for a release.

DXer
09-07-2018, 04:57 PM
Lol.............. No info, no boarding.

I get it. The problem is the length of time it takes for information to be handed down. For example: 90 minutes before departure, ATC, myself, and our coordinators are made aware of a proposed ground delay. Nothing is official so nothing is done. 30 minutes later, there is a telcon with stakeholders and facilities telling us there will be a GDP. Info then will be rates, facilities, duration, potential route outs, etc. 15 minutes later it is official. After that, it takes our ATC guys a while to flush out good times, swap slots, delay flights, work with FAR117 limited guys, and whatever. Now it is time to go, you're boarded up, and boom... One hour delay.

If I know all of this before you board, I'll tell ops to not board and pin a delay on me if that is what it takes. Usually, I'll get a call from the crew about the delay and relay information via ACARS if/when I have it.

And like other's have implied... a plane in the air is much more important to me than one on the ground. I try to pass along info when I can.

TCASTESTOK
09-11-2018, 05:59 AM
TCASTESTOK proving my point for me.

Captain's job is to make the call when to board, until he has his info... The music stops.

(I UNDERSTAND that it may be POSSIBLE for a DX to have an emergency, and will speak with someone else. This scenario happens rarely so I expect to get info when requested)
Actually some airlines do AUTO-boarding to get a D:0 time UNLESS the crew tells the gate agent NOT to board.


Lol.............. No info, no boarding.
Well I mean if you have a chance you could get on the clearance freq since you 99% of the time are on ground power and just quickly ask "[airport] clearance {airline XXX}.
{airport} clearance.
Yea do we have an EDCT for our flight?
(usually clearance will be happy to give you that info if they have it.
From there it will help give you more info to decide whether to board or not.

ReadyRsv
09-11-2018, 10:25 AM
RE: Autoboarding. I am aware of autoboarding. If I don't want to board, I tell them not to. It's a simple concept.

RE: Clearance freq. Yes, I know how to call clearance, I am not an idiot. I am talking about more than 30 minutes out.

This is all very simple airline 101 stuff here. Not getting what you need and allowing it to happen is captain stuff. Doing your job and making sure you get what you need is Captain stuff. Anyone doing the little c captain stuff is not helping their crew or pax or company.

No info. No go go.