Airline Pilot Forums

Airline Pilot Forums was designed to be a community where working airline pilots can share ideas and information about the aviation field. In the forum you will find information about major and regional airline carriers, career training, interview and job seeker help, finance, and living the airline pilot lifestyle.




View Full Version : Swa etops?


Stratoclimber
09-21-2018, 06:52 AM
Is there any way to track SWA's ETOPS progress for Hawaii? Or do we just have to wait for a press release from the company?


sMFer
09-21-2018, 07:02 AM
No. Yes.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

Tippy
10-24-2018, 04:17 PM
Had a SWA guy stop up front the other day to say hi while jumpseating and we got to chatting and he mentioned that the ETOPS process was dead in the water. Any clout to this? just curious is all.


ROFF
10-24-2018, 06:07 PM
Sounds like he's in the know.

WHACKMASTER
10-24-2018, 06:17 PM
Is there any way to track SWA's ETOPS progress for Hawaii? Or do we just have to wait for a press release from the company?

Hahaha. Grab a snickers bar.....

e6bpilot
10-24-2018, 06:22 PM
It is moving along. Itís going to happen soon. Too much money and momentum at this point. LAX ETOPS base opening delayed a month. Nothing to see here.

4thLevel
10-24-2018, 11:33 PM
Had a SWA guy stop up front the other day to say hi while jumpseating and we got to chatting and he mentioned that the ETOPS process was dead in the water. Any clout to this? just curious is all.

No.

I have no idea why some dudes seem to be hoping this fails - the rumors are out of control.

It will happen when the Feds allow it, and no, it won't go perfectly.

Latest best guess is January. They are coordinating the six required proving runs with the Feds now. The holidays coming up aren't helping with that, but once they're done, we should be good to go.

CaptainDooley
11-24-2018, 08:32 AM
Good friend of mine is involved with getting ETOPS for another airline. He said that he was told by FAA contact that SWA did not pass the table-tops portion of getting ETOPS.
Now the question would be , how long does the FAA make them wait until they can try again.

ETOPS certification comes out of the Washington DC office, not your airlines's local FISDO, so having the long time connections and good relations doesn't help help you.

I also talked with a CA at ATI when I was jumpseating on them. He was involved with their process of getting ETOPS. He said the FAA fails a lot of airlines on their first try of going through the table-top exercise.

French3Holer
11-24-2018, 08:50 AM
https://media.giphy.com/media/pUeXcg80cO8I8/giphy.gif

e6bpilot
11-24-2018, 09:17 AM
My best friendís sisterís boyfriendís brotherís girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid whoís going with a girl who saw Southwest pass-out at 31 Flavors last night. I guess itís pretty serious.

captjns
11-24-2018, 09:44 AM
Good friend of mine is involved with getting ETOPS for another airline. He said that he was told by FAA contact that SWA did not pass the table-tops portion of getting ETOPS.
Now the question would be , how long does the FAA make them wait until they can try again.

ETOPS certification comes out of the Washington DC office, not your airlines's local FISDO, so having the long time connections and good relations doesn't help help you.

I also talked with a CA at ATI when I was jumpseating on them. He was involved with their process of getting ETOPS. He said the FAA fails a lot of airlines on their first try of going through the table-top exercise.


Some would throw the BS card on the pedestal. But can you beleive I heard the same news from, a reliable source, the Circle K cashier... He wouldn’t lie... he’s also the store manager.

sailingfun
11-24-2018, 10:58 AM
Some would throw the BS card on the pedestal. But can you beleive I heard the same news from, a reliable source, the Circle K cashier... He wouldnít lie... heís also the store manager.

I suspect that if the FAA and SWA have issues with Etops itís going to be about time. ETOPS takes time because a certified mechanic has to run a ETOPS check and sign off the log book. Some individual required checks can be time consuming. I have no doubt SWA is trying to compress that because they donít want 90 minute turns.

WhaleSurfing
11-24-2018, 11:04 AM
My best friendís sisterís boyfriendís brotherís girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid whoís going with a girl who saw Southwest pass-out at 31 Flavors last night. I guess itís pretty serious.

EXACTLY!!!

As a previous poster stated, the approval comes from DC. So this guy knows a guy who knows someone in DC. BS!!

Smooth at FL450
11-24-2018, 03:59 PM
I suspect that if the FAA and SWA have issues with Etops itís going to be about time. ETOPS takes time because a certified mechanic has to run a ETOPS check and sign off the log book. Some individual required checks can be time consuming. I have no doubt SWA is trying to compress that because they donít want 90 minute turns.

SWA has addressed this by planning to operate all westbound crossings as originators. Iím guessing they wonít have a choice but take the long turn on the return eastbound unless they plan to have an airplane sitting idle until late in the morning.

Klsytakesit
11-24-2018, 06:36 PM
I suspect that if the FAA and SWA have issues with Etops itís going to be about time. ETOPS takes time because a certified mechanic has to run a ETOPS check and sign off the log book. Some individual required checks can be time consuming. I have no doubt SWA is trying to compress that because they donít want 90 minute turns.
Where do you get 90 mins. We hand off the logbook during deplaning. They have it back in 30-40 minutes.

THEKERNALKLINK
11-25-2018, 09:09 AM
Where do you get 90 mins. We hand off the logbook during deplaning. They have it back in 30-40 minutes.

Whether it's a 30 or 90 minute process, how can this be done at nearly half a dozen SoCal aiports that are NOT bases for the company?

Is it kosher for the plane to get it's blessing at LAS or OAK, perform a flight or two, then right after perform ETOPS?

I have 100% confidence that we're gold as far as the 10 table top tests that require an aircraft actually in the air with a full crew and passengers.

IF we're having a problem, and that's a big IF, it is on paper, a logistical / coordination concern.

Smooth at FL450
11-25-2018, 09:48 AM
Whether it's a 30 or 90 minute process, how can this be done at nearly half a dozen SoCal aiports that are NOT bases for the company?

Is it kosher for the plane to get it's blessing at LAS or OAK, perform a flight or two, then right after perform ETOPS?

I have 100% confidence that we're gold as far as the 10 table top tests that require an aircraft actually in the air with a full crew and passengers.

IF we're having a problem, and that's a big IF, it is on paper, a logistical / coordination concern.

My understanding is no, the FAA will not allow that. Thatís why etops legs will likely be originators. And we have or will have company maintenance at the mainland departure airports. SJC, SMF and SAN all were awarded etops manintenance spots almost a year ago...not sure when that will go into effect. Who does the etops checks in Hawaii is a point of contention, but currently is allowed by AMFAs contract.

MasterOfPuppets
11-25-2018, 10:13 AM
Is it kosher for the plane to get it's blessing at LAS or OAK, perform a flight or two, then right after perform ETOPS?



No. The ETOPS check has to be completed no earlier than 3 hours prior to the scheduled departure of the flight on the ETOPS leg. If delayed more than 4 hours for a MX reason you need a new ETOPS check. If you return to the gate for a MX reason and don't leave within 4 hours you need a new ETOPS check.

ETOPS checks a pretty comprehensive and would not be accomplished in less than an hour. Southwest quick turns to and from the islands will not be possible.

MasterOfPuppets
11-25-2018, 10:14 AM
Where do you get 90 mins. We hand off the logbook during deplaning. They have it back in 30-40 minutes.

You aren't going to complete an ETOPS check in less than an hour. Also keep in mind that ETOPS MELs are significantly more restrictive. Things that could normally be deferred can not for an ETOPS flight. So if an ETOPS bird comes in from DEN and the crew writes up an item that affects ETOPS it will either need to be fixed or another aircraft will need to be found. Southwest would be smart to build in buffers for repairs.

CaptainDooley
11-25-2018, 11:43 AM
EXACTLY!!!

As a previous poster stated, the approval comes from DC. So this guy knows a guy who knows someone in DC. BS!!

did you read the post above?, I said ETOPS comes from the office in DC.

for the record, "the guy" is good friends with the the guy that runs the FAA ETOPS office in DC. So I think he knows a little more than your brother's sister's friend......

CaptainDooley
11-25-2018, 11:50 AM
I have 100% confidence that we're gold as far as the 10 table top tests that require an aircraft actually in the air with a full crew and passengers.



this and some of the above comments shows that you don't know much about the certification process or how ETOPS works.

table-tops and proving runs are different things
plus, you are not going to do them with PAX, since one will be a divert and the FAA will not tell you which one.

not saying you will not get ETOPS, just that it is not as easy as you think. Didn't your Company say they would have flights by Dec 2018? now there is silence, doesn't that tell you something?

e6bpilot
11-25-2018, 12:00 PM
this and some of the above comments shows that you don't know much about the certification process or how ETOPS works.



table-tops and proving runs are different things

plus, you are not going to do them with PAX, since one will be a divert and the FAA will not tell you which one.



not saying you will not get ETOPS, just that it is not as easy as you think. Didn't your Company say they would have flights by Dec 2018? now there is silence, doesn't that tell you something?



No, they said they would sell tickets in 2018. Will that happen? Mmm...not sure, but the groundwork has all been laid and they have already said they will spool up the flights within weeks of getting approval.
Right now, OAK is still on for a Feb ETOPS bid as far as anyone knows.
All I am saying is that ďmy friend heard from a guyĒ is probably not the best way to spread conjecture about something that you or anyone else posting here knows nothing about.
I am not defending the SWA ďmoon shotĒ method of doing things, I am just saying that I highly doubt any of the information that you are spreading as fact is true. Are things running behind? Decidedly so. Will we get there soon? Almost certainly.
I really donít think Southwest is going to be any earth shattering presence in the market anyway. They will dump some capacity in there are then pull back where it doesnít make money. Then they will announce the next thing a few months later. As far as I can tell, it is another move to weaken Alaska's market share on the west coast.

WhaleSurfing
11-25-2018, 12:18 PM
Dooley,

You sound like a worried Alaska pilot. For the record I was involved with an ETOPS certification in a previous life. I do know a guy, not just his third cousin once removed.

CaptainDooley
11-25-2018, 05:38 PM
No, they said they would sell tickets in 2018.

well maybe they don't tell you everything. When the execs came to Hawaii a few months ago they told the press the first revenue flights would be by the end of Dec and then ramp up in early 2019 not just sell tickets. By the way, they can't legally sell tickets until they have the ETOPS certification.

All I'm saying, that timeline is not happening. Do a search of SWA and Hawaii, you will see that they have been silent and not telling the press anything. Don't you think if they were close they would be getting that out in the media?

Also, getting ETOPS is not just a flt ops thing, the Mx side is a big part of it and your mechanics union doesn't seem like they are in a very cooperative mode right now.

....and I don't work for Alaska, lol
I actually want SWA to get into the Hawaii market, then fares will come down

at6d
11-25-2018, 06:19 PM
well maybe they don't tell you everything. When the execs came to Hawaii a few months ago they told the press the first revenue flights would be by the end of Dec and then ramp up in early 2019 not just sell tickets. By the way, they can't legally sell tickets until they have the ETOPS certification.

All I'm saying, that timeline is not happening. Do a search of SWA and Hawaii, you will see that they have been silent and not telling the press anything. Don't you think if they were close they would be getting that out in the media?

Also, getting ETOPS is not just a flt ops thing, the Mx side is a big part of it and your mechanics union doesn't seem like they are in a very cooperative mode right now.

....and I don't work for Alaska, lol
I actually want SWA to get into the Hawaii market, then fares will come down

Itís just a matter of time.

JetDoc
11-25-2018, 07:38 PM
I have no idea where some of you are getting the idea an ETOPS service check takes an hour or you need 90 minute turns. It literally consists of walk around, logbook review, verifying O2, hydraulic and APU oil levels and an engine oil service with each engine being serviced by a separate ETOPS qualified mechanic. If the fluid and O2 levels are good it would take 10 minutes tops. If everything needed to be topped off, a half hour max. Now ETOPS engine checks are a different animal which are completed with much less frequency but are way more in-depth and usually takes 3 people about 4 hours to complete. These checks are done one engine at a time at different intervals (never both at the same time) and are usually completed during an overnight at a station with ETOPS mechanics. The notion of needing an hour or more before an ETOPS departure is simply false.

Nutz
11-26-2018, 11:29 AM
I have no idea where some of you are getting the idea an ETOPS service check takes an hour or you need 90 minute turns. It literally consists of walk around, logbook review, verifying O2, hydraulic and APU oil levels and an engine oil service with each engine being serviced by a separate ETOPS qualified mechanic. If the fluid and O2 levels are good it would take 10 minutes tops. If everything needed to be topped off, a half hour max. Now ETOPS engine checks are a different animal which are completed with much less frequency but are way more in-depth and usually takes 3 people about 4 hours to complete. These checks are done one engine at a time at different intervals (never both at the same time) and are usually completed during an overnight at a station with ETOPS mechanics. The notion of needing an hour or more before an ETOPS departure is simply false.

Your facts and your reasonable application of your past experience and knowledge have no place here. Good day sir.

sMFer
11-26-2018, 01:31 PM
I have no idea where some of you are getting the idea an ETOPS service check takes an hour or you need 90 minute turns. It literally consists of walk around, logbook review, verifying O2, hydraulic and APU oil levels and an engine oil service with each engine being serviced by a separate ETOPS qualified mechanic. If the fluid and O2 levels are good it would take 10 minutes tops. If everything needed to be topped off, a half hour max. Now ETOPS engine checks are a different animal which are completed with much less frequency but are way more in-depth and usually takes 3 people about 4 hours to complete. These checks are done one engine at a time at different intervals (never both at the same time) and are usually completed during an overnight at a station with ETOPS mechanics. The notion of needing an hour or more before an ETOPS departure is simply false.Sir..common sense and not pulling things outta your arse are not welcome here.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

sMFer
11-26-2018, 01:39 PM
Not really sure why people are having such a hard time with this. It simply is taking longer than we anticipated. If an ETOPS check will take longer, the schedules will be adjusted once the plane touches down in Hawaii. And we will fly a leg to any of the launch cities with a valid ETOPS check, unload, load up and go, all within the allotted time for that check.

The company jumped the gun with the early announcement and are paying for it with PR issues. This will all pass. We'll get certification and 3-6 months from we'll be heading west(er).

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

Scoop
11-26-2018, 01:49 PM
Some guys like making a mountain out of a molehill. SWA will get past the ETOPs hurdle and will be soon flying to the islands. Whether that's one month or two, who cares. Turns will take a little longer but that will be factored in.

It may be ETOPS, but it ain't quite rocket surgery. :D

Aloha - Scoop

sailingfun
11-26-2018, 04:35 PM
I have no idea where some of you are getting the idea an ETOPS service check takes an hour or you need 90 minute turns. It literally consists of walk around, logbook review, verifying O2, hydraulic and APU oil levels and an engine oil service with each engine being serviced by a separate ETOPS qualified mechanic. If the fluid and O2 levels are good it would take 10 minutes tops. If everything needed to be topped off, a half hour max. Now ETOPS engine checks are a different animal which are completed with much less frequency but are way more in-depth and usually takes 3 people about 4 hours to complete. These checks are done one engine at a time at different intervals (never both at the same time) and are usually completed during an overnight at a station with ETOPS mechanics. The notion of needing an hour or more before an ETOPS departure is simply false.

It also normally involves checks of any standby generators. I donít know what the ETOPS 737ís have but on a A330 or 767 itís a HMU type unit. It requires the a hydraulic system to be pressurized and generally takes 10 minutes to complete. Servicing APU oil also takes time getting a stand ect.. Unless you were to put a team of mechanics on the aircraft it all takes time.

THEKERNALKLINK
11-26-2018, 05:53 PM
this and some of the above comments shows that you don't know much about the certification process or how ETOPS works.

table-tops and proving runs are different things
plus, you are not going to do them with PAX, since one will be a divert and the FAA will not tell you which one.

not saying you will not get ETOPS, just that it is not as easy as you think. Didn't your Company say they would have flights by Dec 2018? now there is silence, doesn't that tell you something?

Their is a lot I don't know, but I love to learn. I appreciate all the input on here actually. If their are set backs, I see them as opportunities to be better. It's really exciting to see us moving forward and into new territory. (imagine me doing a cartwheel singling "LUV LUV LUV" :o)

From what I read on the FAA website, 10 of the table top scenarios were conducted with real flights. Perhaps full of volunteers? Employees, or non revs from other airlines?

ZapBrannigan
11-26-2018, 05:58 PM
It also normally involves checks of any standby generators. I donít know what the ETOPS 737ís have but on a A330 or 767 itís a HMU type unit. It requires the a hydraulic system to be pressurized and generally takes 10 minutes to complete. Servicing APU oil also takes time getting a stand ect.. Unless you were to put a team of mechanics on the aircraft it all takes time.



737 wasnít designed for ETOPS. No standby generators, no HMU, no RAT, only a single crossfeed valve. Iíve heard that Alaska runs the APU all the way to Hawaii just in case they need its generator.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

THEKERNALKLINK
11-26-2018, 05:59 PM
Their is a lot I don't know, but I love to learn. I appreciate all the input on here actually. If their are set backs, I see them as opportunities to be better. It's really exciting to see us moving forward and into new territory. (imagine me doing a cartwheel singling "LUV LUV LUV" :o)

From what I read on the FAA website, 10 of the table top scenarios were conducted with real flights. Perhaps full of volunteers? Employees, or non revs from other airlines?

By the way, how long will the layovers be in Hawaii. I'd rather poke my own eyes out than sit around in a hotel for days for 2 bucks per hour. After you've seen the sights for the 10th time, the charm wears off. I like being at home.

squall line
11-26-2018, 06:47 PM
Alaska does not do that.

RJSAviator76
11-26-2018, 07:46 PM
The standby generator requirement on 737 is met by keeping the APU running. I'm pretty sure we will be required to keep APU running until back in non-ETOPS environment i.e. 60 minutes from ETOPS alternate. Once we demonstrate the ability and reliability for a period of time, we may be able to petition the FAA to waive that restriction. That's why Alaska doesn't fly with APU on.

I could totally see us turning the APU off before taxi and keeping it off until ETOPS entry, and then have APU not start necessitating an air return.

Another required check is the crossfeed valve check prior to landing and being put in the logbook. That's something that tends to be easily missed as well.

I'm just hoping we don't reinvent the wheel too badly. :o

kingairfun
11-26-2018, 08:01 PM
Only thing the pilots need to know about ETOPS is to use your company frequency when chit chatting about your layover...

everyone gets the hint eventually... The best part about going HF/CPDLC is not having to listen to radio chatter for 5 hours

JetDoc
11-27-2018, 09:40 AM
It also normally involves checks of any standby generators. I don’t know what the ETOPS 737’s have but on a A330 or 767 it’s a HMU type unit. It requires the a hydraulic system to be pressurized and generally takes 10 minutes to complete. Servicing APU oil also takes time getting a stand ect.. Unless you were to put a team of mechanics on the aircraft it all takes time.

HMU checks are done on the ETOPS overnight checks, not on an ETOPS service check prior to an ETOPS departure and in this case the point is moot because the 737 does not have one. 737 APU oil can be serviced in less than 5 minutes by a properly prepared AMT who would have pre-staged the necessary equipment. An ETOPS service check must be accomplished by 2 mechanics at a minimum. By definition, a team.

WhaleSurfing
11-27-2018, 10:20 AM
Only thing the pilots need to know about ETOPS is to use your company frequency when chit chatting about your layover...

everyone gets the hint eventually... The best part about going HF/CPDLC is not having to listen to radio chatter for 5 hours

Oh there's still a bunch of idiot pilots chatting on air-to-air about toys, stocks and their layovers. If only they would just talk on their own company freq.

RJSAviator76
11-27-2018, 02:35 PM
Oh there's still a bunch of idiot pilots chatting on air-to-air about toys, stocks and their layovers. If only they would just talk on their own company freq.

My favorite people on tracks are United and Delta pilots letting everyone know that they encountered a ripple.... 'scuse me... moderate chop. :D

jumppilot
11-28-2018, 11:50 AM
ETOPS checks a pretty comprehensive and would not be accomplished in less than an hour. Southwest quick turns to and from the islands will not be possible.

UAL does GUM-Japan ETOPS turns with about an hour on the ground in Japan. From the time we block in until having our maintenance release is about 30 minutes.

Perhaps 30 minute turns won't happen but having an hour on the ground is plenty for our operation.

HalinTexas
12-01-2018, 07:19 PM
Whether it takes 90 or 10 minutes for a PDSC is immaterial. What the FAA says it will take is what counts. No official table-tops have occurred.

APU will be running from engines start to EXP. OPS SPEC for APU reliability is expensive and might come later.

We strictly are following what the two principle ACs say in the matter of ETOPS certification. We are neither under nor over doing it.

We have rather difficult Feds to deal with. Not to mention we are at the end of the year and scheduling Fed time is difficult.

Tech Ops has the most difficult job.

Klsytakesit
12-01-2018, 08:11 PM
Took us 7 years to get the APUOD program and it is expensive. Alaska claims it is worth it but it cant be much more than break even. Best part of it is the APUís are so well maintained that we never see APU inop melís

joepilot
12-03-2018, 04:05 AM
Took us 7 years to get the APUOD program and it is expensive. Alaska claims it is worth it but it cant be much more than break even. Best part of it is the APUís are so well maintained that we never see APU inop melís

I don't know what the full hourly costs (to include maintenance and overhaul) of the 737 APU are, but the full cost is probably in the area of double the fuel cost.

The biggest cost of the continuously running APU is for flights that routinely depart at max structural gross weight. Then you have to reduce payload (pax) by the weight of the APU fuel burn planned. Call it 1? 2? pax kicked off for each hour of planned APU operation. Depending on ticket prices, this can add up fast.

Joe

HalinTexas
12-03-2018, 08:26 AM
Planned burn for ETOPS is about 350 lbs. total. (Straight from the flight plan)

One turn back and burn off to get below MLW would very cost prohibitive.

Planned icing encounter, which must be accounted for in planning, can be more than fuel burn.

The APU Ops Spec, is very expensive because the aircraft that are to be designated have to be continuously monitored and managed. That is, they have to be routinely started inflight while domestic. Record-keeping for and the management of ETOPS aircraft is the difficult part, by far. One mistake can be extremely costly even if no one is hurt or aircraft is damaged.

MAX performance much better than the NG and there only 28 or so to be used.

at6d
12-03-2018, 08:28 AM
SWA is going to pursue ETOPS despite naysayers. Sorry.

IAHB756
12-03-2018, 09:39 AM
We have APU on demand at UAL and we operate over 350 737s. Really not all that hard to track. From time to time, we get a message asking for a reliability start enroute on a domestic leg. We cold start it when conditions are met and send a code and it gets logged appropriately. Easily accomplished. We send the MAX-9 to HNL occasionally but I've never flown anything to the islands but the NG (and of course the 757-300 and 767-400 years ago)

PNWFlyer
12-03-2018, 03:00 PM
SWA is going to pursue ETOPS despite naysayers. Sorry.

Sorry? No is saying you not pursuing it. We are just wondering when you are ever going to get it.

News flash, you were suppose to be selling tickets by now.

I for one can't wait to hear cowboys on HF.. :"YeeHaw, This is Souwest737, we runn'in a little late, request block 320-360 direct HNL"

ROFF
12-03-2018, 03:28 PM
They will be using CPDLC

So it's unlikely you'll hear requests for anything on the HF

But if you ask nice I'll give you a Yee haw on 10048.

Ass

PNWFlyer
12-03-2018, 03:32 PM
They will be using CPDLC

So it's unlikely you'll hear requests for anything on the HF

But if you ask nice I'll give you a Yee haw on 10048.

Ass

Thanks, I had no idea CPDLC worked 100% of time. Oh wait, it doesn't

Signed,
Someone who actually flies ETOPS.

Peacock
12-03-2018, 03:47 PM
Thanks, I had no idea CPDLC worked 100% of time. Oh wait, it doesn't

Signed,
Someone who actually flies ETOPS.

Whoa, looks like weíve got a badass over here. Hey everyone, this guy flies over water. Heís kind of a big deal.

ROFF
12-03-2018, 03:47 PM
You're a bigger man than I

IAHB756
12-03-2018, 03:54 PM
Warning, thread drift.... your Maxís have SATLINK? Our 737s (except Guam based birds) are HF across the Pacific from California. Lucky you! Although most of my Hawaii flying is conducting PAC quals so we would have to make HF reports anyway. Iím hoping our MAXs start showing up with SATphone/link like the rest of the fleet (except the poor airbus)

Cosa Nostra
12-03-2018, 05:01 PM
Thanks, I had no idea CPDLC worked 100% of time. Oh wait, it doesn't

Signed,
Someone who actually flies ETOPS.


Aren't you a new hire at Alaska?? :confused:

Smooth at FL450
12-03-2018, 05:08 PM
Sorry? No is saying you not pursuing it. We are just wondering when you are ever going to get it.

News flash, you were suppose to be selling tickets by now.

I for one can't wait to hear cowboys on HF.. :"YeeHaw, This is Souwest737, we runn'in a little late, request block 320-360 direct HNL"




lol...don't worry about when we start selling tickets. Worry about how you're going to compete with our network that's not dependent on regionals flying our passengers.



Oh and when was the last time you heard a radio call like that? Embellish much?

at6d
12-03-2018, 05:25 PM
Iím going to make my calls like that from now on! ďShepherd to lost sheep, ya gotcha ears on?Ē

Smooth at FL450
12-03-2018, 05:31 PM
Iím going to make my calls like that from now on! ďShepherd to lost sheep, ya gotcha ears on?Ē

Me too, especially going into PDX and SEA. Gotta keep up this reputation! But Iím OAK based so I may need to work ďhellaĒ in there somewhere

sMFer
12-03-2018, 05:35 PM
Thanks, I had no idea CPDLC worked 100% of time. Oh wait, it doesn't



Signed,

Someone who actually flies ETOPS.



Someoneís butthurt. Couldnít get an interview here? Donít lose sleep about when the FAA will give approval to move ahead...trust me, youíll definitely know and feel it when we start routes to Hawaii.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

at6d
12-03-2018, 05:42 PM
Dang yall! Yuntashirtcut? Aight. Fixing to ask. Can we go dierec to sea-attle?

PNWFlyer
12-03-2018, 06:03 PM
Well, were waiting.

Didn't mean it to sound like I know everything, but you all have been talking for a year about how your are going to to do this and so far nothing. Yeah, we have really smart people working on this... Ok, lets see it.

What's the hold up?

My point was flying ETOPS isn't hard, but getting an ETOPS Cert, like Pimp'in, ain't easy.

Oh, and Alaska asked me if I applied to SWA because I had a 737 type, I said no. Why would I want to commute? No, I am not a new hire. Next question.


https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/epicrapbattlesofhistory/images/d/d6/Well..._We%27re_Waiting.png/revision/latest?cb=20131216171523

PNWFlyer
12-03-2018, 06:05 PM
https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/major/1907-swa-etops.html

See you have been here before...

Peacock
12-03-2018, 06:08 PM
Well, were waiting.

Didn't mean it to sound like I know everything, but you all have been talking for a year about how your are going to to do this and so far nothing. Yeah, we have really smart people working on this... Ok, lets see it.

What's the hold up?

My point was flying ETOPS isn't hard, but getting an ETOPS Cert, like Pimp'in, ain't easy.

Oh, and Alaska asked me if I applied to SWA because I had a 737 type, I said no. Why would I want to commute? No, I am not a new hire. Next question.


https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/epicrapbattlesofhistory/images/d/d6/Well..._We%27re_Waiting.png/revision/latest?cb=20131216171523
I was hoping you could tell us what the hold up is. You obviously know a lot about ETOPS. How long did it take you to get Alaska certified? Please teach us the magic of flying over water.

ZapBrannigan
12-03-2018, 06:41 PM
Do you fellas need to borrow a ruler?

Because this isnít your religion or your favorite football team. Itís just a job. As long as the paychecks keep cashing I could not care less who the winners and losers are. I also donít think one pilot is superior to another based on the logo on their wings. Itís all luck and timing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Caveman
12-03-2018, 07:23 PM
No, I am not a new hire. Next question.

I started class in Feb, flying in May, SEA base. Got a line in December. They shut training down in the summer usually, so you get stuck. If you start first class after summer you are only on reserve a few months.

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/2704052-post145.html

Guys, this guy has been around the block, 8 tough months worth of experience....ain't no joke. It would be best to defer to the wisdom and experiences he has to offer.

dawgdriver
12-03-2018, 08:23 PM
Do you fellas need to borrow a ruler?

Because this isnít your religion or your favorite football team. Itís just a job. As long as the paychecks keep cashing I could not care less who the winners and losers are. I also donít think one pilot is superior to another based on the logo on their wings. Itís all luck and timing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

^^^^this^^^^^

Smooth at FL450
12-03-2018, 09:03 PM
Well, were waiting.

Didn't mean it to sound like I know everything, but you all have been talking for a year about how your are going to to do this and so far nothing. Yeah, we have really smart people working on this... Ok, lets see it.

What's the hold up?

My point was flying ETOPS isn't hard, but getting an ETOPS Cert, like Pimp'in, ain't easy.

Oh, and Alaska asked me if I applied to SWA because I had a 737 type, I said no. Why would I want to commute? No, I am not a new hire. Next question.


https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/epicrapbattlesofhistory/images/d/d6/Well..._We%27re_Waiting.png/revision/latest?cb=20131216171523


You started class in Feb? You're on probation? You're a new hire...


WE (pilots) couldn't care less when we start flying to hawaii, and WE haven't made any announcements. That's up to management to run the business. We just fly the planes.



You should worry more about your lack of scope than anything else.

ROFF
12-03-2018, 09:35 PM
Ouch!!

Thatís gotta hurt.

e6bpilot
12-04-2018, 07:49 AM
Do you fellas need to borrow a ruler?

Because this isnít your religion or your favorite football team. Itís just a job. As long as the paychecks keep cashing I could not care less who the winners and losers are. I also donít think one pilot is superior to another based on the logo on their wings. Itís all luck and timing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Yes!!
Best post of this sad thread.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

ipdanno
12-04-2018, 02:45 PM
..... I for one can't wait to hear cowboys on HF.. :"YeeHaw, This is Souwest737, we runn'in a little late, request block 320-360 direct HNL"

Thing is, we’re so hot, if we asked like that, we’d get it. True story.

hoover
12-04-2018, 03:43 PM
Do you fellas need to borrow a ruler?

Because this isnít your religion or your favorite football team. Itís just a job. As long as the paychecks keep cashing I could not care less who the winners and losers are. I also donít think one pilot is superior to another based on the logo on their wings. Itís all luck and timing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I might need to borrow a yard stick

full of luv
12-04-2018, 06:23 PM
I might need to borrow a yard stick

Just turn it sideways....

sMFer
12-04-2018, 06:35 PM
Just turn it sideways....Zing!!!!

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

MudhammedCJ
12-04-2018, 07:51 PM
https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/2704052-post145.html

Guys, this guy has been around the block, 8 tough months worth of experience....ain't no joke. It would be best to defer to the wisdom and experiences he has to offer.
That shut ol' junior up... 🤣

hoover
12-05-2018, 04:33 PM
Just turn it sideways....

That was pretty good

PNWFlyer
12-07-2018, 08:22 PM
https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/2704052-post145.html

Guys, this guy has been around the block, 8 tough months worth of experience....ain't no joke. It would be best to defer to the wisdom and experiences he has to offer.

Yeah, started in February... of what year though? He was asking how long you would be on reserve.


Still no ETOPS?

RJSAviator76
12-07-2018, 09:10 PM
Yeah, started in February... of what year though? He was asking how long you would be on reserve.


Still no ETOPS?



Seriously kid... go troll the regional forums.

Skyward
12-07-2018, 09:19 PM
Yeah, started in February... of what year though? He was asking how long you would be on reserve.


Still no ETOPS?

Correct. Still no ETOPS. Relax...youíll be able to buy your ticket soon enough.

Burton78
12-07-2018, 09:21 PM
Yeah, started in February... of what year though? He was asking how long you would be on reserve.


Still no ETOPS?



Still no SCOPE?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

sMFer
12-07-2018, 11:07 PM
Still no SCOPE?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Zinnnnnnnng. Hey, at least all the RJís that get added in Alaska paint canít make it to Hawaii!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Smooth at FL450
12-08-2018, 04:53 AM
Yeah, started in February... of what year though? He was asking how long you would be on reserve.


Still no ETOPS?


Ask yourself this question: which offers a pilot more career stability, ETOPS or SCOPE? I'll tell you which one helps me sleep at night...

sMFer
12-08-2018, 07:51 AM
Yeah, started in February... of what year though? He was asking how long you would be on reserve.


Still no ETOPS?Try it sometime...it's very refreshing. 4046

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

Peacock
12-08-2018, 08:03 AM
PNWís obsession is likely motivated by fear

Galaxy5
12-08-2018, 08:15 AM
Yeah, started in February... of what year though? He was asking how long you would be on reserve.


Still no ETOPS?

2017......

RJSAviator76
12-08-2018, 08:42 AM
PNWís obsession is likely motivated by fear

I know some very fine people working at Alaska/Virgin. They have a tough interview process, and virtually everyone I know at Alaska/Virgin is a class act. How PNWFlyer got through their interview process is a mystery to me, but one thing is certain - not only does he not represent the values of Alaska/Virgin pilot group, he's the proverbial bad apple that's actually making them look bad.

Zard
12-08-2018, 11:28 AM
I know some very fine people working at Alaska/Virgin. They have a tough interview process, and virtually everyone I know at Alaska/Virgin is a class act. How PNWFlyer got through their interview process is a mystery to me, but one thing is certain - not only does he not represent the values of Alaska/Virgin pilot group, he's the proverbial bad apple that's actually making them look bad.


Oh, thatís a Bingo!

Skyward
12-08-2018, 07:32 PM
I know some very fine people working at Alaska/Virgin. They have a tough interview process, and virtually everyone I know at Alaska/Virgin is a class act. How PNWFlyer got through their interview process is a mystery to me, but one thing is certain - not only does he not represent the values of Alaska/Virgin pilot group, he's the proverbial bad apple that's actually making them look bad.

Yep. I know some great people over there.

PNWFlyer
12-08-2018, 08:57 PM
2017......

And how does that equal 8 moths? Now I know why you don't have ETOPS.

Skyward
12-08-2018, 09:05 PM
And how does that equal 8 moths? Now I know why you don't have ETOPS.

Whatís a moth? Is that a probie thing?

Galaxy5
12-08-2018, 09:16 PM
And how does that equal 8 moths? Now I know why you don't have ETOPS.

It doesnít.

That wasnít for you, Quick Draw, that was for the folks saying youíre on probation.

Ready, fire, aim.

Planes R Great
12-09-2018, 05:34 PM
Warning, thread drift.... your Max’s have SATLINK? Our 737s (except Guam based birds) are HF across the Pacific from California. Lucky you! Although most of my Hawaii flying is conducting PAC quals so we would have to make HF reports anyway. I’m hoping our MAXs start showing up with SATphone/link like the rest of the fleet (except the poor airbus)

Yes. The ETOPs -800's do too. As well as some of the -700s. The -700s were inherited from other airlines.

Caveman
12-09-2018, 05:38 PM
Can you make Check FO in 18 months at Alaska?



Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1