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View Full Version : Another Medical Question


Skyrider12
10-13-2018, 06:37 PM
Hey Everyone! Long time lurker and first time poster here. I'm looking for some advice and figured I should finally make an account and ask it here.
A little backstory: I'm 26 and hold a private cert. and am working on my instrument and commercial. It has taken me some time and I work construction and pay for everything myself. I currently hold a 1st class medical and am healthy etc.
However, my past is pretty bad.
I have had like 10 tickets since I was 15 ranging from just stupid (skateboarding on a sidewalk) to irresponsible (speeding/not wearing a seatbelt.)
In 2011 my license was suspended for too many points. In 2013 I was driving a motorcycle and pot on me and got charged with that.

Luckily, I got a lawyer and beat the rap. No convictions etc.
I joined AOPA and got a consultation with one of their lawyers, who said I don't need to list anything, we all make mistakes etc. That was amazing to hear, but I'm still skeptical regarding the wording of 18v on the medical app.
Before you all crucify me, I totally accept what i did and have learned and grown as a person. I love flying and am a very safe pilot and person now. I know it's hard to get on with a major and that probably won't happen to me but, I do want to fly professionally in some facet of the aviation industry.

So basically, I did not check yes on 18v. My attorney told me not to. In my situation the marijuana charges etc do not affect me at all. It's the suspended drivers license ironically.
He said that didn't matter as it was points, not alcohol or drugs that got my license suspended. However the wording seems pretty clear in that it asks for ALL convictions.

So, what do you guys think? If i check yes and write them an explanation of what happened will they be OK with that and issue me a medical that day? Should I listen to my attorney? If they find out will the pull my certs? If they look into my past could they pull my certs? I may be overly worried, but I did pay for all this myself and love flying more than anything. I want to do the right thing here, and not have to live worried about this. Any advice would be greatly appreciated and sorry for the long post. Thanks!!!!


rickair7777
10-17-2018, 03:42 PM
Get a new attorney, with aviation experience, and talk to him BEFORE you do ANYTHING with the FAA or AME.

18(v) You have to report DL suspensions. You don't get to try to read the intent or spirit of the question, you only get to comply. I think whatever infraction put you over the top on points has to be reported.

18(w) you have to report non-traffic convictions. If you beat the pot rap, then you can check no on this.


The good news is that this is pretty minor, so I think you have a good chance of getting away with no penalties if you correct the record before the FAA finds out. I'm pretty sure they do check NDR and FBI database when you renew your medical, that's the risk, they see a suspension that you didn't report.

Again, get a better attorney IMO. Or at least a second opinion, there may even be case law that says a points suspension doesn't count.

Also... if you want a good major airline job, keep your nose 100% clean from here on out, not even a speeding ticket until you get your major airline job. They can forgive youthful indiscretion, but DO NOT give them a recent data point that hints nothing has changed since then.

jDSTJD
10-19-2018, 08:44 AM
Get a new attorney, with aviation experience, and talk to him BEFORE you do ANYTHING with the FAA or AME.

18(v) You have to report DL suspensions. You don't get to try to read the intent or spirit of the question, you only get to comply. I think whatever infraction put you over the top on points has to be reported.

18(w) you have to report non-traffic convictions. If you beat the pot rap, then you can check no on this.


The good news is that this is pretty minor, so I think you have a good chance of getting away with no penalties if you correct the record before the FAA finds out. I'm pretty sure they do check NDR and FBI database when you renew your medical, that's the risk, they see a suspension that you didn't report.

Again, get a better attorney IMO. Or at least a second opinion, there may even be case law that says a points suspension doesn't count.

Also... if you want a good major airline job, keep your nose 100% clean from here on out, not even a speeding ticket until you get your major airline job. They can forgive youthful indiscretion, but DO NOT give them a recent data point that hints nothing has changed since then.

Definitely would agree with the two bolded points above. You may have been giving a general restatement of your discussion with your lawyer but if that’s the gist of it, then he/she seems to have possibly grossly oversimplified a very complex legal issue.


Skyrider12
10-21-2018, 07:20 PM
Thank you guys so much for the replies. For some reason, I could not see the post for a couple days and thought a moderator blocked my account or something. That was weird....i just logged in and saw the thread was active.

Anyway thanks so much. Honestly that is what I was thinking in that my lawyer way oversimplified this.

So I'll fess up. I have no marijuana conviction, just the suspended drivers license. I'll check yes on 18v.on my next medical, which I will try and get next week.

With all that being said about my past etc. you guys really think I'll be OK if I am a 100% perfect citizen from hear on out? I am working on other facets of my life (good credit/volunteer work etc) to try and balance things out a bit.

Also, when I go and get my medical, do you guys think I'll be OK if I check yes, and write a brief explanation /apology of why I didn't check yes before? Could I still get a medical that day??

rickair7777
10-22-2018, 07:00 AM
Thank you guys so much for the replies. For some reason, I could not see the post for a couple days and thought a moderator blocked my account or something. That was weird....i just logged in and saw the thread was active.

Some new user's first few posts have to be approved by a moderator before they are visible, and nobody had noticed your posts right away. Looks like the system is now letting you post without pre-approval.



With all that being said about my past etc. you guys really think I'll be OK if I am a 100% perfect citizen from hear on out? I am working on other facets of my life (good credit/volunteer work etc) to try and balance things out a bit.

The airlines will probably never ask or know about the marijuana thing (be honest if they do, that kind of thing is not unusual for young people).

The ten tickets could be a problem, but I assume you were very young when that happened? Again that sort of pattern is common, people who have zero speeding tickets as kids typically become accountants or history teachers, not pilots. But ten is a lot, so you'll need to maintain an ABSOLUTELY clean driving (and of course criminal) record from here on out. Ten years from now that will be mostly ancient history, but ONLY if there are ZERO additional data points linking your past to the present.... they will want to see that you've turned over a new leaf, and they won't want to see anything that might make them doubt that assessment. Seriously you need to drive the speed limit in town, no more than five-over on the freeway until you get to your career-destination airline job. After that, you can buy a duacti or a maserati if you want.

Keep in mind one or two majors might disqualify you based on the tickets, but I think most would consider you after time has passed.



So I'll fess up. I have no marijuana conviction, just the suspended drivers license. I'll check yes on 18v.on my next medical, which I will try and get next week.

Also, when I go and get my medical, do you guys think I'll be OK if I check yes, and write a brief explanation /apology of why I didn't check yes before? Could I still get a medical that day??

Maybe. I personally would contact an aviation lawyer with experience in this kind of thing first, he might tell you to exactly what you're thinking of. I suspect the FAA would let it slide, but there are potential criminal sanctions for omissions on the medical application, they are pretty hot on that topic right now. You can read about some pilots on the extreme end of that spectrum who are going to prison for lying on their medical app:

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/pilot-health/116448-faa-looking-va-records-indictments.html

Whale Driver
10-22-2018, 12:41 PM
.................................................. .........I'll check yes on 18v.on my next medical, which I will try and get next week.

With all that being said about my past etc. you guys really think I'll be OK if I am a 100% perfect citizen from hear on out? ………………………………...

STOP STOP!!!!!!! First do what rick said. Get an Aviation Lawyer BEFORE you get your next medical.

Consult here first https://www.aviationmedicine.com/ If they can't answer, they will refer you to the best.

As for the second part, if you do that you will have no problem, even with the big 5.

Skyrider12
10-24-2018, 09:32 PM
Thanks so much for the replies, everyone.

I guess that's what must have happened regarding my initial post. At first I thought a moderator flagged my account or something but that makes sense. I'm just glad to be able to post here and get this type of info/advice.

I won't do anything until consulting a better attorney. That link looks perfect! I'll give them a call and do the phone consultation...seriously that is exactly what i was trying to find. Every lawyer I searched seemed to be either not very knowledgeable of my specific predicament or out of business etc.

I'll call them next week (on payday) and see what they say....and truly, thank you guys for the advice. I feel way better about my situation. I mean it still sucks but I did think it would be a lot worse or a possible career ender.

I'll let you guys know what they say and what ends up happening.
Thanks and fly safe !

Skyrider12
12-28-2018, 07:45 PM
Hey everyone hope you all had a great Christmas.
I just wanted to post a follow up regarding my situation.

I finally consulted with an AMAS doctor and my situation does not look too bright according to him.
Basically i would need to go through HIMS and have a psych eval done.
He also stated I may need monitoring for x amount of time to get a SI medical.

I didnt think it would be that bad considering that the charge for marijuana was dropped and it occurred 8 years ago. However if that is what it takes that is what Ill do.

I have read numerous threads regarding HIMS and psych evals etc but wanted to ask anyone here who has done it what to expect. I know it will be thousands of dollars and a hurry up and wait type thing.....but what about the tests themselves?
If i fail a particular test, do they just deny me and thats it? What are the cog tests like? I know this has been discussed numerous times here but still.....the thought of going in there and being faced with some crazy tests is daunting. Or is it more of a sit down and chat with a psychiatrist?

Im gonna start taking my vitamins and dowload luminosity or similar and start practicing hahaha
Thanks again and Happy Holidays

tomgoodman
12-28-2018, 07:51 PM
This is a good introduction to the HIMS program:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahy4zPItw4E

Skyrider12
12-28-2018, 08:08 PM
This is a good introduction to the HIMS program:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahy4zPItw4E


Thank you!